[man_of_steel]

Originally Posted by sandeepmohan

What is OBC, SC/ST?

Government reservations based on Caste. OBC - Other Backward Classes, SC/ST - Scheduled Caste/Scheduled Tribe. This 'safeguard of local manufacturers' thing is on the same lines!

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by sammyboy

I havent ridden the 390 but the Ninja can do the numbers you mention. It reaches the 150- 155 mark pretty quickly and then things take a while but I have seen the 165-170 figure for a few fleeting seconds (the 170 was downhill by the way and only once)

The thing about the Ninja is that its extremely stable at those speeds, the wind protection is very good if you crouch a bit and you can do good speeds without feeling the strain of the wind hitting you squarely on the chest. Even otherwise, you only realize the speeds you are at once you look at the speedo.

It handles cross winds very well and is rock solid in terms of handling.

Thank you for those valuable firsthand inputs on the Ninjette bro. Appreciate it.

So its stable. How are the brakes? Is the suspension good for Indian conditions? Heard the front seals go (though not as regularly as the KTMs)?

Also a mechanic gave me an inside tip that the transverse plate of the swingarm (where the lower end of the monoshock is mounted) is relatively weak and tends to bend/buckle if the bike is jumped/hits bad potholes/overloaded/generally abused?

How strong are the alloys? Any reports of the alloys bending / breaking (ala the KTMs)?

And lastly, how flickable is the Ninja? I know you've not ridden the KTM, but for me the KTM is THE benchmark on this score, and I enjoy and value that attribute a lot.

@Niranjan would be the perfect guy to answer all of these queries as he owns both the Ninja as wel as the KTM.

[man_of_steel]

Originally Posted by ebonho

And lastly, how flickable is the Ninja? I know you've not ridden the KTM, but for me the KTM is THE benchmark on this score, and I enjoy and value that attribute a lot.

Aditya (n_aditya) was there for the 390 track day at MMSC. I remember him praising the unbelievable flickability of the KTM after he took it for a spin. So I guess he found it to be far more flickable than the 250R.

Also, another long term 250R owner and a friend has once commented that he didn't like the light front-end (read flickable nature) of the 390 and its NEVER the bike for him!

How are the brakes?

The 250R's brakes are still the benchmark in Our country! I have heard that not even the 300's are as good.

[Urban_Nomad]

Originally Posted by basuroy

It is not so much a safeguard as it is a massive headache .

Over 800cc , no homologation required - import , register , ride .

But that begs the question why different procedures based on engine cc. What convoluted logic requires homologation for bikes of a certain cc only?

[sandeepmohan]

Originally Posted by ebonho

And lastly, how flickable is the Ninja? I know you've not ridden the KTM, but for me the KTM is THE benchmark on this score, and I enjoy and value that attribute a lot.

After reading this I feel you want to continue with a new/used motorcycle with handling characteristics of a KTM. I feel your 390 can serve this.

A good upgrade for you, leaving aside what a KTM can do, would be the Kawasaki 650.

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by sandeepmohan

After reading this I feel you want to continue with a new/used motorcycle with handling characteristics of a KTM. I feel your 390 can serve this.

A good upgrade for you, leaving aside what a KTM can do, would be the Kawasaki 650.

Performance-wise, the 390 would be similar to the 250. The 250 would be a very different bike in every other way. So the 250.

At barely 20-30k over the Duke, this is more an exchange/swap upgrade that a full blown upgrade. Necessitated by the fact that there is currently no bike in the market which I would like to upgrade to - as a brand new purchase. And my current boredom.

At close to 2.5 lacs over the Duke, a used 650 would no longer be a swap. 2.5 lacs is not small change as 20-30k is.

Which would then tie my hands 2 years down the line when I want to make the real jump - at a time there would (hopefully) be a bike I would want to jump to - brand new.

[sandeepmohan]

Originally Posted by ebonho

And my current boredom.

Not that you maybe interested in this motorcycle at all. Have you tried the new and cheapest Harley Davidson? I believe there is nothing HD about it.

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by sandeepmohan

Not that you maybe interested in this motorcycle at all. Have you tried the new and cheapest Harley Davidson? I believe there is nothing HD about it.

The Street? No bro. Not what I am looking for in a bike currently at least. Not ready to kick out and relax yet. Yes the engine is supposedly better, for a Harley, but then at 5 lacs for a motor that does 160 or thereabouts, I can get a bike which does the same at more than 3 times less (a used N250r or D390) or one that blows everything else out of the water with 50 kmph more at the top end at 1.5 lacs less (a clean used N650r). And from all indications its pretty "petite". And I am the opposite of that ....

[man_of_steel]

Doc, whats your opinion about the N650? I have'nt ridden it yet. But heard it is pretty bulky(obviously) and dull natured(both in the hurried-ness of acceleration and handling) in comparison with the nature of the KTMs.. Yea, I am asking you to tell me if Apples are better than Oranges or vice versa.

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by man_of_steel

Doc, whats your opinion about the N650? I have'nt ridden it yet. But heard it is pretty bulky(obviously) and dull natured(both in the hurried-ness of acceleration and handling) in comparison with the nature of the KTMs.. Yea, I am asking you to tell me if Apples are better than Oranges or vice versa.

I've ridden it only twice - two different bikes, both times around 5 odd kms max, in city, in traffic (not that that has ever held me back from exploring what a bike can do ).

I liked the old 650 more than the new one.

I think the stock exhaust sounds great.

Its a big heavy bike, and feels it.

The legs and knees fit beautifully while gripping the tank (which is substantial).

The riding position is pretty relaxed and upright. Though even at 6 feet tall you do slightly stretch forward.

The fact that there is a long fixed snout ahead of the handles takes some getting used to for a naked bike rider. As does the fact that the RVMs are kilometers away from you.

The bike has a nice meaty thunk to the first gear. Very bike bike jerk you get.

While the gear lever is funny (it pivots ahead of your foot and is directe backwards) it is not noticeable at all while riding.

The bike is big and heavy - did I already say that? Cannot throw it around or manhandle it - at least I could not in the 5 kms I rode both. Maybe with more kms .....

The bike does not feel as glued to the road as the Duke does. I don't though if its the suspension springing/valving or just the fact that this bike is tyre challenged - stock.

The seat real estate is humungous and Indian buttock friendly.

The acceleration is NOT docile. Oodles of torque. You quickly need to readjst your internal speed motion sensors as the bike effotlessly gobbles ground. You are doing over 100 before you realise it - faster than on the 390 from what I can remember. But yes, it does it efortlessly without screaming and shouting from the rooftops about it. Hence the unhurried/docile perception. But the eyes do not lie. Neither does the fact that all of a sudden you are finding things coming at you much faster than before to the extent your reaction time needs to adjust. That can only come from a genuinely very quick bike.

Did not find anything wrong with the brakes. But then I never went any higher than 120 odd so that cannot be a good barometer of stopping power.

This bike will be an efortless high speed long distance mile muncher. Two up comfort included. Easy fittability of luggage included.

I am still not convinced though about how much fun it would be for spirited riding in the twisties or even the rough stuff.

It feels to big and too heavy (especially "top" heavy - maybe the humungous high bulgy tank has something to do with this rider perception) to really do well at either of the above - again, the Dukes being the Gold Standard (for me at least).

[man_of_steel]

Originally Posted by ebonho

Its a big heavy bike, and feels it.

The legs and knees fit beautifully while gripping the tank (which is substantial).

The riding position is pretty relaxed and upright.

The fact that there is a long fixed snout ahead of the handles takes some getting used to for a naked bike rider. As does the fact that the RVMs are kilometers away from you.

The seat real estate is humungous and Indian buttock friendly.

Had sat on it a couple of times and felt the exact same!

The acceleration is NOT docile. Oodles of torque. You quickly need to readjst your internal speed motion sensors as the bike effotlessly gobbles ground. You are doing over 100 before you realise it - faster than on the 390 from what I can remember. But yes, it does it efortlessly without screaming and shouting from the rooftops about it. Hence the unhurried/docile perception. But the eyes do not lie. Neither does the fact that all of a sudden you are finding things coming at you much faster than before to the extent your reaction time needs to adjust. That can only come from a genuinely very quick bike.

THAT was what I wanted to confirm. However I found the seating position a bit too cruiser-ish laid back! Another reason why it blinds us from that exact high speed we are doing will be that tall windscreen. Its bliss.

Thanks for the detailed writeup doc.

[ebonho]

Questions to the pros and experts here - please jump in with detailed pros and cons, and your personal take and advice.

Single owner, sub 10,000 km, 2011 Ninja 250R, for 1,50,000

OR

Single owner, sub 5,000 km, 2011 Ninja 650R, for 3,50,000

[man_of_steel]

Originally Posted by ebonho

Questions to the pros and experts here

None of the above, but that 650 seems to be a nice deal! How is the condition? True that it was standing still for most of these years, only around 1.2k kms / year! But if it was well kept it will be a nice deal and may be that battery needs a replacement if it is not yet replaced!

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by man_of_steel

None of the above, but that 650 seems to be a nice deal! How is the condition? True that it was standing still for most of these years, only around 1.2k kms / year! But if it was well kept it will be a nice deal and may be that battery needs a replacement if it is not yet replaced!

Both are very clean bikes. Showroom mint condition.

Nothing replaced yet on either bike.

Original tyres, battery, chain sprocket, clutch, brake pads.

Only thing is I have seen 2012 Ninja 650s going for as low as 3-3.2 lacs here (one of them with frame sliders as well), so don't think 3.5 lacs for a 2011, even less run, is that great of a deal.

Its one thing buying a discontinued model for 1.5 lacs. Whole different ball game doing the same with another discontinued model at 3.5 lacs.

[ashkamath]

Originally Posted by ebonho

Questions to the pros and experts here - please jump in with detailed pros and cons, and your personal take and advice.

Single owner, sub 10,000 km, 2011 Ninja 250R, for 1,50,000

OR

Single owner, sub 5,000 km, 2011 Ninja 650R, for 3,50,000

N250 is delayed gratification while N650 is instant gratification.
Which ever you buy, it will serve you no more than 2 to 3 years by the time you will start itching for more.
After riding 200 all the while the rush on N250 will be marginal compared to that of N650. So for extra 2 lakh you get lot of Vrooom (also read adrenaline) both in your head and under your pants.
Maintenance not much to speak as both are relatively spanking new with low mileage. For the next 10K-15K or say an year or two you wouldn't need to spend much.
Discontinued model either 250 or 650 wouldn't matter much as there will always be someone who is looking for an affordable upgrade. So your money is safe in both models. Newer models will be way out of reach for most aspirants. Maintain your bike well and a decent return is assured
For your height and weight and stance 650 will do more justice than 250.
Instead of smaller steps take a leap of faith
And finally just go by your gut feeling. Your instincts can never lead you wrong. Ride safe