[swift_guy]

Originally Posted by Jag4

Hello all, I own a 2012 Hyundai i20 Crdi sportz model which has been running on Hella Red grills since Day 1. After about 4 years of usage, the Airbag Warning light came up on the dash recently. The horns run on the stock wiring with the stock relay.

Now I wanted to confirm if anybody else has ever faced a similar issue in their cars since there are a lot of Airbag equipped variants of every vehicle these days.

Firstly, you should have changed to better wiring with an additional relay.

Secondly, won't this be covered under warranty?

What I would have done if I was you :
Removed red grills and changed back to stock ones (without any visible signs of the change), went to another Hyundai service centre and asked them to check the problem (of airbag light). They will tell you that the sensor has gone kaput and will replace it under warranty. Then changed to red grills with additional wiring and relay.

I haven't heard of anything like this and I think dealership people are fleecing you as they found one modification in your car. This gives them a reason to charge that 2k directly from you. But since airbag is inside horn pad, this may be true. Experts can correct if I am wrong.

[Akib Khan]

Even i faced the airbag issue after i fitted Minda Trumpets. The clock spring got kaput and they said its because of aftermarket horns as the company provides one single horn and as i had installed a pair of horns it damaged the clock spring.

[harry10]

Originally Posted by Akib Khan

Even i faced the airbag issue after i fitted Minda Trumpets. The clock spring got kaput and they said its because of aftermarket horns as the company provides one single horn and as i had installed a pair of horns it damaged the clock spring.

That's interesting. I have installed Minda trumpets around 6 months back and they are working fine till now without any airbag or other issues. I am quite interested in knowing how it can happen. Did they gave full explanation of how it happened?

[Akib Khan]

Originally Posted by harry10

That's interesting. I have installed Minda trumpets around 6 months back and they are working fine till now without any airbag or other issues. I am quite interested in knowing how it can happen. Did they gave full explanation of how it happened?

Previously i had installed the horn 2 days after getting the car from the showroom and that horn worked for 3 years without any glitch. This issue cropped up when i installed a new set of the same horn. They told me to either put back the stock horn or use the Minda horn with a seperate switch as the horn wiring is not able to take the added load of two horns. I got the block spring replaced but still use the horn from the steering pad and touchwood its working perfectly.

[Jag4]

Originally Posted by swift_guy

Firstly, you should have changed to better wiring with an additional relay.

Secondly, won't this be covered under warranty?

What I would have done if I was you :
Removed red grills and changed back to stock ones (without any visible signs of the change), went to another Hyundai service centre and asked them to check the problem (of airbag light). They will tell you that the sensor has gone kaput and will replace it under warranty. Then changed to red grills with additional wiring and relay.

I haven't heard of anything like this and I think dealership people are fleecing you as they found one modification in your car. This gives them a reason to charge that 2k directly from you. But since airbag is inside horn pad, this may be true. Experts can correct if I am wrong.

At the cost of sounding like a noob (which I am), I am going to ask you how a second relay could help ?
Changing the wiring wasn't and still isn't something I am comfortable with I would rather revert to the stock horns.
Also most of my friends have Red grills in their Verna's and i20's and none of them have had any problems whatsoever, so this came as a surprise to me.

I also share your doubt about the dealership trying to fleece me because well they mostly are.
They have become quitevigilant lately to avoid incidents such as the one you suggested they now enter every modification made to the service job card which is stored in their central system.

Originally Posted by Akib Khan

Even i faced the airbag issue after i fitted Minda Trumpets. The clock spring got kaput and they said its because of aftermarket horns as the company provides one single horn and as i had installed a pair of horns it damaged the clock spring.

Originally Posted by Akib Khan

Previously i had installed the horn 2 days after getting the car from the showroom and that horn worked for 3 years without any glitch. This issue cropped up when i installed a new set of the same horn. They told me to either put back the stock horn or use the Minda horn with a seperate switch as the horn wiring is not able to take the added load of two horns. I got the block spring replaced but still use the horn from the steering pad and touchwood its working perfectly.

I believe you have the same car as mine, so how much did the clockspring repair cost you ? the same 2000rs ?

[Akib Khan]

No jag4. I have the old 2012 model launched before the igen. I was quoted 2400 and 1800for the clock spring at Mithula Hyundai and Sai Hyundai respectively so i went with the later and got it replaced.

[swift_guy]

Originally Posted by Jag4

At the cost of sounding like a noob (which I am), I am going to ask you how a second relay could help ?

Some pages back on this thread, we were discussing about the wiring part. I changed back to stock ones because factory wiring and relay are rated for the stock horns, in your case 35w. Changing to 55w Red grills on same wiring would mean demanding 157% (of stock) power, which means the wires can give way, melt anytime and lead to a fire or short-circuit. External relay would get its seperate power cable from the battery, and will need stock wiring only as an on/off signal.

I know this has nothing to do with your airbag light but will be tough on your stock wiring. This "Chalta hai" thing should be avoided, and you can ask a reputed installer to use spade-type terminals (available for 5 bucks I think) and add a relay. It has more to do with seperating horn's power department directly to battery rather than acting as a secondary relay. I hope it cleared your confusion.

[Jag4]

Originally Posted by Akib Khan

No jag4. I have the old 2012 model launched before the igen. I was quoted 2400 and 1800for the clock spring at Mithula Hyundai and Sai Hyundai respectively so i went with the later and got it replaced.

Thanks for your help. I think the steering is the same so the components will have a similar cost right now too! How long has it been since you got it replaced ?
Thanks

Originally Posted by swift_guy

Some pages back on this thread, we were discussing about the wiring part. I changed back to stock ones because factory wiring and relay are rated for the stock horns, in your case 35w. Changing to 55w Red grills on same wiring would mean demanding 157% (of stock) power, which means the wires can give way, melt anytime and lead to a fire or short-circuit. External relay would get its seperate power cable from the battery, and will need stock wiring only as an on/off signal.

I know this has nothing to do with your airbag light but will be tough on your stock wiring. This "Chalta hai" thing should be avoided, and you can ask a reputed installer to use spade-type terminals (available for 5 bucks I think) and add a relay. It has more to do with seperating horn's power department directly to battery rather than acting as a secondary relay. I hope it cleared your confusion.

Thank you so much for the detailed explanation, surely cleared my confusion.

Would something like this http://www.amazon.in/Hella-Horn-Rela.../dp/B00FDPYH2O work ?
Also If I can't find a harness which wires do I use to make one, since I already have a relay with me which came in the box.

To be honest, all the extra components and the work required make me want to revert to the stock horns since those won't affect the airbag switch as well.

[Akib Khan]

I got it replaced in January last year. The costs varies for diesel and petrol. I would recommend you to check with other service centres too as in my case the total amount had a difference of Rs. 700 for the same part, including labour.

[Darth Sid]

Originally Posted by Jag4

Would something like this http://www.amazon.in/Hella-Horn-Rela.../dp/B00FDPYH2O work ?
Also If I can't find a harness which wires do I use to make one, since I already have a relay with me which came in the box.

To be honest, all the extra components and the work required make me want to revert to the stock horns since those won't affect the airbag switch as well.

That harness should be fine though I remember reading a review there that said the connectors were not correct in terms of being male/female. That is easily corrected though. And if you are getting that harness, the installation will be far easier and quicker than if you were to assemble the wiring yourself. If you do make it yourself, use 4 sq mm wire for the horns' supply and 1-1.5 sq mm wire for the relay feed. I used 6 sq mm and 1.5 sq mm respectively to be extra safe.

Using Red Grills without a relay is very bad idea. They draw somewhere between 66W and 72W each! That's 132W to 144W a pair!! These and the Hella Full Tone and Twin Tone consume the same amount of power. Chances are that the excess heat generated in the horn switch may have affected its surrounding components but I am only speculating here.

[Jag4]

Originally Posted by Darth Sid

That harness should be fine though I remember reading a review there that said the connectors were not correct in terms of being male/female. That is easily corrected though. And if you are getting that harness, the installation will be far easier and quicker than if you were to assemble the wiring yourself. If you do make it yourself, use 4 sq mm wire for the horns' supply and 1-1.5 sq mm wire for the relay feed. I used 6 sq mm and 1.5 sq mm respectively to be extra safe.

Using Red Grills without a relay is very bad idea. They draw somewhere between 66W and 72W each! That's 132W to 144W a pair!! These and the Hella Full Tone and Twin Tone consume the same amount of power. Chances are that the excess heat generated in the horn switch may have affected its surrounding components but I am only speculating here.

Thanks for your detailed post.

I think you misunderstood that there is no relay installed, the car came with dual horns so there is a relay present in the system just not rated enough to handle the aftermarket horns or so I have been told by the Service people.

Originally Posted by swift_guy

Firstly, you should have changed to better wiring with an additional relay.

Secondly, won't this be covered under warranty?

Quick Question,
If I install the above mentioned relay and upgrade the wiring then the stock wiring will only be used for providing on/off signals so would it be safe to assume that the stock wiring or any sensors will not face any kind of extra current from the aftermarket horns.

[R2D2]

My only advice to folks fitting after market accessories be it ICE, high power horns, higher wattage headlamp bulbs etc is to keep in mind the following:

a) OEM/factory wiring and relays are sized to take the load of factory fitted accessories ONLY.

b) Most aftermarket accessories draw more power and offer higher performance in return

c) Wiring and related accessories like relays MUST be sized according to the max expected load

d) ALWAYS use a fuse to protect the add-on circuit. Please DO NOT compromise on electrical safety. A car has scores of items that can ignite or are combustible especially under the bonnet/hood. I don't need to tell you what they are. The fuse must ideally be within 1 foot from the battery +ve terminal. The 12" of 'unprotected' wiring from the terminal to the fuse holder must be wrapped with insulation tape or a flexible casing to protect it from chemicals for e.g. battery fumes and acid, abrasion and heat.

e) Don't cut or splice the OEM harness. Replacements can be expensive. If it's a new car you will void several component warranties. As can be seen from the experiences of members, dealers and manufacturers will use this as an excuse to duck warranty claims. As far as possible try to make use of the factory connectors to create a new auxiliary harness for your accessories. Try and uninstall aftermarket accessories when sending your car in for service/repairs.

NET NET - Electricity, like fire, is a good servant but a very bad master. Please treat it with respect because it can destroy and even kill. Always take appropriate precautions to protect life and property.

[swift_guy]

Originally Posted by Jag4

Quick Question,
If I install the above mentioned relay and upgrade the wiring then the stock wiring will only be used for providing on/off signals so would it be safe to assume that the stock wiring or any sensors will not face any kind of extra current from the aftermarket horns.

Stock relay is rated for stock horns only. Otherwise 35w and 55w seem to be similar, but in critical applications like in a car (and its wiring), it makes for a ~60% increment. External relay is always the best choice.

And yes. Power for red grills would be taken directly from the battery +ve terminal. In a 4 pin relay (which I assume from the image in link), there are 4 pins.

One is connected to battery terminal (for direct power), one is ground, one is signal for horns (which will be taken from +ve connectors of stock wiring) and last one is for connecting aftermarket horns (to supply them the power). So it is safe to assume that power will be drawn from the battery and stock wiring (and its relay) will act as an on/off signal only.

As R2D2 said, add a fuse.

EDIT - The wiring kit is not in stock in the link given by you. You ordered it already?

[Darth Sid]

Originally Posted by Jag4

Thanks for your detailed post.

I think you misunderstood that there is no relay installed, the car came with dual horns so there is a relay present in the system just not rated enough to handle the aftermarket horns or so I have been told by the Service people.

If I install the above mentioned relay and upgrade the wiring then the stock wiring will only be used for providing on/off signals so would it be safe to assume that the stock wiring or any sensors will not face any kind of extra...

The factory fitment of dual horns doesn't always imply the presence of a relay. That's the case with motorcycles, though the horns you find on them have much lower power requirements. But yes, even if the vehicle does have a relay fitted as stock, it is only rated for stock horns. As a rule, if you are adding a load higher than stock, bypass the stock electricals using a relay. And yes, if you use a relay, the stock electrical circuit will only have handle the load of the relay coil which is very tiny. Oh, fuse is essential too!

The rest has been very clearly stated by others above.

[greenhorn]

recently was shopping around ot install some horns in my indica after the ones already there died in the recent floods.
Looked at roots ones - wanted a govt vehicle sound.
Megasonic is by far the loudest and on par with the redgrille. Redgrille has a sharp tone, is smaller & cheaper, the sound is subjective, but bassy tones are an adjective, as they cut through sound insulation of cars better (ie the dude with his windows rolled up and the AC on will hear you better)

Ended up buying a vibrasonic, as its the only one which would fit. Its even bassier, but sound a bit muted compared to my other horn, a stebel magnum TM 80/2