[Familyguy]

Originally Posted by AJ56

Instead look for certified installers of Carpro, Feynlab, SystemX, Modesta, etc in your area.

Hi AJ56 - Hows Atdeshine for ceramic/graphene coating? I'm in Mumbai and the studio that a lot of people on this thread have recommended used this brand.

Thanks!

[AJ56]

Originally Posted by Familyguy

Hi AJ56 - Hows Atdeshine for ceramic/graphene coating? I'm in Mumbai and the studio that a lot of people on this thread have recommended used this brand.

Thanks!

I’ve not tested Artdeshine personally for years on end on any of my cars so won’t claim it’s 100% at the same level as the bigger names I mentioned earlier which I have tested over the the years.

However it is good enough that I’ll say you can go ahead and try and see how long it holds up, their graphene coatings are quite hydrophobic when fresh.

[Wokewagon]

Originally Posted by garyag79

Update on my ceramic coating experience:

The car is easy to clean using turtle wax micro fiber cloth. It takes me just 10 minutes to get the original shine, method is simple in terms of using slightly moist cloth. I am cleaning it twice / thrice a week. This seems to be money well spent till now.

I feel Ceramic coating is hit and miss. Ceramic coating (System X Pro) from a specialist vendor worked brilliantly for me during the first 4 months of ownership (Black VW Virtus), but after the monsoon season, all the initial gloss appears to have dipped, despite washing the car with AutoMagic Wash and Wax every week.

Do you only use water with the Turtle Wax Micro fiber cloth or do you also use the hybrid solution that Turtle Wax offers? In your previous post, you've mentioned that your neighbour has advised you to use ph Neutral shampoo only once in three months, but what do you do when your car gets covered with slush and tough stains after a long drive?

[garyag79]

Originally Posted by Wokewagon

I feel Ceramic coating is hit and miss. Ceramic coating (System X Pro) from a specialist vendor worked brilliantly for me during the first 4 months of ownership (Black VW Virtus), but after the monsoon season, all the initial gloss appears to have dipped, despite washing the car with AutoMagic Wash and Wax every week.

Do you only use water with the Turtle Wax Micro fiber cloth or do you also use the hybrid solution that Turtle Wax offers? In your previous post, you've mentioned that your neighbour has advised you to use ph Neutral shampoo only once in three months, but what do you do when your car gets covered with slush and tough stains after a long drive?

The coating has survived a month of heavy rains in NCR including flooded roads. It still has all the shine and gloss. During the rains i used to clean the slush and tough stains by dipping another micro fiber cloth in water and wipe off all stuck mud etc. post that just used to moisten one of the turtle wax cloth and wiped off the entire car cleaning the cloth twice or thrice in between.

Havent shampoo yet, plan to do it in November.

[AJ56]

Originally Posted by Wokewagon

I feel Ceramic coating is hit and miss. Ceramic coating (System X Pro) from a specialist vendor worked brilliantly for me during the first 4 months of ownership (Black VW Virtus), but after the monsoon season, all the initial gloss appears to have dipped, despite washing the car with AutoMagic Wash and Wax every week.

What do you do when your car gets covered with slush and tough stains after a long drive?

I’ve installed SystemX Pro on hundreds of cars over the years and the only time I see a drop in gloss and water repellency under 3 years is when the paint has been scratched and swirled courtesy improper washing by the owner.

Even the ultimate 10 year coating can have its gloss and water repellency destroyed in very short order by washing it incorrectly, that’s just how soft modern clear coat is.

You should not be wiping the car to clean it, even more so when it’s dirty after rains. Follow contactless rinsing, if you must touch it use a foam cannon and multiple wash mitts working one mitt per panel, top to bottom. Use air to dry for added safety.

Touchless rinse on half a bonnet-

https://youtu.be/rgpVZrfYAKM

The real miss isn’t the coating, it’s the lack of education detailers give their clients on safe washing post application.

[Wokewagon]

Originally Posted by AJ56

I’ve installed SystemX Pro on hundreds of cars over the years and the only time I see a drop in gloss and water repellency under 3 years is when the paint has been scratched and swirled courtesy improper washing by the owner.

Even the ultimate 10 year coating can have its gloss and water repellency destroyed in very short order by washing it incorrectly, that’s just how soft modern clear coat is.

You should not be wiping the car to clean it, even more so when it’s dirty after rains. Follow contactless rinsing, if you must touch it use a foam cannon and multiple wash mitts working one mitt per panel, top to bottom. Use air to dry for added safety.

Touchless rinse on half a bonnet-

https://Youtu.be/rgpVZrfYAKM

The real miss isn’t the coating, it’s the lack of education detailers give their clients on safe washing post application.

Appreciate your two cents, but would look to find more practical ways to go about maintaining my car.

[mercedised]

Originally Posted by AJ56

I’ve installed SystemX Pro on hundreds of cars over the years and the only time I see a drop in gloss and water repellency under 3 years is when the paint has been scratched and swirled courtesy improper washing by the owner.

Hi AJ56,

Given your expertise, would you please consider creating a detailed video on the proper washing technique for a mud-covered car with ceramic coating? I believe this would be incredibly beneficial for many of us, especially since many of us lack the knowledge or time to follow the correct procedures.

Additionally, I would like to share a few points regarding ceramic coating. I understand that it serves as a protective layer for car paint, and I believe it should be durable enough to withstand normal washing and wiping. With advancements like self-healing PPF, I think there’s great potential for similar innovations in ceramic coat technology.

Thanks.

[AJ56]

Originally Posted by mercedised

Hi AJ56,

Given your expertise, would you please consider creating a detailed video on the proper washing technique for a mud-covered car with ceramic coating? I believe this would be incredibly beneficial for many of us, especially since many of us lack the knowledge or time to follow the correct procedures.

Additionally, I would like to share a few points regarding ceramic coating. I understand that it serves as a protective layer for car paint, and I believe it should be durable enough to withstand normal washing and wiping. With advancements like self-healing PPF, I think there’s great potential for similar innovations in ceramic coat technology.

Thanks.

Sure thing, will do. I can do a full contact wash on a large panel, simply replicate on the entire vehicle.

Regarding your suggestions for ceramic. Please note, self healing PPF, ceramic coated paint, ceramic coated PPF, even ceramic infused paint with a hard clearcoat. Nothing will hold up to the extreme level of abrasion that is inflicted by a towel wipe without a pre rinse or without lubrication.

Self healing effect on PPF is lost in a very short amount of time when not washed correctly.

Under 3 months for most brands including Expel, as it’s essentially a self levelling polymer that can only self level a finite amount of times before its thickness is lost. After that PPF scuffs and swirls even faster than regular coated paint as it’s very soft.

Even regular car paint, despite over 120 years of refinement and R&D, still cannot hold up to the kind of abrasion inflicted by a towel wipe (unless you have proper lubrication). What you’re wanting is a thick (100 micron+) self healing ceramic coating/clearcoat that is very high on the Mohs scale of mineral hardness (close to glass essentially).

This is applied with an HVLP paint gun in a paint booth over the factory paint, this type of tech is still in development I believe. You still can’t let your society cleaner just wipe it without scratching though, as even glass (which is 5.5-6 on the Mohs scale of hardness) gets scuffed over time on cars that are washed this way.

Originally Posted by Wokewagon

Appreciate your two cents, but would look to find more practical ways to go about maintaining my car.

It’s a very fast and practical way to clean a car safely without inflicting damage, under 10-12 mins when done regularly.

[Wokewagon]

Originally Posted by AJ56

Sure thing, will do. I can do a full contact wash on a large panel, simply replicate on the entire vehicle.

This is applied with an HVLP paint gun in a paint booth over the factory paint, this type of tech is still in development I believe. You still can’t let your society cleaner just wipe it without scratching though, as even glass (which is 5.5-6 on the Mohs scale of hardness) gets scuffed over time on cars that are washed this way.
…
It’s a very fast and practical way to clean a car safely without inflicting damage, under 10-12 mins when done regularly.

Interesting, thanks. Would you be so kind to recommend the ideal gear that facilitates this contactless washing? I spotted a Black+Decker branded machine in your video.

[AJ56]

Originally Posted by Wokewagon

Appreciate your two cents, but would look to find more practical ways to go about maintaining my car.

Originally Posted by Wokewagon

Interesting, thanks. Would you be so kind to recommend the ideal gear that facilitates this contactless washing? I spotted a Black+Decker branded machine in your video.

Happy to help.

Yes that’s my leaf blower, ideally you want one that’s 400 cfm+ and a high flow pressure washer, I’m using an Amy HW4-P2300 washer (14L/min at 2000 psi) to rinse and the Black+Decker GW 3030 3000W leaf blower to dry.

Both run off standard 220V, and can be used easily in domestic applications as well. I have the same setup at home.

You don’t need to replicate my exact setup, smaller machines can do the job almost as well, will just take a little longer to rinse and dry properly.

[AJ56]

Originally Posted by mercedised

Hi AJ56,

Given your expertise, would you please consider creating a detailed video on the proper washing technique for a mud-covered car with ceramic coating? I believe this would be incredibly beneficial for many of us.

Thanks.

While not mud covered, this is around 4 days of dust with 25 km of daily driving.

Here I’ve only done the bonnet, when doing the entire car, you’ll use around 7-8 mitts flipping to a clean side after every panel (half a panel for larger panels like the bonnet and roof).

Work top to bottom and use different mitts for the wheels. Once a mitt is used, do not reuse, toss it in the laundry bucket. This method only requires one bucket with water and shampoo, no grit guard or secondary bucket needed.

Also, it looks much cleaner on camera than it is in person, dust doesn’t seem to show very well.

https://youtu.be/u5H5XmheTL4

[mercedised]

Originally Posted by AJ56

While not mud covered, this is around 4 days of dust with 25 km of daily driving.
Also, it looks much cleaner on camera than it is in person, dust doesn’t seem to show very well.
https://Youtu.be/u5H5XmheTL4

Originally Posted by AJ56

This is applied with an HVLP paint gun in a paint booth over the factory paint, this type of tech is still in development I believe. You still can’t let your society cleaner just wipe it without scratching though, as even glass (which is 5.5-6 on the Mohs scale of hardness) gets scuffed over time on cars that are washed this way.

Hi AJ56,

Thank you for sharing the video! I truly appreciate the time and effort you put into it, you definitely are a practical man! Your washing tips—using multiple mitts and working from top to bottom—make a lot of sense.
It’s also fascinating to learn about the limitations of ceramic coatings and self-healing PPF.

I found it interesting how dust doesn’t show up as well on camera; it’s a great reminder of the importance of proper washing techniques, even when things appear cleaner than they are.

I have a few questions I’d love your insights on:

High-Pressure Water: Won’t the high-pressure water used from a distance, as shown in the video, potentially damage the ceramic coating (or its bonding with paint) or create swirl marks?

Foam Cannon: What is the importance of using a foam cannon? Will it help dissolve the mud, or is regular pressurized water sufficient without risking damage to the coating or paint?

Paint Sealant: If someone has applied a paint sealant treatment instead of a ceramic coating, can pressurized water damage or break the bond between the sealant and the paint?

Thanks again for your valuable insights!

[AJ56]

Originally Posted by mercedised

Hi AJ56,

Thank you for sharing the video! I truly appreciate the time and effort you put into it,
I have a few questions I’d love your insights on:

High-Pressure Water: Won’t the high-pressure water used from a distance, as shown in the video, potentially damage the ceramic coating (or its bonding with paint) or create swirl marks?

Foam Cannon: What is the importance of using a foam cannon? Will it help dissolve the mud, or is regular pressurized water sufficient without risking damage to the coating or paint?

Paint Sealant: If someone has applied a paint sealant treatment instead of a ceramic coating, can pressurized water damage or break the bond between the sealant and the paint?

Thanks again for your valuable insights!

Happy to help.

It’s all rather elementary to me but I can see how someone who’s new to detailing and safe washing may get slightly confused, heck if I had someone to guide me a decade ago I could’ve saved a lot of time

1) Nope, quite the contrary actually. It’s the safest method of cleaning paint without physical contact. I have washed my own cars thousands of times over 11 years now with the exact same method and there is zero swirling/marring. For reference this is super soft black paint that swirls just by lightly touching it with a finger.

Also coatings cannot be physically separated from paint just by pressure alone. You’ll strip the paint off the metal if using very aggressive nozzles very close to the paint. Coatings can be removed by sandpaper or heavy cut compounds.

2) Only pressurised water is enough for cleaning mud, no matter how dirty the car is. It’s the safest method in fact for cleaning a heavily soiled surface without scratching it.

A foam cannon running a pH-neutral shampoo is only for lubrication between the paint and your wash mitt, it allows the mitts to glide over the clearcoat rather than dig into it, as water itself isn’t a good lubricant (it’s a solvent).

Now if you fill your cannon with a stronger alkaline/acid based shampoo designed to break down contamination on your paintwork then yes chemically it will help emulsify and soften up the road film bonded to the paint.

However this is not healthy for weekly maintenance washes as you are chemically shocking the paint and wearing down the ceramic coating unnecessarily.

3) No, the only damage that a pressure washer can potentially do is to strip paint off the metal if the operator isn’t trained/holds it too close. Never go lower than 25 degrees on the nozzle, keep a minimum of 10-12” from the paint and you’ll be fine.

[Sridhar K]

@AJ56
Thanks for the eye opening tips on maintaining a ceramic coated car. Can you also suggest if we would need any ceramic foam wash concentrate for washing or any ph neutral shampoo/ foam wash would suffice? Any good recommendations?

[AJ56]

Originally Posted by Sridhar K

@AJ56
Thanks for the eye opening tips on maintaining a ceramic coated car. Can you also suggest if we would need any ceramic foam wash concentrate for washing or any ph neutral shampoo/ foam wash would suffice? Any good recommendations?

Anytime. No, you don’t need ceramic infused anything (shampoo/trim dressing/tyre shine, quick detailer, etc). I find it’s just marketing as the % of silica added to these products is too low to have any real effect on performance.

A bit like adding a spoon of salt to a lake and calling it saline solution, technically it is saline but practically there’s zero change. I’ve exaggerated a little but it’s easy to understand this way.

Any high quality pH-neutral shampoo with good lubricity is enough to wash a coated car safely with zero damage. Koch Chemie GSF is a good one I’ve used for many years now. Chemical guys Honeydew snow foam is another good one.