[mathranik]

T-Bhp Fam,

Normally, when I am in the market for a new automobile, the use-cases and needs are very well laid out in my head. This time, though, it is different. Very!

Before the query, let me quickly lay the current garage out to rule out overlaps, at the very least.

2019 Porsche Macan R4 (With Sports Exhaust)



The car was primary until July last year, and has about 35k on the clock. With the new sports exhaust, it is the weekend-dose of fun that the streets of Ahmedabad typically allow in late evenings.

Also, pictured above is my 2019 Ducati Scrambler Icon, rendered useful only maybe 4-5 times a year - reflects in the 2k run on the odo.


LR Defender 2021 P300



This has become my primary commute for about an year now, and also the highway cruiser-par-dream. It is specced well, and has pretty much everything you need in what is otherwise a car built for hardcore off-roading. I have had my share of fun doing that as well.


Toyota Corolla Altis J (Petrol)




This is the family beater, mostly consigned to the family chauffeur for errands, school & activity drops / pick-ups, and what have you.


Now, comes the dilemma. We are a family of 2 + 2 (Young kids, 6 & 4), and if sanity were to be kept as premise of logical decision-making, we have more vehicles than the household needs. But, that did not prevail. So, here we are, deciding on what to buy before the world turns electric and boring.

Budget : Sub 1-Cr

Desire-list : Not a large SUV, maybe a convertible, definitely a fast car (Say 0-100 in sub-6, if we can get one!) or luxurious for long drives, niche (Not seen all over the streets), should not overlap what we have in the garage

Don't-care list : Service network (As the car won't be driven more than 500 km / month), depreciation

Options that crossed our mind :

- Used Ford Mustang

- Toyota Alphard

- Mini Convertible Cooper S / JCW

- Mini Clubman / Countryman

- Merc GLA AMG

- BMW Z4 Roadster

- New Merc V-Class

- Merc C-Class Cabriolet (Not available as of now, it seems)


Good to note that the above list is neither comprehensive, nor sacrosanct. The idea of this query thread was to share with this fantastic group, the reasons behind considering a new vehicle (Not much really, but one that would possibly complete our garage), and to be advised in any direction!

We have also been looking at the option of building a caravan / camper on a mid-sized chassis, and use it for our long road-trips (1500km+). The kids would grow at their own pace, and hence the next 5 years need pampered and calm travel for them (in my personal parenting opinion).

Aim to close the purchase in the next two weeks - Happy to hear all opinions out.

Thank you, all!

[TorqueMonster]

Since you are looking for z4s', and since you seem very happy with the Macan, why not add another Porsche to the Garage. I'll say you should get yourself a used Cayman or 911.

The new Z4 is a nice car indeed, but the driving dynamics a Porsche offers is more than BMW ever could.

The Vellfire (Afaik the Alphard is not sold in India) is easily a sofa on wheels, but unless you want ultimate comfort, just ignore it, it isn't that special otherwise.

The Mustang is good, but I just don't see the use recommending a car that ideally is an entry sports car abroad.

I'll just say that if you can go till about 1 cr, you should get yourself a used Porsche. Or even else, another good sportscar., be it from Mercedes or BMW or Audi. As you said, you wanted to enjoy something before electric cars come, so why not get yourself an actual sports car. You already have 3 cars which you can daily drive if you want. So yes, a sportscar should be ideally your priority.

[Sahil]

Originally Posted by mathranik

The car was primary until July last year, and has about 35k on the clock. With the new sports exhaust, it is the weekend-dose of fun that the streets of Ahmedabad typically allow in late evenings.

Going a bit off topic here, but very intrigued to know about the sports exhaust and whether I should consider it for my Macan R4?

How much did it cost and where did you procure it from? Any power gains? How different is the sound(louder at lower revs or mid or higher? become more throaty?

____

Coming back to topic. I think you should either go electric or full blown V8 territory.
Electric: You do not need another SUV but the only properly quick electric coming to my mind is the Volvo V40 Electric that does 0 to 100 in 4.8 seconds or so.
V8- A used mustang is a decent option but I would perhaps stick to a German. Used RS7 or previous gen M5,C63 AMG could be good options. RS5 would be a good option too if you want a V8 then previous gen but new gen is quick too but a V6, both in used options will be well within your budget.

Consider a remap on the Macan, top it with octane booster or high octane fuel and you will easily have a sub 6 second car.

[androdev]

My suggestion would be to keep it a 3 vehicle garage instead of adding one more car. You can always replace one or more of the cars with something better or different. Not sure how relevant my own learnings are, but here they are anyway in the order of significance:

1. Errand car: I was using Honda City as my errand car and accidentally ended up with a Camry Hybrid. Only then I realised how important it is to have a good errand car if one can afford it. An errand car is not necessarily a cheap car but something that can see a lot of rough usage with minimal running costs. Camry fits the fill. It is cheaper to run than Honda City. We also have a Corolla in the extended family and Camry is in a class of its own. [My apologies to those members who find me repetitively praising Camry all over the forum]

2. Flagship car: The most outlandish and rewarding decision I have made as far as buying a car goes was to buy an S Class when my kids were under 4 years of age. My suggestion is to replace one of your cars with a "flagship" from the brand of your liking when kids are small. Don't have 3 mid-range cars however good and appealing they are.

3. For the thrills: You already have a Ducati. I don't see much point in spending a fortune on a sports car if you already have a nice sports bike. You can use it more often, will be easier on the pocket and so on. It's worth spending money on #1 and #2 above. Money spent on a sports car is just for vanity and a depreciation disaster.

[speedfreak77]

A wonderful garage you got there ticking all the boxes of comfort, power and road presence. The Macan is lovely to drive and the defender is what I term “stronger than time”. Coming back to the topic, If it were me with that budget, It would be impossible to get rid of the itch of getting a sports car presumably a used one so that I can get a taste of raw speed and power before the boring times hit ashore.

Macan and Defender are perfect daily driver vehicles but what you need is a car in which you stomp the pedal and everything comes at you so fast and that you see the lord in front of your eyes. With the budget you have, there are so many options in the market especially the used one where you can get the perfect bang for your buck car. If you are looking for new options:
1. Audi S5 sportback - I drove this car a few months back and remembering the drive still makes me smile. This is the perfect entry level car which gives the kick in the pants feel. A shade of blue or red will make it extra marvellous. A few more bucks and you get the hardcore RS5 which is a serious machine.

2. BMW M2 - Perfect entry level M car, drives like a charm and with so much power under your right foot and the fun RWD setup, you will adore it and even more after a few mods and the lovely shade of sunburst orange. M2 is the perfect driver car in this budget.

3. AMG A45S - This car is just something else. Blends in with the traffic and can give supercars a run for their money. A perfect option for a thrilling drive for the weekdays and a nightmare for supercars in the weekends.

If you want to explore the pre-owned market then I have some pretty good options for you-

1. Audi R8 V8/V10 - Depends on what you find with the least mileage. The R8 is what I term the daily drivable supercar which looks so good good even if it is neon or stealthy black. V10 with a Capristo exhaust will sound lovely and is basically a Lamborghini Gallardo but in my opinion the R8 looks better and classy anyday.

2. BMW i8 - A desirable car which is easy on the wallet and looks beautiful. The add on electric motor might not make you enthusiastic about it but trust me the petrol engine sounds like a dream.

3. Bentley CGT - The holy grail and perfect blend of power and luxury. If you get your hands on the W12, Might make your whole body tingle because this is what I call the perfect car. Bentleys are so roguish and lovely. Might even fit your tastes very well.

4. G63 AMG - The pre facelift G wagon has this mafia character to it. You can even weekday it and the power it has is unreal for the size of the car.

5. Porsche 911 Carrera S 997/991 - This is the supercar which only the people who love to drive their cars appreciate. The way it handles and drives is just supreme and no other supercar and match it. For me, this is the ultimate driving machine. If you can stretch your budget and get the Turbo or even better the Turbo S then I promise, you will adore it and become a Porsche fanboy forever.

These are some of the brilliant cars I know and I think these will suit your taste and will be the perfect for you. Do let us BHPians know what you choose even if it is out of the options we all suggest you. Would love to know what car will be the newest garage mate.
Cheerio.

[mathranik]

Originally Posted by TorqueMonster

Since you are looking for z4s', and since you seem very happy with the Macan, why not add another Porsche to the Garage. I'll say you should get yourself a used Cayman or 911.

The new Z4 is a nice car indeed, but the driving dynamics a Porsche offers is more than BMW ever could.

The Vellfire (Afaik the Alphard is not sold in India) is easily a sofa on wheels, but unless you want ultimate comfort, just ignore it, it isn't that special otherwise.

The Mustang is good, but I just don't see the use recommending a car that ideally is an entry sports car abroad.

For a moment, I did have my eyes on Taycan, but that kind of money could fetch some far superior machines, and Luxury EVs would rationalise in price in the next 24 months, I hope and predict. Another Porsche - not too keen, what with the similar family-face and interiors. I hear you on the Mustang, and that seems like a pass as well. Not many thumbs up on that, I see.

Confused, and how!

Originally Posted by Sahil

Going a bit off topic here, but very intrigued to know about the sports exhaust and whether I should consider it for my Macan R4?

How much did it cost and where did you procure it from? Any power gains? How different is the sound(louder at lower revs or mid or higher? become more throaty?

____

Coming back to topic. I think you should either go electric or full blown V8 territory.
Electric: You do not need another SUV but the only properly quick electric coming to my mind is the Volvo V40 Electric that does 0 to 100 in 4.8 seconds or so.
V8- A used mustang is a decent option but I would perhaps stick to a German. Used RS7 or previous gen M5,C63 AMG could be good options. RS5 would be a good option too if you want a V8 then previous gen but new gen is quick too but a V6, both in used options will be well within your budget.

Consider a remap on the Macan, top it with octane booster or high octane fuel and you will easily have a sub 6 second car.

On the exhaust - Cost me ~4L, and it's a Porsche original accessory (Part no 95B04420048). The cost includes installation and an electric button to turn it on / off. It's got the usual pops and bangs, loud enough to be music to ears, but not too loud to be rowdy. There's been a marginal improvement in performance, but haven't measured it tbh.

Remap is an interesting option, now that there's not much in the name of warranty that's left. I have the Sports Plus feature, and with a Cat-1 remap, shaving a second seems doable.

V40 is a tad too small for my liking, for a four-door, but M5 / RS5 (used copies) seem great as an option. Let me try my luck on BBT or similar such avenues.

Originally Posted by androdev

My suggestion would be to keep it a 3 vehicle garage instead of adding one more car. You can always replace one or more of the cars with something better or different.

Interesting inputs. The problem with conventional flagships from the German stables is that they are traditionally chauffeur-driven delights, something I am not chuffed about. Your take on replacing, possibly, the Altis with something +1 / +2 in class is a good option. However, there's very little to gain, as I have ample parking spots (Perks of Tier-2 city life), and that car would outlast everything else.

[M00M]

There is a Porsche Boxster convertible used for sale in the Team BHP classifieds. The car / dealer seem to be located in GJ and you can get in touch and check the car out.

[NarediAni7518]

Why don’t you look at the M340i ? It’s one of the best cars you can get in that price range. Other cars that I would suggest are:-
1. S5
2. M2 competition
And if the budget can be extended a little beyond a crore:-
1. E53 AMG this would be my primary choice
2. RS-5
3. GLE-53 AMG
4. GLC-43 AMG

[Akshay1234]

Well you have 2 awesome SUVs in your garage. One which gives you almost sedan like dynamics, and the other which gives you off road prowess. What both of them cannot replicate though, is the absolute feel of a performance vehicle. Forget the vans, if you want a camper you can get the tent accessory for your Defender.

Since you have kids, I'm guessing you'll want a vehicle which can seat all of you. Check out the Mini convertible, it will give you some amount of thrills and drama in terms of sound, and also the fun of a convertible.

Apart from that, I would advise you to check out the A45s again which will be a great amount of fun.

If a hatchback is not what you are open to, then I would suggest the pre owned market, where you can get everything from an M5, to an S63 coupe (there is a beautiful example on sale with a dealer called Boys N Machines).

[mathranik]

Originally Posted by speedfreak77

A wonderful garage you got there ticking all the boxes of comfort, power and road presence. The Macan is lovely to drive and the defender is what I term “stronger than time”. Coming back to the topic, If it were me with that budget, It would be impossible to get rid of the itch of getting a sports car presumably a used one so that I can get a taste of raw speed and power before the boring times hit ashore.

Thank you! Pretty satisfied with the current garage, but I am glad you get my reasoning for a new car. M2 is a good one to consider! My problem with A45 is that, the same form is available in a far more basic spec, hence rendering it ubiquitous, should it be a success.

Originally Posted by M00M

There is a Porsche Boxster convertible used for sale in the Team BHP classifieds. The car / dealer seem to be located in GJ and you can get in touch and check the car out.

Thank you. It's a 2012 example :(

Originally Posted by NarediAni7518

Why don’t you look at the M340i ? It’s one of the best cars you can get in that price range. Other cars that I would suggest are:-

Thanks! Was very close to picking the M340i up from a Mumbai dealership, but the better half objected. Looks identical to the run-of-the-mill 3, is how she defends her point.

M2 is now becoming a likely option.

Originally Posted by Akshay1234

Well you have 2 awesome SUVs in your garage. One which gives you almost sedan like dynamics, and the other which gives you off road prowess. What both of them cannot replicate though, is the absolute feel of a performance vehicle. Forget the vans, if you want a camper you can get the tent accessory for your Defender.

Thank you!

Very sound opinion. I am inclined towards Mini convertible as well, but would it be a case of too little, too late for us?

I think, now is the time for a poll.

[Turbanator]

Originally Posted by mathranik

So, here we are, deciding on what to buy before the world turns electric and boring.

Budget : Sub 1-Cr

Desire-list : Not a large SUV, maybe a convertible, definitely a fast car (Say 0-100 in sub-6, if we can get one!) or luxurious for long drives, niche (Not seen all over the streets), should not overlap what we have in the garage

Good position to be in, sometimes, I too fantasise about this and start configuring my 911 Turbo-S, with the kind of my built & Porsche extras, reality sinks in and I go back to work

Will answer pros/ cons for the ones you have shortlisted

- Toyota Alphard ~ Vellfire - Very good if you want something to be driven in on regular days and want to go on weekends with family. Everyone will sit happy and pampered. Less a number of these and feel very large & different on Road.

- Mini Convertible Cooper S / JCW - Can avoid, after Maccan you won't enjoy. Besides, with growing kids, it will be tough to take along.

- Mini Clubman / Countryman- Boring

- Merc GLA AMG - It's not full AMG and you may not feel any difference over Maccan.

- BMW Z4 Roadster- Should check and try, good as a 2 seater so the same problems as JCW.

- New Merc V-Class - Avoid - too commercial, large and nothing that stands out. Delhi dealer has one special edition with beds but the missing kitchen at 30-40 Lac discounts, if you want one.

From my own experiences, handling multiple cars is not easy besides you will be stuck in the same segment. You should sell the Maccan and instead check the Taycan range. With Zero RTO in most states, that car can be a good upgrade. If you are Ok with 2 seats, I will still sell that Maccan and look at 911 range.

Originally Posted by Sahil

Going a bit off topic here, but very intrigued to know about the sports exhaust and whether I should consider it for my Macan R4

It's a good option, for some reasons, costs the same when configured with the vehicle or when ordered separately (duties on CBU perhaps)

I think you should either go electric or full blown V8 territory.

+1

Originally Posted by M00M

There is a Porsche Boxster convertible used for sale in the Team BHP classifieds. The car / dealer seem to be located in GJ and you can get in touch and check the car out.

It's a multiple owner car probably and now with a dealer in Surat. Asking is too high for that age, the car is registered in Gurgaon so RTO will be a hassle given the NGT norms.

[Nilesh5417]

Am not in this territory but your idea of building a campervan is appealing. Maybe you should get a Hilux or VCross or even a Tata Winger and spend that 1cr to build a campervan! With that kind of budget, am sure it will not be short on equipment, comfort or space.

[hondatoyotafan]

Your requirements scream M2 Competition but also an Audi E-tron will be a good option in the EV space.

[bhargav2015]

In your use case, most of the things people hold as priority in their checklists are out of the window.

Right off the bat, the first 2 generations of R8 were hailed as possible daily drivers (albeit not on our roads).

Secondly, as outlandish as it may sound, how about a
W12 6.0L Aston Martin Rapide? I saw a couple of them on BBT, but the white one has been picked up by a gentleman from Mangalore but the other one may still be available.

I know you said no more Porsche's but a stock Cayman S is a LOVELY driver's car. Right balance of power and driveability. Makes sweet notes, can keep it stock or mod, and a dying breed of mechanically solid cars without electronics meddling in.

If outlandish is the ULTIMATE objective, I daresay, in your budget, you will find a good vintage of Maserati Quattroporte 4.2. It depreciates like a rock in water, expensive to repair and all the cons of an Italian supercar, but it is quite something on the streets!

[karanddd]

Of all the cars you're considering, I've only driven the JCW properly. Relative to the Cayenne I drove (no idea how similar or dissimilar that is to the Macan), the Mini feels like a whole other world. It's way smaller and so nimble that you genuinely feel like you're driving a go-kart on steroids. The suspension is extremely hard and the car turns with no roll and no delay at the twirl of the wheel, far more quickly than any larger car can. As you already have two SUVs, a small car adds balance, especially since you probably don't want to cart the whole family around for enthusiastic driving. I'd personally steer away from the bigger Minis or any other large car, as I feel at bottom size and weight play a greater role in driving feel than any other factor. This is especially true in India, where at least I have yet to find gently curving switchback roads that allow carrying 100+ speeds through multiple corners at a time (where a RWD would shine). Curvy roads in India are designed for slower speeds and are very tight, which is ideal for a Mini. A Caterham or Polaris Slingshot would great too, but I don't believe you can get them in India.