[mdsaab]

had a lot of catching up to do, cause this TOGO channel has no Ads only pure content. Anyways. a little episode.
My parents are looking out for a car, so we visited the Toyota showroom to check out the corolla. I was never too impressed with the interiors of the corolla, but visited hoping to check out a T-Fort. My mom too was not impressed by the corolla and wrote it off almost immediately. Unfortunately there was not a T-Fort in sight. We were just about to leave when a customers T-Fort was driven in by some sales chap. We Couldn't take a look on the inside but admired from the outside. Walking around to the back i saw this, and boy did i like it. So here it is.

[Guderian]

Originally Posted by Zappex

Stone age is not far way given the quality depreciation of automobiles. Just read a report on another of the mHaHa failing...
Admiral seems to be the benchmark in quality, And so far Toothless is not far behind!

Hi Zap, Yes saw that report on the CSC failing. Was taken back to my Scorpio days. Left a comment there and a response.
Pity but many vehicles' subsequent models don't seem to be a patch on the first one released quality wise. The cost reduction angle seems to be driving these decisio. Cost drives companies into outsourcing and then no one bothers about the gently reducing quality of the outsourced components.
Well even on the TFort the outsourced components are all lousy. Read window beading, roof rails. But can live with it. Luckily the rest of the components or the core components (engine and sub systems) appear to be beefy and brawny. To me that is very important for PoM and long life. Afterall one can always throw out these itsy bitsy stuff like beading etc and get new ones but can't do much about the engine and other critical sub-assemblies.
To me more than the looks the performance is important.

Originally Posted by Zappex

Brilliant idea! Say, how do you come you with such stuff? That said I am currently off the dock (I'm in Pune). Hopefully will be back by Saturday.

EDIT: Got the PM, Will revert once I'm back.

Ah well...can't help it, was born with it. The brilliance part I mean !

OK seriously speaking, have done some of these kind of rides with some other folks off and on, it was/is great fun to break the monotony plus gives you a great view of the city as it really is. You miss many things of the city when you are on a normal run. These special or off beat drives are truly thrilling. And the breakfast which follows with lots of discussion on vehicles and the city is truly thrilling.

Let me know once you are back will plan something for the following Saturday - May 28 or something. Will also put it up on the meet section to see how many other TBHP birds are interested in the Dawn Patrol.

Yeah, it brings down crime because one isn't at home and engaging in the criminal activity of bugging the other family members or worse sleeping.

And you are right - no more OT stuff. For the time being till... momentary lapses of reason seizes me/us again or we turn Pink with Floyd !

Originally Posted by parsh

I wonder so. Ain't this quite a thing for recall for all those mis-guided drivers all these years who have been brainwashed with frequent looks into those ORVMs? IMO it would be quite the apt thing to do by the great Toyota to reinstate what was once brainwashed. I for one will have my 6 year itch finally come to rest. I am sure Admiral would be even prouder to let go of the Toyota'ian (Indian) legacy.

Hey Parsh, Coming to think of it I don't want to change the "Object" word wallah ORVM. Why ? Because years later when all Toyota vehicles sport the "Objects" word wallah OVRMs - these old grammatically incorrect Toyota mirrors would have become collectors item. And would be the symbol of pucca Toyota original !
Naah...no way, a pack of wild horses would be able to drag me or Admiral to the ASC to change these lovely old mirrors !

Originally Posted by dot

Was away, missed lots of action on TBHP and this thread, had to do lots of catching up.
Loved the night/early morning crawling shots.

Yeah see what happens here when you are away even for a brief moment ?
Thanks for the kind words.

Originally Posted by dot

What are we talking about? There are quite a few things in my grasping range and definitely they are elixir of youth.

Say - truly you haven't about the curious case of Benjamin Button right ?

[parsh]

Originally Posted by Guderian

Hey Parsh, Coming to think of it I don't want to change the "Object" word wallah ORVM. Why ? Because years later when all Toyota vehicles sport the "Objects" word wallah OVRMs - these old grammatically incorrect Toyota mirrors would have become collectors item. And would be the symbol of pucca Toyota original !
Naah...no way, a pack of wild horses would be able to drag me or Admiral to the ASC to change these lovely old mirrors !

Ah yes. Come to think of the Antiquity status it will be by then, it does seem prudent to keep them on. I will surely keep them for the originality it reflects even if the itch that was will still be there.

About dragging Admiral for that or for any such matter, I doubt if any Horse Powers will stand up to Admiral's might complemented by your own.

Your snappazooming thru the night-life on streets is wonderful. So the Admiral got an eye for other things too not just riding proudly on the Streets of Mumbai.

[Guderian]

Originally Posted by mdsaab

1. had a lot of catching up to do, cause this TOGO channel has no Ads only pure content. Anyways. a little episode.
2. Here it is

Hi mdsaab,
1. Welcome back ! Aye, we (I and the all the contributors - which includes you too !) do try and keep the channel exciting and am glad all of us like it. Thanks for the words of encouragement.

2. That's a great snap. The white TFort also looks lovely I must say.
So decided anything on the T car ?

Originally Posted by parsh

1. Ah yes. Come to think of the Antiquity status it will be by then, it does seem prudent to keep them on. I will surely keep them for the originality it reflects even if the itch that was will still be there.

2. About dragging Admiral for that or for any such matter, I doubt if any Horse Powers will stand up to Admiral's might complemented by your own.

3. Your snappazooming thru the night-life on streets is wonderful. So the Admiral got an eye for other things too not just riding proudly on the Streets of Mumbai.

Hi parsh,
1. You bet. There'll be a lot of interest in these "grammar" mirrors just a couple of years down the line. And of course my nature too of trying to keep my vehicles as stock and original as possible. Thataway it retains a lot of charm.

2. Say - now after age, is my fragile/wispy/tender build being called into question ?!! Admiral's can be discussed as the specs(BHP/torque etc) are put up all over the place but I don't think I have put up any of my specs anywhere.

3. Thanks parsh. Catch up with you sometime on the streets of Mumbai. Day or night !

[Guderian]

Originally Posted by mdsaab

We were just about to leave when a customers T-Fort was driven in by some sales chap. We Couldn't take a look on the inside but admired from the outside. Walking around to the back i saw this, and boy did i like it. So here it is.

Just noticed from the TFort snap put up by mdsaab that it is an anniversary edition TFort.
First time I am having close look at one of these, at least of the rear end. (Not that I always keep having a close look at rears !)
Noticed a couple of things. What happened to the rear tail lamp unit ? Where is the red lamp cover ? Changed to clear tail lamps with a red bulb inside I notice. Are clear tail lamps legal ? Not very sure.
Also the 'Anniversary Edition' sticker which is placed normally on the right side is out of position and placed on the left side.
mdsaab - did you notice anything else on this TFort which was not standard ?

[nilanjanray]

Guderian,

Have you practiced changing the tyres of the Admiral yet? This is my first time with a SUV/big sized tyres, so wanted to know what inputs e.g. Dos and Don'ts - you might have given your experience with 2 SUVs.

[parsh]

Originally Posted by Guderian

Hi parsh,
1. You bet. There'll be a lot of interest in these "grammar" mirrors just a couple of years down the line. And of course my nature too of trying to keep my vehicles as stock and original as possible. Thataway it retains a lot of charm.

2. Say - now after age, is my fragile/wispy/tender build being called into question ?!! Admiral's can be discussed as the specs(BHP/torque etc) are put up all over the place but I don't think I have put up any of my specs anywhere.

3. Thanks parsh. Catch up with you sometime on the streets of Mumbai. Day or night !

1. Yes, the originality charm has a different ownership feeling altogether. I can say especially because of our beloved KB100 of 17 yrs still retaining all original parts except for the Fuel Filter which I had to retrofit with one from Rajdoot.

2. I would say that would be a rather peronal touch. But maybe no harm in revealing the specs too as they would complement Admiral only. But, what I would rather say is the WP might (Will Power) of a person as you as evident with the writings on the wall here would be enough to tame any other HPs.

3. Would certainly look forward to catching up sometime.

[Guderian]

Originally Posted by nilanjanray

Guderian,

Have you practiced changing the tyres of the Admiral yet? This is my first time with a SUV/big sized tyres, so wanted to know what inputs e.g. Dos and Don'ts - you might have given your experience with 2 SUVs.

Hi Nils, Haven't changed a tyre yet on Admiral. However have lowered the stepney couple of times - just to get the feel. It is cumbersome to an extent as mentioned earlier.
OK now combining both the Admiral's and Guderian the Scorp's experiences (where I have changed the tyres all by myself on all the occasions of flats and other reasons):

The points mentioned below are also keeping in mind your long trip to explore the wilds:

1. If you can - try and keep a floor jack (2 or better 3 tonne capacity) in the Bison. Floor jack (hydraulic) is much easier to use than the Toyota suppled screw jack. I had a 2 tonner on the Scorp. But gave it away along with the Scorp. Dash it !

2. Ensure once in a quarter that you lower the stepney and raise it back again - both for practice and to ensure that the Tommy rod (which is a three piece contraption and is a lousy piece of work - outsourced material) is in good condition, not corroded and the fastening bolt moves well etc. Plus use the event to check the inflation level of the stepney and top up. Keep the level atleast 2 PSI above normal.

2.a. Before you start the wrestling match check whether the damage to the tyre can be spotted. Why ? If it is a minor one - go straight to point 7 under general tips.

3. When changing a flat - first remove the T-ornament of the hub using the lug wrench (has a flat screw driver like end) and loosen the lugs.

4. In order of sequence - First lower the stepney (use Tommy rod - only two pieces to be fixed) and remove stepney away from under the vehicle then place the jack to raise the vehicle.

4. The jack should be placed in the exact spot as mentioned in the Owner's Manual. Axle point at the rear and the ladder frame point at the front. Since the beast is extremely heavy - placing it elsewhere could damage other parts/body line. Use Tommy rod on jack after fixing all three pieces.

5. Remove the punctured tyre/fix stepney. As done in cars. Lightly tighten lugs in X sequence/patten. Final tightening in circular pattern. Don't forget fixing the T ornament.
Please do recheck the torque of the lugs to ensure you have tightened it. In an SUV if you drive off under a mistaken belief that you have tightened the lugs fully and it hasn't been the damage can be enormous to the wheel studs and subsequently if the wheel comes off. All because of the weight of these creatures called SUVs. Cars fare better I guess if there are such slip ups. Damage is a little minor or the shakes can be felt much faster giving you time to react and fix it before greater damage is done.
Have seen a couple instances of Scorps loosing their wheels as the lugs weren't tightened by the ASCs ! It wasn't a pretty sight.

6. Lower vehicle / remove jack. Reduce the Tommy rod to 2 pieces to use it for raising stepney.

7. Place stepney underneath, fix chain end and raise.

Wash hands and feel muscles that have developed overnight by moving the mighty R17s !

General tips:
1. Always ensure that the Tommy rod is in good condition.

2. Don't over-torque anything.

3. If you find resistance at any point at any place don't use too much of pressure or else something may give way and you could be in a deeper mess with a buggered up lug nut or splintered Tommy rod or broken lug wrench. Have had quite a few such episodes where nuts have gotten misshapen, tools splintered etc. They way around these situations esp stuck lugs is to keep a can of WD 40 and spray on the studs/nuts and then try again, when you find much of a resistance.
Also as a preventive method, anytime when you remove tyres - for rotation etc ask them to daub the studs with a little oil before fixing back the tyres and torquing the lug nuts. Works like a charm when you have to remove them. Normally the studs are rusted.

4. Keep a folding type or normal (additional) lug wrench for emergencies. Use this to undo the lugs etc and use the company supplied wrench to operate the jack and lower the stepney etc.

5. Don't over-torque the lugs after fixing the stepney - removing it later could be a pain. Ask the tyrewallah also after repairing the puncture not to over do it.

6. Keep a kit of tubeless tyre puncture repair kit in the vehicle. Not that you may have to repair it yourself (very simple though) but in many lonely outposts of our country the tyre shops may not have it.

7. Keep a digital inflator (like the one I showed earlier in the thread) in the vehicle. In case after examining the tyre damage you feel it is a minor one then just inflate and drive on to a tyre-wallah, or if lucky, tyre-wali !

8. After fixing back everything - please ensure to secure all tools and tackles. Count and recount if required. Move the vehicle ahead and survey the battlefield before driving away.

9. Keep a spare tube for emergency. In case at a point the tyre can't be repaired or there is a huge tear, patch up the tyre from the inside, place in the tube and inflate. However a tip here is that the tube size should be one inch lesser than the tyre dimensions - to prevent folding on expansion due to heat generated on running. In the case of our TForts take 2 tubes of dimensions 265/65/R16. Not R 17. This was a tip from an old Army hand ! This 'tubed approach' can help you run the tyres till you come back to namma Bengaluru and a tyrewallah/wali of your choice to get a new set.
However in this mode - please do not exceed 100 KMPH. As tubes in a tubeless tyres can generate huge amounts of heat. I ran a tubed tubeless tyre (Now how confusing can that get ! Purists of the language will now ask - Once you insert a tube into a tubeless tyre how can it be called tubeless tyre ? - oh forget it, I am 'tyred' of explaining that ! You know what I mean.) on the Scorp for almost a year and high speeds on the expressways for short bursts ! Not recommended though.

10. Keep a pair of gloves in the vehicle.

Well, these are all I can remember now - shall add to the list as time goes by...

[dot]

After all these days of reading, I will go ahead to ask a silly question. I cant keep quiet any more, it is killing me.

What is the full form of mHaHas.

I guess it has mHawk and Scorpio hidden somewhere, maybe Mahindra also. Could never figure it out.

Originally Posted by Guderian

Say - truly you haven't about the curious case of Benjamin Button right ?

Ah, what life or what a curse.

[Guderian]

Originally Posted by dot

After all these days of reading, I will go ahead to ask a silly question. I cant keep quiet any more, it is killing me.
What is the full form of mHaHas.
I guess it has mHawk and Scorpio hidden somewhere, maybe Mahindra also. Could never figure it out.

Ha ha...har har de har !
Dot - that is the Scorpio group's moniker for M-Hawk ! Nothing else.

[nilanjanray]

Guderian,

What an informative post on tyre changing! Thanks - appreciate you going out of the way to help.

I practiced bringing down and winching up the stepney, but didn't like the process...also, felt that there is a good chance of getting scratches, the way everything is designed.

Questions:

1. Is floor jack a must, or at least strongly recommended?

2. How do I know what torque to use when tightening by hand? I usually moderately tighten the lugs, making sure that I don't overtighten it - but the process is one of gut feel, and not scientific. Perhaps a couple of downward pushes with my leg would be sufficient for the final tightening, provided I don't push too hard.

[mdsaab]

This particular T-Fort had a body kit on as well.
What i didn't like is that side step garnish type thing over the rear bumper. It looks pretty tacky, and not of great quality either.

These clear lenses are legal. You can take a look at the Captiva Extreme from Chevy which comes with clear type tail lights as standard fitment. I got a chance to see them lit too, and they did look stunning.

The Sticker on the wrong side is an observation, i can't comment on that though as i haven't seen too many anniversary editions.

What i did not like at Toyota was the lack of interest in selling the Fortuner. The first thing the sales chap said when i mentioned Fortuner was that i would have to wait over 9 months to get one. 9 months to get your hands on one of these babies And since we had come in asking for the Altis he kept pushing it in our face.

One for piece of info i forgot to share earlier.
He had shown us a DVD player that is Toyota OE for the Altis / Innova/ Fortuner. Pretty decent piece of equipment and could play from almost any source required like DVD, MP3, USB, SD card etc. It even came with MMI maps as standard. Forgot to click a snap of the same. The only draw back being that it costs 50K. But hey it will look like a stock setup, and not void your warranty as it does not require any wires to be cut.

@Guderian i know you like to keep your vehicle stock. And here it will retain the stock look, but your Son will be happy with USB playback and i guess that includes the IPOD too. So ask your Son to start saving. NOW!

[Guderian]

Originally Posted by nilanjanray

1. What an informative post on tyre changing! Thanks - appreciate you going out of the way to help.

2. I practiced bringing down and winching up the stepney, but didn't like the process...also, felt that there is a good chance of getting scratches, the way everything is designed.

3.Questions:

a. Is floor jack a must, or at least strongly recommended?

b. How do I know what torque to use when tightening by hand? I usually moderately tighten the lugs, making sure that I don't overtighten it - but the process is one of gut feel, and not scientific. Perhaps a couple of downward pushes with my leg would be sufficient for the final tightening, provided I don't push too hard.

Hi Nils (This moniker of yours takes me back to my School/College physics/chemistry classes - Niels Bohr...and we titled it Bohring lectures !),

1. The pleasure, sir, is entirely mine.

2. A real pain I agree. But has been the tradition with Toyota since Qualis days. And I positively hate the dangling chain I see on other vehicles. So reminds me of a chained pachyderm.
Admiral's stepney lanyard I have tucked it away into the side.

3a. Strongly recommended. You see when you use the screw jack - using the three piece Tommy is a real pain. At times you find it disjoining etc and rotating motion of the hand is not very energy efficient either. And the whole process is cumbersome - more effort is required. Best is the 'up and down' motion of the hand if using the floor jack or a good bottle jack.
However there is a practical problem as I realised later (though there is a solution). You see - both the jacks come in a box and since we travel with the rear most row down, to prevent rattling of seats - storage becomes an issue for normal city running.
So here is the solution. Carry the floor/bottle jack only when travelling outstation as then normally the seats would be up for accomodating the luggage and the jack box (not 'in the' !) can be comfortably accomodated. Secondly in the city, if you have a flat, you can easily summon help or use the screw jack on firm tarmac/concrete roads.
On the highways(soft shoulder area) or the wilds the floor jack will be a real boon.

3b. Yes it is by gut feel. But I would strongly recommend to use your feet only partly. Not by standing on it, as it then throws the full of your frame. Lugs could get damaged (I did it twice), tools could break (once), if you slip you could damage some body part (once - almost !).
However when torquing lug nuts, one way I have - to sense the time to stop torquing, is when the first metallic screech comes. However I try not to proceed till there but by gut feel stop short.

One tip here to generate adequate torque is to take, for your outstation trips, a 2 feet long, sturdy metal tube - like the ones the tyrewallah chokras use. This to slip over the wrench and give you more radius and thereby increasing the torque force/value. Easily would remove and fix the lug nuts.
When not in use thataway it also serves as a equipment for personal security !

Originally Posted by mdsaab

1. This particular T-Fort had a body kit on as well.
What i didn't like is that side step garnish type thing over the rear bumper. It looks pretty tacky, and not of great quality either.

2. These clear lenses are legal. You can take a look at the Captiva Extreme from Chevy which comes with clear type tail lights as standard fitment. I got a chance to see them lit too, and they did look stunning.

3. The Sticker on the wrong side is an observation, i can't comment on that though as i haven't seen too many anniversary editions.

4. What i did not like at Toyota was the lack of interest in selling the Fortuner. The first thing the sales chap said when i mentioned Fortuner was that i would have to wait over 9 months to get one. 9 months to get your hands on one of these babies And since we had come in asking for the Altis he kept pushing it in our face.

5. One for piece of info i forgot to share earlier.
He had shown us a DVD player that is Toyota OE for the Altis / Innova/ Fortuner. Pretty decent piece of equipment and could play from almost any source required like DVD, MP3, USB, SD card etc. It even came with MMI maps as standard. Forgot to click a snap of the same. The only draw back being that it costs 50K. But hey it will look like a stock setup, and not void your warranty as it does not require any wires to be cut.

6. @Guderian i know you like to keep your vehicle stock. And here it will retain the stock look, but your Son will be happy with USB playback and i guess that includes the IPOD too. So ask your Son to start saving. NOW!

Hi mdsaab,
6. Stop giving him ideas will you ?!!

5. Nice piece of information. But will not plonk any device in the Admiral which will be a source of distraction for the driver (me !) and take away the pleasure of driving.

4. I guess that will change now with the production going back full steam at the Toyota plant as per the news releases and ads ! Watch them now running after prospectives with T-Fort deliveries in 3 months.

3. Or may be I spotted an odd anniversary edition and the one you've seen is correctly badged !

2. OK. Noted. That's nice - though I'd prefer vehicle tail lamps to be in red. Possibly due to conditioning - clear lamps would give me a feeling of something not being right !

1. Garnish over the rear bumper is a pain for 2 reasons. On the couple T Forts I have seen it - I found it really garish. Secondly when the bumper gets bumped - which is common when reversing, even gently, this is the first thing that'll get misaligned, ripped off, twisted, whatever !

Thanks for the very informative post !

[nilanjanray]

Sales reps get very little commission from the Fortuner. A rep had told me that it is as little as Rs. 500. Valid reason for disinterest.

Regarding my earlier post: The thing is that the Fortuner manual states that 'only tighten the lugs till _____" - a specific figure. Now, owners and repair shops don't carry such tools here. So, I guess I will just do what I did for non-SUVs, using common sense while tightening. Should be pretty good for developing the lats and the traps.

[Guderian]

Originally Posted by nilanjanray

1. Sales reps get very little commission from the Fortuner. A rep had told me that it is as little as Rs. 500. Valid reason for disinterest.

2. Regarding my earlier post: The thing is that the Fortuner manual states that 'only tighten the lugs till _____" - a specific figure. Now, owners and repair shops don't carry such tools here. So, I guess I will just do what I did for non-SUVs, using common sense while tightening. Should be pretty good for developing the lats and the traps.

Hi Nils,
1. I find that very hard to believe. It is possible that the level of commission differs from dealer to dealer. In the Thane/Mumbai dealerships I think it is a juicy amount. And the team for selling CBUs/SUVs are different from the cars actually.

2. Right. Actually you can get that adjustable torque force wrench also easily and carry it with you instead of the metal tube. Very easy to use as well.
Oh yes - this too is long enough to serve as a personal weapon !