[skanchan95]

Originally Posted by wildon

For your information The New gen i20 steering rack cannot be fitted in the old gen i20 as the design is changed. so don't be get fooled.

Also if any part design is changed the part number will be also changed. in the case of old i20's the part number still the same.

I had the same doubt in my mind and I asked the APSM , Hyundai RO, Ahmedabad about the same. His reply was:

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: xxxxxx <xxxxxx@hmil.net>
Date: Mon, May 7, 2012 at 11:21 AM
Subject: RE: Concerns regarding your i20 GJ11Sxxxx.
To: Sandesh Kanchan <sxxx@gmail.com>
Cc: xxxxx@gmail.com


Dear Kanchan,

Both the steering racks of face lifted i20 and current part supplied for old i20 (Spare part replacement) is the same.

The new part is interchangeable with old one and old design has been stopped (Faced out), hence the same old part no: has been carried forward for the new ones also. Hence do not have any apprehension on the same.

Hope this clarifies your doubt.

Thanks & Regards
xxxxxxxx
APSM
Ahmedabad Area Office
Hyundai Motor India Ltd

----------------------------------
From: Sandesh Kanchan [mailto:xxxxxx@gmail.com]
Sent: Mon 5/7/2012 8:56 AM
To: xxxxxx
Cc: xxxxx; xxxx
Subject: Re: Concerns regarding your i20 GJ11Sxxxx.

Dear Mr xxxx,

Need one clarification - The steering rack which was installed in our car during your visit, is it from the new facelift i20 or the pre-facelift i20?

I ask this because the part number of the newly fitted Steering rack (Part No. 565001J950) is the same as the part no. of the steering rack that was fitted back in July 2010.

You had informed me in one of your previous mails that this new steering rack is a modified one( compared to previous steering racks), then shouldn't the part number of the new steering rack be different as well?

Would appreciate a clarification from you in this regard.

Regards,
Sandesh

After coming to know of quadbike's case, I can only hope & pray the rattle stays away in my car. That is call I can do as they were unwilling to give any guarantee that the issue has been solved or won't recur. If steering rattle issue does raise its ugly head again, well, its another round of and .

I haven't driven the car since driving it back from Junagadh on May 3rd, 2012. I should be reaching Veraval in 3-4 days time and get to drive the car. Will report on this thread after regular use of the car .

[wildon]

^^

The part numbers are not the same. call your service center and give both the numbers and they will tell which is part number is suitable for which model (old or new car). Also check whether new part number component is suitable to old i20. If the reply is yes then ask why they have not provided the new part number component ?

GEAR ASSY-STEERING Old Part numbers

1.2L Kappa - 565001J950

GEAR ASSY-STEERING New Part Numbers

1.2L Kappa - 565001J010

[skanchan95]

Originally Posted by wildon

^^

The part numbers are not the same. call your service center and give both the numbers and they will tell which is part number is suitable for which model (old or new car). Also check whether new part number component is suitable to old i20. If the reply is yes then ask why they have not provided the new part number component ?

GEAR ASSY-STEERING Old Part numbers

1.2L Kappa - 565001J950

GEAR ASSY-STEERING New Part Numbers

1.2L Kappa - 565001J010

I guess I was fooled. Knowing the Junagadh A.S.S, I don't think I am going to get any co-operation, if I ask.

Bill is as below:


Gear Assy Steering : 565001J950(Steering Rack)
Column & Shaft Assy - STR : 563101J990 ( Steering Column)

Let me see if the issue has really been fixed or not. IF it hasn't and the issue comes back, I will see if a "cheating" clause can be added to to court case as well.

[wildon]

^^

Write a mail to the same APSM of Hyundai by giving both the numbers which i given and see what he replies this time.

Column & Shaft Assy - STR : 563101J990 ( Steering Column)

New Part no is 563101J810 Steering Column +Shaft (Column Assy - Upper)

[skanchan95]

Well, the steering rattle issue in the car has raised its ugly head again .

Drove the car yesterday evening after coming back from Mangalore, took it on a rough patch of road and the highly irritating and characteristic "kat kat" sound started again for I don't know which nth number of time. I wanted to scream out in anger and frustration. All those replacements and time the car spent at the workshop fix tor try out the latest "fix" has gone to waste. No words can express how much frustrated and angry I am.

First they claimed that parts from new gen facelifted i20 were being installed in my car. Then when I found that replaced parts part numbers were same as the previous replaced parts and asked them about the same, I was told "not to have any apprehensions", that old part numbers have been carried forward to new parts and the parts are interchangeable.

From wildon's post, it is obvious that new gen i20's parts cannot be installed in my 2009 i20 and that the facelifted i20 part numbers are not the same as pre-facelift i20 part numbers. It won't take a genius to conclude that I was fooled, cheated and taken for a ride.

After the court's order to leave the car at the workshop for repairs, the car was left at the workshop with a hope that may be this time they have a working "fix" and the issue would get fixed atleast this time. Now, after nearly three years of struggling with Hyundai to get the issues fixed, we are back to square one.

I guess it is hopeless to expect Hyundai to ever find a working "fix" for this issue. No doubt those fellows at Om Hyundai along with the APSM tried and worked quite hard to fix the issue this time, but the bottom line is the issue has come back again barely 200 kms on the odometer after the latest "fix/replacements".

I could again make a video proving that the steering rattle problem has come back in the car and send it to Hyundai, but then I think what is the point of wasting my time & mental peace in doing so? Those guys in Hyundai are not bothered. It took them a court order to try the last "fix" in the car, not my repeated complaints. Even while trying out the latest fix, they were unwilling to give any guarantees that the issue will be solved.

I guess I will have to keep fighting them legally. I've had enough of co-operating with them and facing insults from them.

[sagarpadaki]

Sorry to hear that the problem has started to haunt again. There is nothing that can be done to it. Have to live with it that's all.

Even I had doubt when you said that the steering column and rack of the new i20 was installed on your car. Because its not possible since my SA told that the design itself is different.

Even my rack has been changed with a rack that is identical to the previous one. The part numbers are same for the old and new.

[skanchan95]

Originally Posted by sagarpadaki

Sorry to hear that the problem has started to haunt again. There is nothing that can be done to it. Have to live with it that's all.

Well, I shall continue to fight. It is Hyundai's fault that they were/are selling a car that has serious steering design defects. Why should the owners suffer because of the company's fault? I paid money to Hyundai expecting a trouble free car, which over the last two and a half years, it has certainly not been. Trying selling the car and one will know what kind of low prices are being quoted for an i20, largely because of its pathetic steering and A/C issues.

I may have axed my own legs by talking about the issue in my i20, as people already know there is this i20 in Veraval which has serious steering issues, but then I thought this is something which everyone should know and stay clear of buying an i20 to avoid a fate such as mine.

Originally Posted by sagarpadaki

Even I had doubt when you said that the steering column and rack of the new i20 was installed on your car. Because its not possible since my SA told that the design itself is different.

Even my rack has been changed with a rack that is identical to the previous one. The part numbers are same for the old and new.

Th biggest question is how long will they continue changing the racks(for free)? It his now an open secret that there is design defect in the i20's steering and Hyundai instead of owning it up, *may* ask the owners whose car is out of warranty, to pay up for steering rack/column replacements to supposedly "fix" the issue!!!!!

How's the steering holding up after the replacements in your car?

[shivasuma]

Originally Posted by skanchan95

Well, I shall continue to fight. It is Hyundai's fault that they were/are selling a car that has serious steering design defects. Why should the owners suffer because of the company's fault? I paid money to Hyundai expecting a trouble free car, which over the last two and a half years, it has certainly not been. Trying selling the car and one will know what kind of low prices are being quoted for an i20, largely because of its pathetic steering and A/C issues.

I may have axed my own legs by talking about the issue in my i20, as people already know there is this i20 in Veraval which has serious steering issues, but then I thought this is something which everyone should know and stay clear of buying an i20 to avoid a fate such as mine.



Th biggest question is how long will they continue changing the racks(for free)? It his now an open secret that there is design defect in the i20's steering and Hyundai instead of owning it up, *may* ask the owners whose car is out of warranty, to pay up for steering rack/column replacements to supposedly "fix" the issue!!!!!

How's the steering holding up after the replacements in your car?

Well, my i20 crdi's steering started rattling (again). Noticed it yesterday when I was driving on a bad patch of road that I use regularly. My car has done 32K, and the steering was "fixed" at 15K. So it was rattle-free for about 17K. I guess I will have to live with this rattle, but will anyways ask the service centre to fix it up.My car is out of warranty. Other than this, the car has done well.

[sagarpadaki]

My cars steering is holding up pretty well . But there is still this sound which comes from right under the steering when driven over rough roads. Its a muffled sound. Something similar to what to get when you beat a drum with a stick . Before there were two sounds. One this and the other caused due to rack. After the replacement of rack the other sound is gone but first one is still there.

According to the SA there is no column change specified for my I20 whose vin number lies in a specific range.

This is the last Hyundai car in my family for sure!!!.

[MutantX]

Originally Posted by skanchan95

Well, the steering rattle issue in the car has raised its ugly head again .

Why dont you ask Hyundai to refund your money. Please tell the court that Hyundai is not technically competent enough to resolve the issue and hence you will push for a refund or else ask the Judge to close the case with the final verdict - "Hyundai Motors does not have the expertise and is not competent enough to solve Hyundai i20's steering rattle". This verdict can be publish in all news papers including all famous online automotive forums. Revenge is soo sweet.

[skanchan95]

Originally Posted by MutantX

Why dont you ask Hyundai to refund your money.

As per the court case filed against Hyundai, we requested either of the following:

(A) To either fix the issue permanently

If (A) cannot be done and since it is the company's fault, then
(B) (i) Take the car back & refund the money that was paid to Hyundai
OR
(ii) Replace the car with a new i20
OR
(iii) If replacement i20 too suffers from the same issue, then replace it with a car from the next higher segment.

Originally Posted by MutantX

Please tell the court that Hyundai is not technically competent enough to resolve the issue and hence you will push for a refund or else ask the Judge to close the case with the final verdict - "Hyundai Motors does not have the expertise and is not competent enough to solve Hyundai i20's steering rattle". This verdict can be publish in all news papers including all famous online automotive forums. Revenge is soo sweet.

The latest part replacements done in the car were only after the court ordered Hyundai to look at the car and repair the issues without any delay, to the customer's satisfaction. The part replacements were certainly not because they had found a solution to the problem but because they may have been forced to do so because of the court's order.

It is now obvious that they are not being able to repair the issue, inspite of countless number of "experiments". Let the court decide on what is now very obvious - that it is a design defect and that it is not rectifiable(which many in Hyundai have accepted off the record). All this while, Hyundai has been doing nothing but simply shooting arrows in the dark, hoping that the issue would go away.

[selfdrive]

Originally Posted by MutantX

This verdict can be publish in all news papers including all famous online automotive forums. Revenge is soo sweet.

I dont see that happening. Almost all newspapers get too much of advertising spend from Hyundai to let this happen. Cases in point:
1. Skoda issues faced by another bhpian harishv. Car has not been returned in 3 or 4 years now.
2. VW Vento catches fire in Pune and the owner dies of severe burns. All media reporting has been hushed up

Of course this is only based on the threads I have seen here and news that I know from reliable sources. Who knows how many such issues happen that we dont know of?

Says a lot about the ethics in place at Skoda/ VW and Hyundai.

Originally Posted by skanchan95

The latest part replacements done in the car were only after the court ordered Hyundai to look at the car and repair the issues without any delay, to the customer's satisfaction. The part replacements were certainly not because they had found a solution to the problem but because they may have been forced to do so because of the court's order.

While I hope this is not the case, it just looks like Hyundai is going through the motions and following court orders with the expectations that the complainant (you) will lose patience and stop pursuing further.

A case for them is only a complaint or an opinion. Whereas replacing the car is equivalent to admitting to their incompetence and the shoddy build of the car itself. No offence to you, I am talking about the car in terms of unresolved issues. And based on your issues (and those of some others) we already knew Hyundai is only working on a stop gap fix till the warranty runs out. After that they will claim that you have to pay. Its in a way similar to the DSG gearbox issues that Skoda are having.

I doubt if cars will be sold in such a state in the developed world. one person sues and millions will be gone, not to mention loss of face. But this is India, so chalta hai, correct?

PS: I dont see why you want to use a Hyundai replacement, I think it would be better that you take that (if you get it), sell it and move to a more reliable car. I would not want to use another Hyundai car and keep having the same issues. I dont trust them at all now.

[skanchan95]

Originally Posted by selfdrive

While I hope this is not the case, it just looks like Hyundai is going through the motions and following court orders with the expectations that the complainant (you) will lose patience and stop pursuing further.

I know it and fully agree with you. Afterall, it took Hyundai more than a year just to "reply" to the case.

Originally Posted by selfdrive

A case for them is only a complaint or an opinion. Whereas replacing the car is equivalent to admitting to their incompetence and the shoddy build of the car itself. No offence to you, I am talking about the car in terms of unresolved issues. And based on your issues (and those of some others) we already knew Hyundai is only working on a stop gap fix till the warranty runs out. After that they will claim that you have to pay. Its in a way similar to the DSG gearbox issues that Skoda are having.

I doubt if cars will be sold in such a state in the developed world. one person sues and millions will be gone, not to mention loss of face. But this is India, so chalta hai, correct?

It depends a lot on which manufacturer you are dealing with. Companies like Hyundai, VW or SKoda are least bothered when such serious issues are reported. Case in point, there was case where reported here on T-bhp, wherein a brand new Swift(the facelifted one in "Z" trim) started giving engine trouble. Maruti took the car back & gave the owner a brand new replacement(of a different colour though).

Originally Posted by selfdrive

PS: I dont see why you want to use a Hyundai replacement, I think it would be better that you take that (if you get it), sell it and move to a more reliable car. I would not want to use another Hyundai car and keep having the same issues. I dont trust them at all now.

Believe me, I wouldn't ever want to own a Hyundai again. This experience is enough to make me stay away from Hyundai fro my next seven re-births . It was the opinion of our lawyer to insert those options and to be flexible.

While I am ware that this could take a long time, I really don't have any other choice(other than selling off the car, which would be a waste really, after with Hyundai)


Meanwhile more trouble:

1. This morning while trying to start the car, it refused to crank up. No electrical power to the speedometer console or the Dashboard MFD. Immediately suspected Battery trouble. Opened the bonnet, flicked the connectors and and tried again. The car started.

2. Clutch trouble/"Sticky" Clutch pedal - Just a couple hours back in middle of traffic in the market,the car started giving clutch trouble. I had just pressed the clutch pedal to slot the gear into first to move after stopping on the roadside. Releasing pressure off the clutch pedal, I felt the pedal wasn't coming back up, simultaneously pressing the accelerator pedal wasn't making the car move too. Tried pressing it again, it felt quite hard now and it felt as if it was stuck. Shut down the engine, restarted and pressed the clutch again again the clutch pedal felt quite hard and wasn't coming back up on releasing the pressure.

Sensing serious clutch trouble I called a nearby garage mechanic, he told me to "pump" the clutch pedal and try again. I gave it a try a and it seems to be working but now the clutch pedal has become "moody". Sometimes it feels quite hard and sometimes too soft(no resistance while pressing the clutch pedal). Completely releasing pressure of clutch pedal after shifting a gear causes a jerk. Its as if the clutch disengages a while after I lift full pressure off the clutch pedal.

Is the clutch on the verge of going kaput? I am planning to drive the car to Junagadh to have it checked. With some foreign guests coming in soon, I don't want to be get embarrassed if the car gets stuck in the middle of nowhere because the clutch issue.

[skanchan95]

As decided yesterday, I wanted to take the car to Junagadh today to have the clutch problem checked. I along wit ha couple of friends left Veraval at around 8 AM( hoping to reach the Hyundai Junagadh workshop by 10 AM).

On the way, the clutch seemed to be working fine with out any problems. After nearly 45 minutes of driving, I was wondering if it was really worth driving all the way to Junagadh to have the clutch checked as it seemed to be working fine.

At around 9 AM, trouble started just before reaching a place called Keshod( nearly half the way to Junagadh). After up shifting from 3rd to 4th gear(and after full clutch release), I felt a violent jerk. The car seemed to be running fine, so I ignored it. Then after upshifting from 4th to 5th, the same jerk was felt again. This time however, the RPM started shooting up and the speed started dropping. Sensing the same clutch trouble again, I decided to pull over slowly. The clutch felt extremely hard, hardest I have ever felt. It wasn't ready to move from its position. Sensing this could be something very wrong, I decided to see if any mechanic was available nearby.

Called up a friend, who had a Maruti contact in Keshod and he said he will reach in a few minutes.



The guy came, checked and said probably the master cylinder piston was stuck and it may have to be opened. We pushed the car all the way to his workshop. he opened it and found that here was a lot of dirt and residue inside the cylinder and said the part itself had failed. It was nearly 11 AM by now.






The master cylinder

We had no option but to ask for help from Om Hyundai, Junagadh. To their credit, a Service Advisor and a mechanic were promptly sent in their car, a Santro (along with master cylinder and brake oil).It took them an hour to reach Junagadh. After reaching at around 12:15, the Hyundai mechanic quickly installed the new master cylinder and tried to see if the clutch was working normally again. After several attempts, it didn't work. He then looked around the clutch pedal and found that the connecting rod connecting the clutch pedal to the master cylinder had broken. He even showed me that broken part where the rod was supposed to go in.

Since they did not bring that connecting rod( and probably didn't have it in stock), they said they will have to tow the car to Junagadh. I looked around to see if any arrangement could be made to tow the car. To my surprise, the Hyundai SA said that they will tow the car behind their Santro and they had arrangements to tow it.


Preparing to tow

The SA said since they did not have the connecting rod in stock ,they will have to source it from other Hyundai workshops in nearby cities. After I signed on the Repair Order, they left with my i20 in tow. We left back for Veraval in a GSRTC bus.

The part should probably arrive by tomorrow morning/after noon. The car should be ready by tomorrow evening/day after tomorrow morning.

[skanchan95]

Got the car back today.



1. Clutch failure : The clutch issue was addressed under warranty - Clutch Master Cylinder & Clutch release Assembly replaced(marked in Blue). Each replaced part would have costed around Rs 3000 odd If it was to be paid from my pocket. Changed the Brake oil, which was chargeable. Cost - Rs 242.40(Brake Fluid), Rs 1200(EMS/Towing Charges- charged at Rs 12 per km)

2. Steering Rattle Issue : They have tried something else this time. They have changed the steering rack(again) and the universal coupling assembly(marked in Yellow). Steering Rattle has disappeared for the time being. Cost - Rs 0



3. Wiper Blades replacement : With monsoon just around the corner, I had asked for all three wiper blades to be replaced. The rear wiper blade costs a bit more than the front ones.- Cost : Rs 1152.08

4. Wheel Well Plug : The plug in the rear wheel well(driver's side) was plugged in. - Cost : Rs 21.89
Before:


After: