[pradster]

Originally Posted by SilentEngine

Secondly, he has cheated yes, but then so did Alonso. If nobody has any problem with Alonso who was involved in spying technical data from a rival team, why should Piquet be any different?

Its not about being a saint here, on the contrary its about cheating properly. Its an open secret in F1 that everyone cheats, all teams would kill to get a 0.0001 second advantage , regardless of the means.
More pertinent than the ability to cheat is the ability to keep mum about it, while Piquet did the former ,as have many others Hamilton, Schumacher, Prost, Senna Etc, he did not do the latter and effectively broke F1's code in the process of getting back at his former team.

Despite his "immunity" his ratting out means that no prospective F1 team principal would be able to put his whole trust and faith in him and if you cant trust a driver, you simply will not employ that driver.

The only way he could drive is if papa piquet buys into a team, though I am willing to be surprised.

[SilentEngine]

Originally Posted by pradster

Its not about being a saint here, on the contrary its about cheating properly. Its an open secret in F1 that everyone cheats, all teams would kill to get a 0.0001 second advantage , regardless of the means.
More pertinent than the ability to cheat is the ability to keep mum about it, while Piquet did the former ,as have many others Hamilton, Schumacher, Prost, Senna Etc, he did not do the latter and effectively broke F1's code in the process of getting back at his former team.

Despite his "immunity" his ratting out means that no prospective F1 team principal would be able to put his whole trust and faith in him and if you cant trust a driver, you simply will not employ that driver.

The only way he could drive is if papa piquet buys into a team, though I am willing to be surprised.

Thats a strange argument. There is no such F1 code anywhere. You are saying, it is OK to cheat, but accepting that you have cheated is not. I don't agree with your reasoning at all.
Btw, he did not go against his team. He went against two individuals in the team.

Alonso also did the same thing as Piquet. Going against his team boss (Ron Dennis) only when he thought it would benefit him. If Ron Dennis had made him the No.1, he would have kept quiet and probably we wouldn't have known about Spygate at all. Who knows, Alonso would have probably become WDC in 2007!

So If Ferrari is willing to accept Alonso, why should Piquet be considered different?

[KRRaj]

Originally Posted by SilentEngine

So If Ferrari is willing to accept Alonso, why should Piquet be considered different?

Alonso is a 2 time WDC, Piquet noewhere near fast even to get wins. That is the difference

[pradster]

Originally Posted by SilentEngine

Thats a strange argument. There is no such F1 code anywhere. You are saying, it is OK to cheat, but accepting that you have cheated is not. I don't agree with your reasoning at all.
Btw, he did not go against his team. He went against two individuals in the team.

Alonso also did the same thing as Piquet. Going against his team boss (Ron Dennis) only when he thought it would benefit him. If Ron Dennis had made him the No.1, he would have kept quiet and probably we wouldn't have known about Spygate at all. Who knows, Alonso would have probably become WDC in 2007!

So If Ferrari is willing to accept Alonso, why should Piquet be considered different?

Essentially, yes. Teams have worked around the rules ever since formula 1 has existed. Imagine if you were a team principal, "working" those rules to your benefit, would you hire a driver who cannot be trusted with the inside knowledge?
Remember spygate? Do you believe the tosh that lewis hamilton had no knowledge that ferrari technology was being pilfered and installed in his car? What about the incident involving him overtaking trulli under yellow flag?

As far as going against the team as a whole vs going against two individuals, He went against the team, Flavio Briatore was the backbone of Team Renault which had evolved from benneton. The FIA chose to suspend the two gentlemen as scapegoats but Piquets comments basically were against the team.

As for Alonso getting hired vs Piquet the reasoning is cold and simple. Alonso is a former champ who knows how to win. Period

[SilentEngine]

Originally Posted by pradster

Essentially, yes. Teams have worked around the rules ever since formula 1 has existed. Imagine if you were a team principal, "working" those rules to your benefit, would you hire a driver who cannot be trusted with the inside knowledge?
Remember spygate? Do you believe the tosh that lewis hamilton had no knowledge that ferrari technology was being pilfered and installed in his car? What about the incident involving him overtaking trulli under yellow flag?

As far as going against the team as a whole vs going against two individuals, He went against the team, Flavio Briatore was the backbone of Team Renault which had evolved from benneton. The FIA chose to suspend the two gentlemen as scapegoats but Piquets comments basically were against the team.

Team do find loop holes and work along those lines all the time. But spying/fixing etc are in a completely different league. There is a thin line between the two. It entirely depends on how much you are willing to bend those rules to your benefit, and what you consider as acceptable.
I wouldn't hire a driver who shares the team's technical info/secrets. If I am team boss similar to Flavio Briatore who asks his drivers to crash, I wouldn't hire Piquet. But if I am a team boss who thinks what Flavio did was wrong, then I wouldn't have any problem in signing Piquet as long as he fits other requirements (on track performance)

Originally Posted by KRRaj

Alonso is a 2 time WDC, Piquet noewhere near fast even to get wins. That is the difference

Originally Posted by pradster

As for Alonso getting hired vs Piquet the reasoning is cold and simple. Alonso is a former champ who knows how to win. Period

So there you go, if Piquet was half decent, we would have seen people tripping over their own feet to sign him. Nobody cares if you cheat or not

[pradster]

Originally Posted by SilentEngine

So there you go, if Piquet was half decent, we would have seen people tripping over their own feet to sign him. Nobody cares if you cheat or not

F1 is a cold hard world. If Massa isnt quick enough ( Wait for the f2007 tests coming up, his times will be compared to schumi) he might end up losing his seat!
If Piquet was any good he would not have been replaced with a 19 year old!

[Mpower]

Piquet Jr is going to be testing with Nascar Truck series team shortly.

I think he figured better to go someplace where the've never heard of Formula1.

[KRRaj]

Originally Posted by Mpower

Piquet Jr is going to be testing with Nascar Truck series team shortly.

I think he figured better to go someplace where the've never heard of Formula1.

Crashes would be overlooked there as well. Its all part of the game there I believe

[McLaren Rulez]

Originally Posted by pradster

F1 is a cold hard world. If Massa isnt quick enough ( Wait for the f2007 tests coming up, his times will be compared to schumi) he might end up losing his seat!
If Piquet was any good he would not have been replaced with a 19 year old!

A nineteen year old, who isn't particularly better, it has to be said. Grosjean has been pretty poor and somewhere around Piquet's standard. The other rookie, Alguesuari, is worse than Bourdais.

But coming back to Piquet, it makes one wonder why he spilt his guts in the first place. If he'd been mum, he might have had another drive. But exposing the incident has actually killed his career. I'm all in favour of confessions but the smart thing would have been to take it to the grave. He still confessed despite knowing it would end his career and that tells you something about how much he must have hated Flavio. Which in turn, tells you how brutally bad Flavio's treatment to him must have been.

[pradster]

Originally Posted by McLaren Rulez

.... Which in turn, tells you how brutally bad Flavio's treatment to him must have been.

I shall quote Flavio Briatore and you can judge for yourself

"Nelsinho used to live with this gentleman: the nature of their relationship is unknown. His father was very worried about the relationship Nelsinho used to have with this 50-year-old man. They used to live together, and his father asked me to intervene...I made this gentleman not come to races anymore, and I made Nelsinho move from Oxford to London in a building where I live, in order to keep him under control"

This statement, however, was made after the whole scandal broke, but is interesting anyway

[PAVAN KADAM]

Calling Piquet a cheat is not Done! He had Guts to stand up against the one's doing Wrong.

Why ....Can anyone explain??????

He was slow, but running alongside Alonso, he was supposed to be slow, and there are many others who are worse than him.

He did as told and when he was at the recieving end, he naturally spilled the rotting beans within ING team.

Look what happened, Piquet was chucked out of Renault and some time later the team gets suspended.

WHO's a CHEAT here.

Good, he's found a new team, He's young,lets wish him well for the future.

[bluge_19]

Actually Nelson Piquet Jr. is in no way going to drive for Manor F1. Since Richard Branson (Virgin) is going to be the main sponsor for the South Yorkshire team Manor F1 he has clearly mentioned that he wouldn't sign a cheat as his driver. But lets see how things work out, maybe he'll find another time in F1 but there are rumors that Piquet is trying for Nascar's pickup truck racing series.

[sanjayatarizona]

Agreed, he was not a cheat, just Plain Dumb. The "Teacher Teacher he pinched me " attitude just screwed up his F1 career, which was mostly,courtesy of his famous surname anyways, his GP2 second place not withstanding.

My 2 cents...

[pradster]

[quote=PAVAN KADAM;1522024]
WHO's a CHEAT here.
quote]

I shall quote some more information here from Nilsinho's interview to a brazilian magazine the analysis is writen by one of my favorite motoring writers AC.

"“Foi no próprio dia da corrida, no domingo mesmo, algumas horas antes da prova. ...Eles (Flavio Briatore e Pat Symonds) me chamaram para conversar, não estavam muito confortáveis com a situação Mas precisavam e queriam muito que isso (o acidente) acontecesse. ...”

"It was on the day of the race, the very Sunday, a few hours before the start. They (Briatore-Symonds) called me to talk, they were not comfortable with the situation but wanted very much for it ( the accident) to happen"

Symonds and crucially, Alan Premane the apparent Witness X who's testimony was seen as the nail in Briatore's coffin, claimed that A) it was Piquet's idea and B) Piquet brought it up on the Saturday of the race.

Now, both realities cannot be right, can they?"

As one of the commentators points out, this would be interesting if this goes into a criminal court. Then we'll know

Originally Posted by PAVAN KADAM

Good, he's found a new team, He's young,lets wish him well for the future.

He is racing trucks, in a circle, for rednecks in the american south. I cant see that as being any good for him or for that matter any budding or former F1 driver.

[McLaren Rulez]

Originally Posted by pradster

He is racing trucks, in a circle, for rednecks in the american south. I cant see that as being any good for him or for that matter any budding or former F1 driver.

Yep, its certainly not good for his career but I think its more of an activity by the side till the hoohah dies down. Then I can see him trying to make a return. Until then, he's having some good old fun.