[scooby05]

Originally Posted by Dippy

Just two days to go for the hearing. Earlier Mclaren were not punished because there was no evidence. Now there is. About the Ferrari info being used on the Mclaren cars..

Think about it 2006 season. Mclaren dont win a single race all through the season. bad reliability and Kimi blows up in every other race.

2007 season. Mclaren are winning and how. Super reliability on both the cars. From no where lat year they are heading to win both the championships this season.

And we still think Ferrari document info wasnt used in the Mclaren cars? Think about it.

Spot on Dippy, people need to understand this and that Bernie is not supporting Ferrari for no reason!! He knows and understands their capabilities and on which the future of F1 depends Ferrari is a thoroughbred while renault is a diamond and maclaren a star!! what matters in Speed?? anyones take IMO.

[Gordon]

Originally Posted by Dippy

2007 season. Mclaren are winning and how. Super reliability on both the cars. From no where lat year they are heading to win both the championships this season.

And we still think Ferrari document info wasnt used in the Mclaren cars? Think about it.

C'mon Dippy, don't ground them sooo badly. Can't credit McLaren's wins to espionage only. They surely must've also worked hard for it. Cheated somewhat but stillll.

[Dippy]

Originally Posted by nitrous

Now,there's a fellow tifosi talking.
Give it to them,dippy!!

Its not the question of just being a tifosi. Just facts. Most of the time it is said that the FIA, Bernie and co. all favour Ferrari. If one remembers, Michael Schumacher was such a champion and the Ferrari such a good car that the FIA had to change the rules to stop that one man and his team from winning. And they succeeded. Had the rules been the same I have no doubts that Michael would have a an 8th championship in his bag. Schumacher parked his car at Monaco on the last turn. They sent him to the back of the grid. Fonso ruined Hammys qualifying. They sent him to 6th on the grid. He too should have been sent to the back of the pack.

I am not a Mclaren hater just because I'm a Ferrari lover. I always appreciate it when Mclaren or any other team win a race when the driver drives well like we saw at Monza on Sunday. Even though I'm not an Alonso fan, full credit to him to win in the way he did.

But when it comes to this saga of Ferrari documents being used by Mclaren and all that, one has to look into every detail. Again just accusing the FIA of favouring Ferrari is silly. If they had to do that they could have very well punished Mclaren at the last hearing. Then there would be no hearing on this coming Thurday in the first place. So lets just stop accusing everyone and wait for the result of Thursday shall we?

[Dippy]

Originally Posted by Gordon

C'mon Dippy, don't ground them sooo badly. Can't credit McLaren's wins to espionage only. They surely must've also worked hard for it. Cheated somewhat but stillll.

Nope I'm not trying to put them down badly or anything. Sure they must have worked on their cars. But a sudden turn around makes you wonder. As far as I know apart from hammy's puncture they really havent had a major failure this season.

Just my thoughts.

[2theMax]

Originally Posted by Dippy

. But a sudden turn around makes you wonder.
.

Ahem... agree with you dippy , look where last years championship car is currently , and mclaren's werent doing great last year as well , cant believe hamilton and alonso could have made such a big difference to the team .

[extreme_torque]

Even though I am a Ferrari fan but Mclaren has been working really hard on its car lately.... I still remember distinctly how mclaren in their bad phase were trying hard to come out of it, with pep messages for the employees to be read everywhere... even on the shoe soles!

Though it must be said that the turnaround has been a little too fast amd too good to believe, partly helped by the fact that they have awesome driver's in fonso and hammy (or is it the car which is making them look so good), while kimi was struggling throughout the year, sometimes going out of the race due to reliablility issues during the last few laps of the race.
All we can do it wait....

[RacingForIndia]

Originally Posted by scooby05

Spot on Dippy, people need to understand this and that Bernie is not supporting Ferrari for no reason!! He knows and understands their capabilities and on which the future of F1 depends Ferrari is a thoroughbred while renault is a diamond and maclaren a star!! what matters in Speed?? anyones take IMO.

Ferrari didn’t win a world championship for almost a decade till Schumacher came abroad and did it for them in 2000.
Prior to that it was Williams, McLaren and Benneton (via cheating – Flavio at his best) who used to win. If Ferrari is such a thoroughbred as you claim it is, please explain why they took so long to win a title in F1.

[csentil]

Yes the same argument for Renault also. Who was winning World Championships continuously ? Ferrari. Suddenly Alonso and Renault start doing well.. Hmm. something fishy there. :-)

Infact when Raikkonen was with McLaren in 2005, they did pretty well, just a few glitches here and there and some bad luck cost Raikkonen the world championship that year.

Its a media circus, orchestrated by Bernie & his gang to spice up F1. Nothing like a scandal to get the ratings up. :-)

[Rtech]

If Ferrari is such a thoroughbred as you claim it is, please explain why they took so long to win a title in F1.

umm...Ferrari have more Constructors championship titles than any other current team. 14 to Mclarens 8. Lets not doubt Ferrari's motorsport heritage here! Mclaren is just as great, but Ferrari has a bit more history associated with it.

[speedzak]

Have you ever watched a circus or a magic show without some suspense, humour and drama? t's all part of the circus and magic shows. If you forget the surroundings and enjoy the show.

[Rtech]

LoL. Well put in a nutshell there speedy! Lets just enjoy the show!

[nitrous]

Originally Posted by racingindia

If Ferrari is such a thoroughbred as you claim it is, please explain why they took so long to win a title in F1.

Let me explain :U don't know the history of F1.

[khaadu75]

Originally Posted by speedzak

Have you ever watched a circus or a magic show without some suspense, humour and drama? t's all part of the circus and magic shows. If you forget the surroundings and enjoy the show.

Thats what its eventually turning into .... a circus !! But it will really be interesting to see what eventually comes out on the hearing .... if they do get BANNED then F1 would be the ones to suffer -- after all it ain't a small team thats getting banned .

And give a second to Hamilton right now .. it aint his fault in any way as what happened behind the scenes has got nothing to do with him and he may ( like a lot of guys here are wishing for ) get stripped of all the points coz his team was found to have cheated .

Whatever the outcome ... it surely will be interesting

[im_srini]

Hi RacingForIndia, to set the facts straight... When Schumi clinched the driver's title in 2000, a Ferrari driver won the driver's championship after a gap of 21 years, the previous Ferrari driver to win the championship was Scheckter in 1979. When Ferrari won the constructor's trophy in 1999, their last constructors' win was in 1983. Anyways, Schumi joined Ferrari in 1996, & it took the combined efforts of Todt, Brawn, Barnard, & Schumi, a couple of years to make Ferrari champions again, it surely wasn't done overnight, unlike McLaren this year ! Of course it isn't fair to accuse McLaren without proof, for all we know the spy stuff could've been between Stepney & Coughlan only, it's rumored that both approached Honda for jobs.

The thing that irks me is, Coughlan possessed the 800-page document for several months before his possession of it became public. And he's McLaren's chief designer ! Is it improbable to think that he would've made good use of it (other than as a paper-weight or as a door stop) ? If Stepney was brazen enough to exploit his position in the team & walk out with such a huge document, is it also improbable to think that he had passed on other "cheats-sheets" to Coughlan previously ? If the enterprising photo-copier guy (God bless him) hadn't alerted Ferrari, no one would've been the wiser, & McLaren would've quietly used their "magical mirror" into the F2007.

I personally feel the FIA & everybody else who think McLaren is innocent are short-sighted, or stupid. Do you really have to copy a design to be found guilty ? McLaren could've optimized Ferrari's design, or could've come up with a design meant specifically to disrupt a following Ferrari. And like Dippy, I too take offense to the fact that Schumi was sent to the back of the grid of last years' Monaco GP, when for a brazen depiction of the same, Alonso was let off with just a slap on the wrist ! Yeah right, the FIA sure is biased towards Ferrari !?!

P.S. I don't think Schumi deliberately 'parked' his car at Rascasse last year - so there !

[maddy42]

Well only thing i got to say is this seaeson has been awesome with some competition going on rather than a one sided event...seeing competition between same teammates is the best part of it all....well mclaren just hope for the best thursday is soooo close....But really feel there is something fishy like the others over a team which had very unreliable fast cars the prev season but this season they are finishers in all races!!!oops almost all races....Want alonso to win this season as i feel my fav Kimi doesnt have much of a chance as alonso was the guy who didnt have much support as he claims.....well Juicy week ahead...ciao