City gets some Civic sense, Civic gets a new sense.

appuchan · 8th September 2009, 15:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by MileCruncher

Except the rear tail lamp, nothing seems to be different from the old Civic.

The front grill lip is much thicker and squarish with a bigger H logo.

Quote:

Originally Posted by vid6639

What about the suspension and GC?

I think I'm going to see many new civics with scraped front bumpers going by the bumper design with the integrated skirt.

I dont see any mention of changes in suspension, engine or drivetrain. So status quo...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ym-enjn

Not much interest in new civic here (not even one full page complete on launch day). Is it so or I am missing the main thread?

Most of the information are already "pre-released" and "pre-discussed" here. So maybe there is nothing more to write... Interestingly, they have done/added nothing to compete with Altis in terms of equipment levels except for a feeble attempt with cruise control which in any case no one asked for.

tanwaramit · 8th September 2009, 16:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by oss

Try and get some info on the City upgrades & expected launch date.

City is going to be quite an update on exterior and interiors - not just a facelift and it is going to be launched soon, very soon -- As said by President & CEO, Honda Siel Cars.

Sadly, no dates were given.

Was surprised to hear that Jazz was selling as per Honda's expectations.

No updates on CRV.

Prices PPT attached.

Also notice the audio control + songs changer control given at rear arm rest. Surprisingly this is not given on steering wheel.

inferno · 8th September 2009, 16:25

I spotted this on their website
Honda Car India :: Civic

"2. Upper-mount position shifted up
Improved lateral rigidity of wheel and stability"

this is on rear shock absorbers
So, I guess GC problem would be solved now.

oss · 8th September 2009, 16:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by tanwaramit

City is going to be quite an update on exterior and interiors - not just a facelift and it is going to be launched soon, very soon -- As said by President & CEO, Honda Siel Cars.

Sadly, no dates were given.

That's interesting, though i seriously doubt it. Let us wait and see.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tanwaramit

Prices PPT attached.

What is this Elegence & Inspire? Some sort of body kit?

tanwaramit · 8th September 2009, 16:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by inferno

this is on rear shock absorbers
So, I guess GC problem would be solved now.

Not so soon. On asked about the bottoming out, the CEO said, they are aware of this issue for cars in India thanks to our speedbreakers, they are studying it so that appropriate design changes can be done, as these design changes need to be tested thoroughly. So it will take some time for it to be available for our speed breakers, till then jump carefully

OSS: the difference is with body kits and other interiors too. Two variants of Manual version and one variant of Automatic. The topline gets better leather seats, Indicator OSRVM spoilers everywhere etc etc

asr245 · 8th September 2009, 16:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by appuchan

The front grill lip is much thicker and squarish with a bigger H logo.

Probably to boost their and the owners ego with a bigger 'H'. Tail lamps look different. I preferred the old ones. So what else is new besides a few cosmetics? and what have they done to increase the price?

mkc15 · 8th September 2009, 17:33

[Not sure why my post got dropped last time, reposting the same]

"Avg Fuel Consumption Indicator" is a new useful feature in CIVIC. Also, "Shift Lock" is mentioned for the AT model. But not sure if its any different from existing AT.

Car Fan · 8th September 2009, 18:05

What happens to stocks of the previous Civic model? Do they get sold off at a discount?

theragingbull · 8th September 2009, 18:25

What do they mean by the new Smokey headlights on the Civic?

Quote:

Originally Posted by oss

What is this Elegance & Inspire? Some sort of body kit?

Yep! The inspire package gets spoilers

CBlazer · 8th September 2009, 18:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by tanwaramit

City is going to be quite an update on exterior and interiors - not just a facelift and it is going to be launched soon, very soon -- As said by President & CEO, Honda Siel Cars.

Mr. President makes it sound like fog lamps, alloys and better quality interiors are phenomenal offerings in the 9-10L bracket. Typical Honda!

oss · 8th September 2009, 18:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by CBlazer

Mr. President makes it sound like fog lamps, alloys and better quality interiors are phenomenal offerings in the 9-10L bracket. Typical Honda!

In the name of Elegance (!!) package, if they can charge 35k for doorstep garnish, door visors & parking sensors, they can increase the price of ANHC by another lakh and might wish to get away with it too.

The difference between S-MT & V-MT of Civic is 90k, and interms of features, the difference is just fog lamps, leather seats & cruise control

I don't know what are they smoking these days.

csentil · 8th September 2009, 18:56

Ha ha ha.. Typical Honda. Do a lot of cosmetic change and charge a premium. I'm glad I bought the 1.8S AT which is no longer available for a very good price almost 2 and half years back. At today's prices, especially in Bangalore with its high tax rates I wouldn't have been able to afford it!!!

Parm · 8th September 2009, 19:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by theragingbull

What do they mean by the new Smokey headlights on the Civic?

Yep! The inspire package gets spoilers

the old civic had the chrome inserts in the headlights, now the chrome has been replace by black smoke finish. it looks like as if the civic has "kaajal" in its eyes!

silver civic=old model
blue civic=new model

entropy · 8th September 2009, 21:20

The leather quality seems to have improved (At least from the pics). Earlier it was much coarser grain and felt a bit hard to touch.

mkc15 · 8th September 2009, 22:03

90K difference between S-MT and V-MT is probably not so bad. Fog lights are around 18K, leather could be around 40K (considering that the reviews say the quality is good), turn-indicator-integrated ORVM could be another 5K!, so overall upto 65K for these 3 extras and the rest for cruise-control and brand royalty!

Between V-MT and V-AT its 75K which is kind of fair as auto gearbox is quite complex and expensive. (Altis VL is costlier than GL by 90K, for the difference of AT and cruise control)

Now let me compare the pricing of Altis. For AT, Honda seems to have the edge in terms of technology over Altis due to 5-speed-paddle-shift gearbox alone, and the 40K diff between Altis VL and V-AT seems not so bad. For MT, Altis surely has the edge in terms of VFM, and the 58K diff between Altis GL and V-MT seems huge.

Now about features(from cost perspective), Civic has independent suspension and double wishbones in particular, which are complex and expensive (ofcourse, Honda didnt probably tune it well for Indian roads). I dont know the cost difference b/w double wishbone vs. torsion beam as in Altis, but atleast from the articles on the net it appears to be quite considerable (both implementation and testing). Civic has BA which again would cost something. Altis (GL/VL) has luxury add-ons like HID + head-lamp-washers + auto-dimming-mirrors + auto head-lights + auto-wipers + power-seats, which collectively would compensate and surely exceed the cost of the above.

Though I agree that Civic is overpriced over Altis, IMO its quite a bit over-perceived and taken out of proportion. The reason I see is that, when Civic was introduced in 2006, it was quite a revolution in lower D segment (especially with older generation Corolla close to its end-of-life). At that time, the pricing of Civic with all its features seemed like a deal. So the expectation from Honda has generally been pretty high (especially among enthusiasts)

Regardig the price increase of ~30K for the facelifted Civic, USB port + Cruise-control + fuel-consumption-indicator - CD changer may come upto around 20K and the rest for styling and rear-suspension tuning and styling (+ nominal increase as with any facelist/upgrade). So its probably not as bad as it appears. I just hope they have sorted out the suspension bottoming-out issue successfully. Honda is probably not so stupid, but they are being greedy here :-) Not providing steering mounted controls is really a cheap trick to reduce cost. I fail to see any possible reason/limitation of the HU in this regard, if at all.

Do I sound like owing a Civic already or biased ? I dont own either and in the process of deciding between Altis/Civic. still tallying...

Now its time for brickbats :-)

8th September 2009, 16:25	#138
inferno BHPian Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Delhi Posts: 208 Thanked: 4 Times View My Garage	I spotted this on their website Honda Car India :: Civic "2. Upper-mount position shifted up Improved lateral rigidity of wheel and stability" this is on rear shock absorbers So, I guess GC problem would be solved now.
	() Thanks

8th September 2009, 17:33	#142
mkc15 BHPian Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Bangalore Posts: 317 Thanked: 94 Times	[Not sure why my post got dropped last time, reposting the same] "Avg Fuel Consumption Indicator" is a new useful feature in CIVIC. Also, "Shift Lock" is mentioned for the AT model. But not sure if its any different from existing AT.
	() Thanks

8th September 2009, 18:05	#143
Car Fan BHPian Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Delhi Posts: 100 Thanked: 68 Times	What happens to stocks of the previous Civic model? Do they get sold off at a discount?
	() Thanks

8th September 2009, 18:56	#147
csentil Senior - BHPian Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Bangalore Posts: 1,350 Thanked: 39 Times View My Garage	Ha ha ha.. Typical Honda. Do a lot of cosmetic change and charge a premium. I'm glad I bought the 1.8S AT which is no longer available for a very good price almost 2 and half years back. At today's prices, especially in Bangalore with its high tax rates I wouldn't have been able to afford it!!!
	() Thanks

8th September 2009, 21:20	#149
entropy BHPian Join Date: May 2007 Location: Lost Posts: 405 Thanked: 51 Times	The leather quality seems to have improved (At least from the pics). Earlier it was much coarser grain and felt a bit hard to touch.
	() Thanks

8th September 2009, 22:03	#150
mkc15 BHPian Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Bangalore Posts: 317 Thanked: 94 Times	90K difference between S-MT and V-MT is probably not so bad. Fog lights are around 18K, leather could be around 40K (considering that the reviews say the quality is good), turn-indicator-integrated ORVM could be another 5K!, so overall upto 65K for these 3 extras and the rest for cruise-control and brand royalty! Between V-MT and V-AT its 75K which is kind of fair as auto gearbox is quite complex and expensive. (Altis VL is costlier than GL by 90K, for the difference of AT and cruise control) Now let me compare the pricing of Altis. For AT, Honda seems to have the edge in terms of technology over Altis due to 5-speed-paddle-shift gearbox alone, and the 40K diff between Altis VL and V-AT seems not so bad. For MT, Altis surely has the edge in terms of VFM, and the 58K diff between Altis GL and V-MT seems huge. Now about features(from cost perspective), Civic has independent suspension and double wishbones in particular, which are complex and expensive (ofcourse, Honda didnt probably tune it well for Indian roads). I dont know the cost difference b/w double wishbone vs. torsion beam as in Altis, but atleast from the articles on the net it appears to be quite considerable (both implementation and testing). Civic has BA which again would cost something. Altis (GL/VL) has luxury add-ons like HID + head-lamp-washers + auto-dimming-mirrors + auto head-lights + auto-wipers + power-seats, which collectively would compensate and surely exceed the cost of the above. Though I agree that Civic is overpriced over Altis, IMO its quite a bit over-perceived and taken out of proportion. The reason I see is that, when Civic was introduced in 2006, it was quite a revolution in lower D segment (especially with older generation Corolla close to its end-of-life). At that time, the pricing of Civic with all its features seemed like a deal. So the expectation from Honda has generally been pretty high (especially among enthusiasts) Regardig the price increase of ~30K for the facelifted Civic, USB port + Cruise-control + fuel-consumption-indicator - CD changer may come upto around 20K and the rest for styling and rear-suspension tuning and styling (+ nominal increase as with any facelist/upgrade). So its probably not as bad as it appears. I just hope they have sorted out the suspension bottoming-out issue successfully. Honda is probably not so stupid, but they are being greedy here :-) Not providing steering mounted controls is really a cheap trick to reduce cost. I fail to see any possible reason/limitation of the HU in this regard, if at all. Do I sound like owing a Civic already or biased ? I dont own either and in the process of deciding between Altis/Civic. still tallying... Now its time for brickbats :-)
	() Thanks