Fiat India : How much longer before they shut down?

amit · 25th September 2005, 21:44

An interview of Paolo Castagna done by rediff as recently as Sept 16, 2005. Tried to read between the lines about Fiat Spa possibly closing Indian operations but could find any hint of that. Seems like Fiat knows whats wrong and what needs to be done. So what's stopping them?

greatDrive · 26th September 2005, 10:19

Guys,
Do we have any news on this..
I haven't heard anything on CNBC after friday night.

:(

typeOnegative · 26th September 2005, 10:48

I have not heard anything on any other business newspaper/report. What is going on? Can we sue CNBC?

RX135 · 26th September 2005, 11:41

a) It can be a hoax.
b) It can be true, but Fiat India is clearly not aware of. Anyway, the news said it heard from its sources, so you never know. Good idea will be to wait for entire week. Interesting, Fiat India said that they are not aware of it, but didn't deny it vehemently or dismiss it as rumour.

After signing MoU with Tata, there may be some changed equations, such as rolling out cars from Tata production facility, while closing down its own operations, or Tata marketing Fiat cars in India. Well, again this is all speculation, so better to wait and watch.

Italians may have other things in mind, but for me, going out of booming economy like this means a major business loss. Look at Suzuki. India is their single largest market and consumer of Suzuki cars. They pitched in strongly in India, and are reaping harvest now.

hasopi · 26th September 2005, 13:13

From an Insider ..its going to be premier automobiles model for FIAT in India.

TATA will manufacture & market FIAT products in India.

tsk1979 · 26th September 2005, 16:01

Imagine, Tata Palio to hit the streets soon!
Or maybe they will replace the indigo boot with petra's

typeOnegative · 26th September 2005, 16:08

That, TSK, might do wonders. But I don't know how they will position it (the Tata Palio). Unless, they leave the Indica petrol at the bottom of the pile and use the Fiats as top end versions. Same about the Indigo petrols. And what about the styling? And about the diesels variants? That the Petra D may not sell as much is sure. With a Tata backing the Palios may start selling though.

tsk1979 · 26th September 2005, 16:18

If Tata takes on to selling Fiat in india,
1. Tata Petrol may be phased out, with indica petrol getting a Palio 1.2 engine.
2. Tata may use fiat tech on its 1.4 base

the latter option makes more sense. Having driven both palio 1.2 and Tata petrol, i did not find much difference in both except that the fiat feels more refined. But as for drivablity the fiat was sluggish compared to Tata. Autocar numbers also say Tata is quicker than the fiat.

So tata can use a good head on the 1.4 engine and get a 80+bhp indica and a 90+bhp indigo out with fiat tech. If they can maintain the fiats refinement levels Indica may become a viable option to swift and getz and it could be priced 30K lower than both.

This option seems more likely because this is how tata has operated in the past. They do not plonk others engines in their vehicles, they learn by dismantling other cars. Tata desperately wants Fiat tech because currently tata is thought to be a maker of good tractor like cars. To shed its image it needs a good petrol engine. Infact tatas interest in motorsports and like means they are itching to be in the petrol arena too. And the reason is not hard to find.
Remeber magma, the luxury car which never materialized. Tata wanted to give merc like fetures at 7Lac price. Maybe they return with Aria and Magma with fiat petrol engines.

hasopi · 26th September 2005, 17:34

as per Fiat this is a misinterpretation of facts
by CNBC. This is indeed true that Fiat is deciding on shutting down Kurla
(Mumbai) plant, but the operations would start from Ranjangaon (Pune) for
the sake of operational efficiencies and proximity to suppliers. In fact
they mentioned that there is denial of rumor on NDTV 24x7.

Expect a press release from Fiat on denial of this news shortly.

hrag · 26th September 2005, 20:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by tsk1979

If Tata takes on to selling Fiat in india,
1. Tata Petrol may be phased out, with indica petrol getting a Palio 1.2 engine.
2. Tata may use fiat tech on its 1.4 base

the latter option makes more sense. Having driven both palio 1.2 and Tata petrol, i did not find much difference in both except that the fiat feels more refined. But as for drivablity the fiat was sluggish compared to Tata. Autocar numbers also say Tata is quicker than the fiat.

I seriously hope it is the latter - felt the same way about the Palio 1.2. It is sluggish but very refined. Both these remarks are with respect to the Indica.

RX135 · 26th September 2005, 20:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by hasopi

Expect a press release from Fiat on denial of this news shortly.

When will Fiat India learn to respond "quickly"?

If all the talk was about shifting to Ranjangaon facility, then there is hardly anything new. Looks like there is more than what meets eye, unless it is yet another cheap "byte" hunt by CNBC.

greatDrive · 26th September 2005, 21:48

When will these news channel learn from there mistakes. This news would have already done some damage to the company.
I think these press people over speculate and comes on conclusion very soon.
I think there should be a way to sue these news channels

sandeepmdas · 27th September 2005, 10:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by RX135

When will Fiat India learn to respond "quickly"?

Quote:

Originally Posted by greatDrive

This news would have already done some damage to the company.

Perhaps Fiat's top bosses are not interested in India-based TV channels. Perhaps they will be watching only RAI. Or perhaps MTV and FTV are their fav TV channels.

Or perhaps it was the weekend.

That's why their press release (hopefully, like this, as no one wants them shut down) -"we are closing down our Mumbai operations and shifting our production to Ranjangaon"- got delayed. And delayed.

Hopefully, they will realease a statement before this Xmas.

GTO · 27th September 2005, 10:27

Boy, I have never seen as much speculation on any other car company - whether its a company's existence, new product launch or otherwise - as on Fiat India.

Add a good PR department to the list of things that they desperately need.

GTO

hell_rider · 27th September 2005, 23:24

true...this speculation is getting too much.

can we please list out just the known facts here in order of importance and discuss the ramifications ?

Is Fiat shutting down the Kurla plant for sure ?
How exactly are the Tatas fitting into the equation with respect to FIAT's Indian operations ?
Will the Tatas just be sourcing the palio petrol engines or will they be building the cars also ?
Will the Tatas be only concerned with the petrol based technoligies FIAT has to offer or will they also be dabbling in FIAT's diesel technologies ?
Where will the Tatas be building the Palios, if at all ?
What are the implications of the above for FIAT's indian customers ?

i realise most of above points have been discussed but there are so many different opinions, its starting to get confusing.

View Poll Results: When is Fiat India going to shut down?
2005 : They cant survive any longer.	22	9.05%
2006	25	10.29%
2007 or in the whereabouts.	21	8.64%
I dont agree. Fiat India is here to stay - They will pull off a miracle.	175	72.02%
Voters: 243. You may not vote on this poll

25th September 2005, 21:44	#151
amit Senior - BHPian Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Mumbai Posts: 3,717 Thanked: 451 Times	Sept 16 interview with Fiat India boss An interview of Paolo Castagna done by rediff as recently as Sept 16, 2005. Tried to read between the lines about Fiat Spa possibly closing Indian operations but could find any hint of that. Seems like Fiat knows whats wrong and what needs to be done. So what's stopping them?
	() Thanks

26th September 2005, 10:19	#152
greatDrive BHPian Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Bangalore Posts: 547 Thanked: 7 Times	Guys, Do we have any news on this.. I haven't heard anything on CNBC after friday night. :(
	() Thanks

26th September 2005, 10:48	#153
typeOnegative Senior - BHPian Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Vikhroli, Mumbai, India Posts: 1,503 Thanked: 28 Times	I have not heard anything on any other business newspaper/report. What is going on? Can we sue CNBC?
	() Thanks

26th September 2005, 11:41	#154
RX135 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: pune Posts: 2,106 Thanked: 75 Times	a) It can be a hoax. b) It can be true, but Fiat India is clearly not aware of. Anyway, the news said it heard from its sources, so you never know. Good idea will be to wait for entire week. Interesting, Fiat India said that they are not aware of it, but didn't deny it vehemently or dismiss it as rumour. After signing MoU with Tata, there may be some changed equations, such as rolling out cars from Tata production facility, while closing down its own operations, or Tata marketing Fiat cars in India. Well, again this is all speculation, so better to wait and watch. Italians may have other things in mind, but for me, going out of booming economy like this means a major business loss. Look at Suzuki. India is their single largest market and consumer of Suzuki cars. They pitched in strongly in India, and are reaping harvest now.
	() Thanks

26th September 2005, 13:13	#155
hasopi BANNED Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 177 Thanked: 0 Times	From an Insider ..its going to be premier automobiles model for FIAT in India. TATA will manufacture & market FIAT products in India.
	() Thanks

26th September 2005, 16:01	#156
tsk1979 Team-BHP Support Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 23,730 Thanked: 23,287 Times View My Garage	Imagine, Tata Palio to hit the streets soon! Or maybe they will replace the indigo boot with petra's
	() Thanks

26th September 2005, 16:08	#157
typeOnegative Senior - BHPian Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Vikhroli, Mumbai, India Posts: 1,503 Thanked: 28 Times	That, TSK, might do wonders. But I don't know how they will position it (the Tata Palio). Unless, they leave the Indica petrol at the bottom of the pile and use the Fiats as top end versions. Same about the Indigo petrols. And what about the styling? And about the diesels variants? That the Petra D may not sell as much is sure. With a Tata backing the Palios may start selling though.
	() Thanks

26th September 2005, 16:18	#158
tsk1979 Team-BHP Support Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 23,730 Thanked: 23,287 Times View My Garage	If Tata takes on to selling Fiat in india, 1. Tata Petrol may be phased out, with indica petrol getting a Palio 1.2 engine. 2. Tata may use fiat tech on its 1.4 base the latter option makes more sense. Having driven both palio 1.2 and Tata petrol, i did not find much difference in both except that the fiat feels more refined. But as for drivablity the fiat was sluggish compared to Tata. Autocar numbers also say Tata is quicker than the fiat. So tata can use a good head on the 1.4 engine and get a 80+bhp indica and a 90+bhp indigo out with fiat tech. If they can maintain the fiats refinement levels Indica may become a viable option to swift and getz and it could be priced 30K lower than both. This option seems more likely because this is how tata has operated in the past. They do not plonk others engines in their vehicles, they learn by dismantling other cars. Tata desperately wants Fiat tech because currently tata is thought to be a maker of good tractor like cars. To shed its image it needs a good petrol engine. Infact tatas interest in motorsports and like means they are itching to be in the petrol arena too. And the reason is not hard to find. Remeber magma, the luxury car which never materialized. Tata wanted to give merc like fetures at 7Lac price. Maybe they return with Aria and Magma with fiat petrol engines.
	() Thanks

26th September 2005, 17:34	#159
hasopi BANNED Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 177 Thanked: 0 Times	as per Fiat this is a misinterpretation of facts by CNBC. This is indeed true that Fiat is deciding on shutting down Kurla (Mumbai) plant, but the operations would start from Ranjangaon (Pune) for the sake of operational efficiencies and proximity to suppliers. In fact they mentioned that there is denial of rumor on NDTV 24x7. Expect a press release from Fiat on denial of this news shortly. Last edited by hasopi : 26th September 2005 at 17:37.
	() Thanks

26th September 2005, 21:48	#162
greatDrive BHPian Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Bangalore Posts: 547 Thanked: 7 Times	When will these news channel learn from there mistakes. This news would have already done some damage to the company. I think these press people over speculate and comes on conclusion very soon. I think there should be a way to sue these news channels
	() Thanks

27th September 2005, 10:27	#164
GTO Team-BHP Support Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Bombay Posts: 72,232 Thanked: 315,458 Times View My Garage	Boy, I have never seen as much speculation on any other car company - whether its a company's existence, new product launch or otherwise - as on Fiat India. Add a good PR department to the list of things that they desperately need. GTO
	() Thanks

27th September 2005, 23:24	#165
hell_rider BHPian Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Mumbai Posts: 538 Thanked: 61 Times	true...this speculation is getting too much. can we please list out just the known facts here in order of importance and discuss the ramifications ? Is Fiat shutting down the Kurla plant for sure ? How exactly are the Tatas fitting into the equation with respect to FIAT's Indian operations ? Will the Tatas just be sourcing the palio petrol engines or will they be building the cars also ? Will the Tatas be only concerned with the petrol based technoligies FIAT has to offer or will they also be dabbling in FIAT's diesel technologies ? Where will the Tatas be building the Palios, if at all ? What are the implications of the above for FIAT's indian customers ? i realise most of above points have been discussed but there are so many different opinions, its starting to get confusing.
	() Thanks