[akhil_007]

Originally Posted by shogun_man

Somebody must have confused Ethanol(Biofuel?) for biodiesel.

If I recall correctly, BMTC and KSRTC had started using biodiesel almost 8-9 years back. This was for non-volvo ,non premium buses. I vaguely remember those buses having "Biodiesel" painted near fuel tanks. The "bio" component was Honge oil from Honge Tree.

[Rajjaiswal92]

Seeing a lot of misinformation here, let me clear a few facts as I’m in the business of manufacturing of Ethanol and allied products.

Sugarcane and the impact it has on the groundwater

Ethanol is mostly produced by C-heavy or B-heavy molasses. A byproduct of producing sugar.

The classification of molasses is broadly based on the recoverable sugar still present in it. Higher TRS molasses is named B heavy and lower is C heavy. This product has always been produced in large quantities as sugar is a highly consumed product in our country and forms a large portion of our exports.

Prior to the Ethanol blending program, molasses was generally sold from 1000-2000/ton which caused major financial losses to sugar units. This molasses was mainly converted by means of distillation to ENA which is extra neutral alcohol or portable alcohol for the purpose of consumption by blending in with water and flavour. No extra sugar cane is being grown for the sole purpose of Ethanol.

Ethanol as of today is mainly produced from DFG or damaged food grains either being supplied by FCI (has stopped from some time) or from rice mills as broken rice is not lifted by state market federations or the FCI (percentage of broken rice is fixed by these institutions). This broken rice which caused significant losses is now a good revenue source for the rice mills.

Ethanol is a strictly regulated product before it is sent out to the blending stations it is thoroughly checked and then rechecked for any moisture or impurities even a 0.01% deviation will result in rejection.

[Rajjaiswal92]

Have missed this on the above post.
Bio diesel is altogether a different ball game, bio diesel units in itself aren’t very capital intensive but the raw material that you need to make it is a complex thing that is used cooking oil, you see in developed countries the guidelines regarding the use and reuse of cooking oil is strict it can only be reheated and reused so many times the the disposal has to be done in a specific manner so that it can be collected for the use of bio diesel.
Go to any household in our country or a restaurant see how many times we use the same oil to fry things in most cases it is used until it is vaporised, so how can you collect it? Even if you end up collecting it the amount of contamination is super high.
Earlier used cooking oil was imported from countries like Malaysia but now with the cost of shipping and generally high input costs has made in unviable.
Bio diesel as of now can’t be produced in large quantities in our country.

[Beastyerza]

Ethanol blending is not bad in itself, infact it can be a boon for all ICE car owners given this matter is handled sensibly .

Rather than forcing this blended petrol/ diesel why not have 50% blended petrol/diesel available at most petrol pumps in addition to normal petrol/diesel???

Ask manufacturers to bring more and more cars that can run on this 50% blended petrol/diesel and price this a bit lower than normal petrol/diesel.

This way we all get to benefit including government .

[Nano45]

India's ethanol blending efforts are gaining momentum, with research on blending 15% ethanol in diesel now in advanced stages, Union minister Nitin Gadkari said. Speaking at the 12th CII Bioenergy Summit 2024 in New Delhi, Gadkari emphasized the importance of ethanol in securing India's green energy goals and reducing dependency on fossil fuels.

Ethanol blending in petrol has surged from 1.53% in 2014 to 15% in 2024, with the government targeting 20% blending by 2025. "Indian Oil has decided to set up 400 ethanol pump stations, and automakers like Suzuki, Tata, and Toyota are preparing to launch flex-engine cars," said Gadkari, noting that ethanol bikes from TVS, Bajaj, and Honda are ready for rollout once the infrastructure is in place.

https://energy.economictimes.indiati...kari/114218438

[DivyanshuDiv]

Originally Posted by Nano45

Attachment 2668563
Ethanol blending in petrol has surged from 1.53% in 2014 to 15% in 2024, with the government targeting 20% blending by 2025. "Indian Oil has decided to set up 400 ethanol pump stations, and automakers like Suzuki, Tata, and Toyota are preparing to launch flex-engine cars," said Gadkari, noting that ethanol bikes from TVS, Bajaj, and Honda are ready for rollout once the infrastructure is in place.

First the push was on EVs with verbal efforts and invisible infrastructure, which failed
Now they are blending ethanol for the benefit of nation and nature.

[tbppjpr]

Mr. Nitin Gadkari business:

He also started a fruit export company under the banner of "Ketaki Overseas Trading Company". He owns a total of 17 sugar plantations in Vidarbha under the banner of the Purti group. Gadkari floated the Purti Power and Sugar Ltd (now Purti Group) in 1995, when he started as PWD minister in Maharashtra.

Source

(The business is now owned by his son with turnover of thousands of crores)

How the fuel ethanol is produced?

Most of the fuel ethanol produced around the world is made by fermenting the sugar in the starches of grains such as corn, sorghum, and barley, and the sugar in sugar cane and sugar beets.

Source

Historical chart of crude import (Big dip at 2020 is due to Covid halts)


Irony is the fuel adulteration is being justified with the logic of reduction in the crude import and emission, whereas reality seems to be different considering the deteriorating fuel efficiency and the increased carbon footprint caused by the increased farming of sugarcane.

Most people who are not aware of this ethanol bandwagon keep surprising with the constantly decreasing fuel efficiency of their old cars they have been driving since last 10-15 years. Even the new generation cars, which are supposedly more environment friendly are inferior in terms of FE compared to the older generation cars, strange!

Research into biofuels in the US last year found that the carbon intensity of ethanol may be 24% higher than petrol, due to emissions as a result of land-use change, increased fertiliser use and damage to ecosystems. Since 2001, 660,000 hectares of land in India have been converted to sugarcane, according to government data.

“Ethanol is likely as carbon-intensive as petroleum fuels due to carbon emissions caused by the land-use changes to grow the crops, water exploitation and the entire process of making ethanol,” says Devinder Sharma, an expert on agriculture and trade. “Look at Germany, they have realised this and are now discouraging monocropping.”

Source

Does it mean that the car ownership experience of the whole country is being spoiled for the personal gains of one person/family?

[Elevate2024]

Diesel has a very bleak future for PVs as more and more OEMs are ditching it and whenever BS7 comes in, that will just end diesel completely as a fuel for atleast new PVs. In the above posts, people have clarified its not ethanol but biofuel which will be blended in diesel.

In terms of ethanol blending in petrol, in my opinion, the consumers should be given a choice, reduce the petrol price by the blend % on the petrol or a proportion of it (say INR 93 for 15% blend and INR 100 for 0%). That will finish off this conversation altogether. The real problem is lack of choice for the consumers.

Just curious, can anyone shed light on what is the blend percentage on 95 octane petrol? Does that have blending too or that fuel is exempted.

[volkman10]

15% Ethanol in diesel underway as India expands biofuel efforts: Minister for Road Transport and Highways.

Gadkari shared these updates at the 12th CII Bioenergy Summit, where he outlined how the government is prioritising ethanol blending initiatives. He stressed the importance of building an ethanol ecosystem that would support the production and distribution of ethanol-based fuels.

As part of this vision, ethanol pumps are being fast-tracked in key states such as Karnataka, Tamil Nadu, Uttar Pradesh and Maharashtra. The expansion of ethanol infrastructure is aimed at complementing the launch of vehicles designed to run on this alternative fuel.

In parallel, the government is also focused on boosting CNG production, particularly through projects that use biomass such as rice straw. Over 475 CNG projects are in development, with 40 already operational, mainly in Punjab, Haryana, Western Uttar Pradesh and Karnataka.

Link:

[SmartCat]

Originally Posted by tbppjpr

Irony is the fuel adulteration is being justified with the logic of reduction in the crude import and emission, whereas reality seems to be different considering the deteriorating fuel efficiency and the increased carbon footprint caused by the increased farming of sugarcane.

I don't think the dialogue.earth author has done a good job of understanding the subject.

- US research report specifically mentions that corn ethanol blending might result in 24% increase in lifetime green house gases, when compared to 100% petrol. Not sugarcane based ethanol, which has much higher yield. That's why world over, sugarcane is the preferred way to produce ethanol, and not corn.

- US research report further states that the increase in CO2 emissions comes from rapid expansion of corn acreage. That will not be the case here in India with respect to sugarcane.

Here in India, sugarcane will be diverted to produce ethanol, instead of sugar. As the article says, India has excess production of sugar. So even without the blending, you will have those CO2 emissions when mills process the sugarcane. But when you blend 15% to 20% ethanol with diesel/petrol, you can expect 10% to 15% reduction in CO2 emissions in India's case, since we will burn less petrol/diesel.

The blending program is unlikely to result in significant increase in sugarcane acreage because of currently surplus sugarcane production. Further increase will primarily depend on water availability and also MSP on sugarcane

[PreludeSH]

Not sure we should start growing more sugarcane just to produce ethanol. The amount of water needed is huge. In fact I think we should import sugar and not increase the acres given the water scarcity.

Corn or something is better which can be grown in non-irrigated lands just dependent on rains. Even mono cropping with corn for a long time is giving rise to some weeds reducing the output in Karnataka.

Google is going to use small modular nuclear plants for their data centres. India is supposed to have this already. Decade back I had heard Bill Gates investing in even smaller ones that can be used like outdoor AC units. Why not produce more green power and migrate to EVs instead of these jugaads ?

[i74js]

Originally Posted by Elevate2024

Just curious, can anyone shed light on what is the blend percentage on 95 octane petrol? Does that have blending too or that fuel is exempted.

upto 10% in 95 Octane
upto 5% in 98 Octane as per the present data from IOCL, other Oil PSUs might be doing the same too.

[somersault]

Someone wisely said that the third world war will be fought over water supply than anything else.

The Sugarcane crops drink a lot of water and states like Maharashtra are actually promoting Sugarcane production by reserving water supply from the reservoirs. In many cases, the public is not getting daily water in central Maharashtra but they are getting reserved water for Sugarcane crops.This ethanol mixing has an adverse impact on the farming and overall economy as it incentivizes sugarcane farming more over traditional crops. Sugarcane production is generally in excess in India since few years, as the pricing is guaranteed by sugar mills with government mandate. Same thing is going to happen further and more and more people will move to sugarcane production than the traditional crops.

All of this is going to happen when we are still not sure about what is the positive gain of mixing ethanol in the fuel.

[romeomidhun]

Originally Posted by PreludeSH

Not sure we should start growing more sugarcane just to produce ethanol.

Not needed. The people who are so much keen on adding Ethanol in fuel are already doing that

The problem is, we the customers are suffering because of it - reduced mileage without any reduction in fuel price. Whenver the Ethanol mixing in Petrol started, my mileage reduced by around 10%. Same may happen to Diesel owners also. The effect on the engine and other parts are unknown.

[gauravanekar]

I sold my perfectly good 7 year old petrol car because of this ethanol menace and bought Altroz Diesel. Now they are coming after diesel as well. I thought, the ever powerful trucking lobby will not allow govt. to play around with their preffered fuel. I hope, this biofuel thing goes down the drain.