[driven646]

I find it very strange & amusing that so many here are of the opinion that more car sales are bad because of a lack of infrastructure etc.

Just because we've been privileged to be able to afford and drive vehicles for a generation or more, how can that privilege be denied to the upcoming class of people moving on from scooters & motorcycles?

An employee who works with me as a data entry operator recently came to me with a box of sweets, she and her husband - a low level government employee had finally gathered the courage to buy their first car ever - an Alto. This, after years of using only a scooter because obviously precedence was given to the kids education, savings etc.

There are vast swathes if our populace who are exactly like this and I believe they have every right to buy their first cars without being lectured to about infrastructure, pollution etc.

[CorporateMonk]

Given the density of population in our country especially the Urban areas, It is going to create more mess. The govt needs to focus on better local connectivity via wider roads meant for clean usable public transport. Be it Buses, Trams, Under/over ground trains etc.
Most of the developed nations are moving towards creating a world-class public transport infrastructure so that there are lesser cars on roads. Our politicians on other hand are more interested in selling ethanol or implementing those stupid horns which would sound like a musical instrument.

[Asoon]

car ownership is rising at a rapid pace but where is the infra ?
A 20-30% increase over the current car penetration will ensure a complete breakdown of the existing road infra.

I keep on saying this - "Personal Car is a European / US concept because they have 3X land and 33% population, making it 10X land to people ratio, India need to find its own solution for transportation problem"

[Bhokal]

Originally Posted by driven646

Just because we've been privileged to be able to afford and drive vehicles for a generation or more, how can that privilege be denied to the upcoming class of people moving on from scooters & motorcycles?

Agree. Same argument is used by the west when they use coal/green house gases bogey to attack India and other poor countries. Well, you enjoyed the fruits for centuries without caring one bit but now are preaching us when we are barely reaching there.

[Puntoo]

I have two points for the government; one is that India has moved into a K-shaped recovery post-COVID, where rich people increased their wealth exponentially while poor people moved towards poverty. The primary day-to-day costs of most items have increased from a minimum of 25 to 100 percent. Even tolls have increased by around 30 percent in the last five years. On average, school fees, medical, groceries, travel, and many more items that are needed for day-to-day activities have seen a 50 percent increase. The same has not been reflected in most people's earnings except in a few white-collar jobs such as IT and related services, where salaries have increased exponentially. Most people have bought new cars post-COVID, and achieving financial stability will be very difficult for the remaining people, considering the increase in living costs in urban and rural India.

The second one is that the government should focus more on public transport if they are serious about growth and climate. We are seeing the worst crowding in express trains, where general ticket holders are boarding reserved compartments and not even leaving AC ones due to fewer trains and fewer bogeys with general compartments. Most Indian cities do not have seamless end-to-end connectivity, which increases the traffic on roads and creates more economic loss compared to the revenue earned through car sales. Hope the government works more on properly planning public commutes and roads before focusing on more PV sales.

[Fuldagap]

Infrastructure is and should be counted logically when arguing a case for a car for everyone in a city, metro or otherwise.
Just because affordability has increased shouldn't become a reason for everyone to own a car. Owning a car in the old times used to be easier on the environment and the society.

The environment and the social structures have drastically changed. Every additional automobile is an increased burden on the environment and infrastructure. The masses should be made aware of the fact that while automobiles could be a source of joy and pride for themselves and their families, it's a burden on the poor infrastructure, not to mention the total disrespect for the laws by people in general.

As a society people need to collaboratively come out of the personal joys of owning a vehicle for pride and joy and also think about what impact it has on the social life of people around, environment and the infrastructure.

Time has passed, one should have been born a decade or two earlier. It is always too late to realise that one is not in the same generation as the one before, lest we want the coming generations to bear the brunt of our current actions.

[Mortis]

The turnover has gone up because car prices have gone up, close to 50%
This is the same rhetoric that keeps getting sprouted when talking about GST collection.
Obviously 12% of Rs 150 is going to be higher than 12% of Rs 100 or am I missing something ?

Factory in the increase in number extra cars sold due to Covid.
We can talk endlessly about whether it's right or wrong to restrict the sales of new cars but let me ask you this - Do you really think the current vehicle to road density is even close to acceptable ? Is there parking available for all these extra cars ? In the metros and Tier 1 cities there definitely is not and something needs to be done to restrict sales. If you do not have your own parking space. The roads are meant for temporary parking.

[Navigatorsasi33]

Originally Posted by Noctis

Apart from the reasons you mentioned, the elephant in the room is the extremely high taxes on PV in India.

China has a 10% tax on vehicles, with further reductions for certain small/green vehicles. In the US the rate changes between states but the national average is similarly low. In comparison we are looking at GST of upto 50% and RT of around 10-20% even for locally manufactured vehicles. The market will always be hampered by this fact and there is only so much other measures can accomplish.

Well on top it, Indian carmakers should have more dedicated and satisfying after sales services and quality products.

[Puntoo]

Originally Posted by driven646

I find it very strange & amusing that so many here are of the opinion that more car sales are bad because of a lack of infrastructure etc.

Originally Posted by Bhokal

Agree. Same argument is used by the west when they use coal/green house gases bogey to attack India and other poor countries.

Dear driven646 and Bhokal,
Hope most of the BHPians are okay with people buying cars in India. We worry about the high taxes paid by people, and we need the basic infrastructure to handle them. India is heading towards a K-shaped economic recovery, which is terrible for everyone except the top 2% of Indians. My income has increased in the last five years, but my expenses for the same commodity are more than my increment, which does not allow me to spend on my work commute using my car. I have switched to an office bus from my vehicle to reduce expenses and meet my family's needs.

[Storm2.0]

And I see how Mr. Gadkari will achieve this. Get the mindless NGT rules implemented across the country so that people are forced to sell their well maintained and immaculate vehicles to purchase new vehicles, to boost sales of car manufacturers and help them achieve this target. Am I right ?

[DicKy]

Originally Posted by Asoon

I keep on saying this - "Personal Car is a European / US concept because they have 3X land and 33% population, making it 10X land to people ratio, India need to find its own solution for transportation problem"

It is a lack of infrastructure problem, please don't think that we don't have the land or the land to population ratio is unfavourable. Japan is much smaller than us and more than 60% of the land is mountainous or forest area. They have strong public transit as well as bullet trains for inter city travel. They also require proof of parking to own a non-kei car. (imagine implementing that in Indian metro cities). Yet they have more than 600 vehicles per 1000 people, compared to our ~50 vehicles per 1000 people. In fact, other than than India and Indonesia, rest of the 20 largest vehicle markets in the world have an average of 400-500 vehicles per 1000 people. I am aware that it is nigh impossible to even think of having a car to population ratio similar to that of USA, but when China has 200+ vehicles per 1000 people, we still have untapped market. Just that our lack of urban planning, no real push for building new cities and high taxes are keeping the market from really growing. Heck, places like Singapore and Hong Kong have more vehicles per 1000 people than us.

One look at our cities and one might think that we have reached a saturation point in car ownership, but nope, as a nation we haven't.

[melhowl]

Originally Posted by Asoon

car ownership is rising at a rapid pace but where is the infra ?
A 20-30% increase over the current car penetration will ensure a complete breakdown of the existing road infra.

I keep on saying this - "Personal Car is a European / US concept because they have 3X land and 33% population, making it 10X land to people ratio, India need to find its own solution for transportation problem"

Your reasoning is the most inane impractical reasoning in Indian context. In India nothing gets built proactively. The people have to bear the pain first. New roads will not be built unless the current roads choke. Drains will not be built unless their is a water logging every year. So, waiting for infrastructure to improve is a fools dream. A glimpse of it can be found in some political Youtube videos where building of infrastructure is treated with disdain.

So, Let us increase the number of private car owners first. There are already complaints that some of the new expressways are not getting expected patronage.

[dsuman]

I appreciate Mr Gadkari having a Target and a Vision. Though I am not sure there is a clear path defined. He said "Auto Industry" which can be 2 Wheelers to 10 Wheelers both private and Commercial.

To Accomplish his Vision his Colleagues (Read Finance Minister madam) needs to leave/put money in the hands of the ordinary citizen of India. Let him ask our Finance Minister to reduce taxes which will help increase Cash in Hand for everyone. Then people will dream of contributing to Auto Industry or any other industry.

Somehow I feel India is not utilizing the huge potential India has (read Population) to grow its economy. Somehow the Government thinks its OK to Tax and Re-Tax a few percentage of the Population. Reduce the Taxes and see how the consumption rises across everything and not just Automobiles.

Was it a Rant . I think so and I am ending it.

[1.2TSI7DSG]

What happens if all the states implement the 15-year no-renewal rule?
Add to that the 10 year diesel engine restriction

I would rather buy a tractor
4WD check
Convertible check
Expandable seating - check
Leeway in pollution & subsidies from government- check

[2000rpm]

I have started to lose respect for Mr. Gadkari. His achievements are average at best.

This 7 to 20 lakh crore in 10 years is a little over 10% CAGR with inflation included.

Also, he has done little for Roads in Maharashtra in the last 10 years. He has not been able to complete the Mumbai Goa Highway for 10 years now and the road is still far from complete. Mumbai Pune Highway remains as one of the poorest quality highways in India (compared to TN, GJ, RJ even KA)

There is not a 100 meter patch in Mumbai where the suspension is not at work (I know Mumbai is not under him directly, but same government).

Time for us to stop being fanboys and calling a Spade a Spade.