[Benoit]

Not sure if anyone has noticed, but the current set of Hyundai cars, except Creta/alcazar, do not have fog lamps.

Grand i10 nios, Aura, Verna, Venue, now the i20. 6 airbags are provided, but we should drive in the dark.

it's illegal to install auxiliary lights, but it's legal for manufacturers to skip fog lamps. Disappointed with manufacturers and the Govt!

[ashvek3141]

Originally Posted by Benoit

Not sure if anyone has noticed, but the current set of Hyundai cars, except Creta/alcazar, do not have fog lamps.

Grand i10 nios, Aura, Verna, Venue, now the i20. 6 airbags are provided, but we should drive in the dark.

it's illegal to install auxiliary lights, but it's legal for manufacturers to skip fog lamps. Disappointed with manufacturers and the Govt!

If you’ve checked the spy shots of the upcoming Creta facelift, that too is devoid of the fog lamps! I seriously cannot understand this stupid trend of manufacturers getting rid of the fogs.

I wouldn’t be surprised if soon Kia too stops offering the fog lamps; though luckily the Seltos facelift has one.

[AnAvgJoe]

Originally Posted by Benoit

Not sure if anyone has noticed, but the current set of Hyundai cars, except Creta/alcazar, do not have fog lamps.

Grand i10 nios, Aura, Verna, Venue, now the i20. 6 airbags are provided, but we should drive in the dark.

it's illegal to install auxiliary lights, but it's legal for manufacturers to skip fog lamps. Disappointed with manufacturers and the Govt!

This is more of an observation and query, rather than anything else.

I have seen multiple new cars, now launch without fog lamps, not even as an option. These are fully loaded cars. The Car below being a prime example, The Mercedes Maybach S580! not a car in which one would expect cost cutting, especially not a set of "Fog Lamps".




A few points about fog lamps (please do feel free to correct me if I'm wrong),

1) They are bulbs, Halogen or LED's housed in a reflector placed nearer to the ground than the main headlights (to better illuminate the road surface?).
2) They usually have similar wattages (around 50W), to the bulbs in the main headlamps (I have taken Halogens, as I'm not aware of the wattages of the various LED bulbs).
3) I know that the wavelength of the light emitted from these foglamps were higher (more yellow), as higher wavelengths penetrate better into fog (lower Kelvin being better, colour temperature).


These bring me onto my queries, regarding the deletion of fog lamps.

1) The LED bulbs in most modern cars have a higher Kelvin rating, more whiter light. However, the lights in newer cars are significantly brighter than the halogen bulbs of old. The 'Lumens' being higher.
Does this brighter light ensure that fog penetration is better?
2) Does the better spread of light, from the newer 'Headlight Clusters', negate the need for lights placed closer to the ground?


I would really appreciate it, if better informed BHPians could shed some light (excellent pun, even if I do say so myself ) on the subject.

[nidhikapoor]

Originally Posted by ashvek3141

If you’ve checked the spy shots of the upcoming Creta facelift, that too is devoid of the fog lamps! I seriously cannot understand this stupid trend of manufacturers getting rid of the fogs.

I wouldn’t be surprised if soon Kia too stops offering the fog lamps; though luckily the Seltos facelift has one.

Fog lights are being dropped across the board because they are fairly useless practically.

[Takumi Fujiwara]

Originally Posted by Benoit

Not sure if anyone has noticed, but the current set of Hyundai cars, except Creta/alcazar, do not have fog lamps.

Grand i10 nios, Aura, Verna, Venue, now the i20. 6 airbags are provided, but we should drive in the dark.

it's illegal to install auxiliary lights, but it's legal for manufacturers to skip fog lamps. Disappointed with manufacturers and the Govt!

The current i20 Nline does have fog lamps.

[NiInJa]

Originally Posted by AnAvgJoe

T

A few points about fog lamps (please do feel free to correct me if I'm wrong),


These bring me onto my queries, regarding the deletion of fog lamps.

2) Does the better spread of light, from the newer 'Headlight Clusters', negate the need for lights placed closer to the ground?


I would really appreciate it, if better informed BHPians could shed some light .

Point #2 actually answers the question on why some premium cars don't have separate fog lamps

LED/Projector clusters have enabled designers use same headlight housing to have light spread more wide on the road (if you notice, fog lights will light up corners of the road better) and have a better cut-off at height as well, thus negating the need for a separate fog light.

However, I doubt it is the same case in these budget cars. It mostly appears to be a cost cutting exercise. Maruti for example, has removed rear fog lights from all their cars. There is not even a blank space to put them as an accessory.

[ashvek3141]

Originally Posted by NiInJa

Point #2 actually answers the question on why some premium cars don't have separate fog lamps

It surely is cost cutting! Coz with the above logic Kia wouldn’t have given an ‘improved’ (4 cube) LED fogs for the Seltos facelift.

[GTE]

It is a great move to delete fog lamps from cars, hopefully it will be done by all manufacturers. A lot of drivers feel that they must have them switched on all the time. This causes unnecessary stress to drivers in other cars. In Europe it is an offence to use fog lights if there is no fog or mist.

[Shreyans_Jain]

Originally Posted by GTE

It is a great move to delete fog lamps from cars, hopefully it will be done by all manufacturers. A lot of drivers feel that they must have them switched on all the time. This causes unnecessary stress to drivers in other cars. In Europe it is an offence to use fog lights if there is no fog or mist.

The issue is with the rear fog lamps, which are extremely bright by design and a nuisance when used in clear weather. No one ever complained about having front fog lamps. Extra bit of visibility right in front is always appreciated, especially in low visibility conditions.

[GTE]

The problem with the front ones is it can be disturbing to oncoming traffic. Agree about the rear one that is like someone having brake light on all the time. Another disturbing problem is the 2 wheelers having the leds on in high beam mode.

[PaddleShifter]

Originally Posted by Benoit

Not sure if anyone has noticed, but the current set of Hyundai cars, except Creta/alcazar, do not have fog lamps.

In addition to what has already been shared above regarding deletion of fog lamps in many newer models, there is an additional factor (rather a main one) that I attribute to the deletion of fog lamps. The main headlamps are being placed lower in these newer cars, especially SUVs. The headlamp being closer to the road/ ground could help in better illumination of the road and lesser reflection (back into the driver’s eyes). This is a reason why fog lamps are placed low on the bumper. They are closer to the ground and spread light on the road much better.

The rural parts of North are full of fog in the winters and I am certain that rather than the wavelength of the light, its the low placement that makes them more effective.

[ashvek3141]

Originally Posted by GTE

The problem with the front ones is it can be disturbing to oncoming traffic. Agree about the rear one that is like someone having brake light on all the time. Another disturbing problem is the 2 wheelers having the leds on in high beam mode.

The fog lamps in recent cars aren’t that powerful to cause any disturbance to the oncoming users. On the contrary maybe the LED lights do. However, the fog lamps serve as an additional illumination for the road surface.

Idk if it’s by regulation or what, but somewhere after around 2009-10 the fog lamps had a very reduced power / illumination.

Originally Posted by PaddleShifter

In addition to what has already been shared above regarding deletion of fog lamps in many newer models, there is an additional factor (rather a main one) that I attribute to the deletion of fog lamps. The main headlamps are being placed lower in these newer cars, especially SUVs. The headlamp being closer to the road/ ground could help in better illumination of the road and lesser reflection (back into the driver’s eyes). This is a reason why fog lamps are placed low on the bumper. They are closer to the ground and spread light on the road much better.

The new Nexon has headlights placed lower on the bumper with a more powerful LED projectors (if I’m not wrong), yet they’ve also provided with the LED fogs just below them.

The deletion of fogs are merely a cost cutting exercise! Some stupid manufacturer started this (I don’t remember who) and the industry is just following it now. This is akin to how Apple got rid of the charger in the box and others blindly followed the trend.

On a side note, I can still give the benefit of doubt to the luxury cars as they have some really good headlight set-up ; but sadly it’s not true for some of the mass market cars.

[PaddleShifter]

Originally Posted by ashvek3141

The deletion of fogs are merely a cost cutting exercise! Some stupid manufacturer started this (I don’t remember who) and the industry is just following it now. This is akin to how Apple got rid of the charger in the box and others blindly followed the trend.

Found a few threads from Team-BHP itself after doing a Google search for who started it.

https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/india...fog-lamps.html (New trend - luxury car makers are dropping fog lamps)

https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/road-...ghts-cars.html (Use of Fog lights in cars?)

While respecting your points, I still do not see this as an omission if the headlamps are placed lower. Apologies for lingering the topic by adding one more post. Perhaps fog lamp deletion can be discussed in these threads shared above while sparing the i20 thread for other discussions.

[GTO]

Originally Posted by Benoit

Not sure if anyone has noticed, but the current set of Hyundai cars, except Creta/alcazar, do not have fog lamps.

Thanks for sharing, Benoit! Moving your post out to a new thread. Will add to homepage later this week .

@ BHPians, if you should spot any good post in an existing thread that deserves its own new thread, please report the post and we'll move it out for greater visibility.

Thank you!

[steadfast]

I also have a perspective to add here . Let’s pick example of Harrier and Virtus - Both have fog lights and ideally by the definition and practicality of fog lights they should be yellow lights and they indeed are.

However car owners do not like this mixed colour of white headlight and yellow fog lights and get fog lights changed to white lights or LEDs which anyways is counter productive to definition and utility of fog lights.
So when mass market car brands realised this trend they happily implemented a cost cutting measure for a feature which was actually being misused and hence the deletion.

If I talk about my Virtus Topline specifically, headlights are white and fog lights are yellow when they are switched on together the look from aesthetics perspective is not that great due to mix of white and yellow. However these yellow fog lights are very helpful for foggy conditions and I believe in their utility than aesthetics but many people do not like this mixed look and get it changed to a white consistent look across brands.