[GoBabyGo]

Originally Posted by Nithesh_M

I don't know why so many think this will not succeed. A good chunk of the monthly 11000 unit Creta buyers opted for 1.5 NA petrol variants mostly due to
a) Low usage per month.
b) Oil dilution of diesel engine.
c) Questionable reliability of Turbo/DCT in Indian traffic and weather.(Also takes out Skoda/VW out of equation).
d) Relative ease of diagnosing NA engine issues outside Asc (Less crammed engine bay).
e) Unknown availability of diesel fuel in the future.

Hi Nithesh_M - It is not that majority of us believe that this will not succeed. It is just that it may not be sales benchmark like Honda City is in sedan segment. The only advantage I foresee for Elevate is if Honda manage to deliver it immediately (from festival season) without waiting period because Creta, Grand Vitara, Hyryder, XUV, Scorpio N etc. have long waiting period.

I do agree that Honda definitely have fan following (better than Toyota in sub 20 lacs segment) and Honda's 1.5L NA engine is the best NA engine available in India. However, I am seriously disappointed by Honda's approach towards India. Despite having Hybrid powertrain and knowing that it will sell like a hot cake, they are not launching Hybrid engine in Elevate.

I don't think we are against Elevate as a product, but we are disappointed with Honda's strategy by launching just 1.5L NA engine and not offering Hybrid.

[Revvatron]

In our country purchasing a car is not just an individual decision.It involves our whole family be it spouse, parents, siblings or even distant relatives and neighbours. Majority of car buyers will be influenced by family members who like all the bells and whistles and do not focus on other aspects. When I was in market for new car last year (bought an I20), I was forced a lot by parents and sister to go for sonet/venue because it looks big and has better features. When I convinced them for I20, I was again forced to buy one with sunroof (Asta variant). But still somehow managed to buy the one I felt was value for money.

So even there are Honda loyalists who will take Elevate over Korean/German twins, they still might find it difficult to convince their family and Honda will miss out on such customers.

Going by some comments that Honda is looking only to pull few numbers from Hyundai-Kia and Toyota-Maruthi and not make a dent, in the words of great Michael Scott "how the turn tables" . Hyundai was the one trying to make a dent years back but now it is Honda.

[CarCraze]

Originally Posted by Revvatron

I(bought an I20), I was forced a lot by parents and sister to go for sonet/venue because it looks big and has better features.

Its a good decision to go for i20. There are a few still who go for seemingly big vehicles but compromise in interior space (always wondered why)!

[TribalRoar]

Well, I have to say that this launch appeased and disappointed me in equal measure. Honda has totally bottled the aesthetic aspect of the car while hitting it out of the park with the practical aspects. I have seldom come across a launch where a carmaker has bifurcated the hits and misses of their product with such a clean contrast. Its a car that leaves no ambiguity as to where it stands. I feel no buyer will be left in two minds while considering the Elevate. For people who are looking for a 'Do it all' practical car they wont be disappointed while the ones looking for personality, contemporary vibes and state of the art experience can simply skip this without a second glance.

For someone like me coming from hilly and lesser developed regions of the country the Elevate has ticked just about every possible box from the practical standpoint. I am quite delighted with that. My view is that the elevate has turned out as a car without any personality. It seems the car is a hybrid of every imaginable stereotype of the Indian car buyer. This perhaps proves Honda has done really extensive study of the preferences of the Indian market and incorporated every one of those inputs verbatim but forgot to imbue the car with a unique identity of its own.

The Hits:

1. That delicious Ground Clearance.

2. They seem to have carved out the cabin space especially the Headroom significantly better than any of the Elevates rivals. (This is the reason I dropped the Grand vitara/Hyryder)

3. A reliable engine with the six speed manual. (Was afraid they would plonk the 5 speed from the Amaze)

4. Glad Honda did not fall for the 'Coupe roofline' trend and kept the shape of the vehicle conventional.

5. From the reviews the components of the car does seem to be solidly knit together as Honda is known for, seat stitching, door thud etc. Lets wait and see.


The Misses:

1. The front is ugly. There is no way around this. It looks like someone started designing the car from the back, ran out of materials and ideas on reaching the front and plonked a microwave grill into remaining open space. It is neither bold/imposing or elegant/striking. It does not even converge well the back design. Its a nothingburger.

2. The interiors look dated and dull. Especially the color tones gives you a vibe that you will be riding in the past. Add the obvious cost cutting Honda has done looking with the switches, buyers may end up with the feeling that they went back in a time machine and bought a new car back from there. Heck, they even removed the rotary AC knobs present in the City. Why?

3. No 360 Camera. Though many gimmicky features have invaded Indian cars over the last few years, this is one feature which I feel should be standard on any car, atleast the upper 3 variants. The Honda lane watch has very limited view compared to a 360 camera from what I see. A definite miss.

4. There is a lack of application of mind when it comes to the overall design elements of the car. It just seems Honda was very conscious of their failures in the recent past and was frightened to even make marginal oversteps with the designing details lest the negative blowback sinks the Elevate on which so much of their hope rests. This I think has left the car in nowhere land as far as the buyers consciousness goes. This makes it a car with no personality and instantly forgettable.

I consider the Hyundai Creta (especially the upcoming facelift) one of the ugliest cars to ever arrive at our shores, but that said, Hyundai really knows how to spruce up the specs and invest every sinew of effort on whatever design language they have chosen. This makes the car a presence in the market whatever we may say about it.

5. I dont think any buyer of the Elevate will be feeling any form of 'new car thrill' with their purchase.

All said, I feel that the fate of the Elevate will be decided by the pricing. Could they actually place this car below the city? Prima facie it seems to have an inferior build to the city with a lot more cost cutting. If honda prices this aggressively I think the lower trims would be a good buy. I dont think there is any sense in going for the top variants whatever Honda decide.

As someone with needs from a car that is more 'agricultural' in nature, I am personally happy with the practicality of the Elevate from what we have seen even if the looks and the aesthetics of the car are disposable. Given what I have heard regarding the comfort of Honda vehicles, my elderly parents may also warm up to this vehicle. If the base model is priced aggressively, buying it and accessorizing it with the right after market infotainment unit could turn out to be a killer deal.

[Lokesh Soni]

I think this will look good in flesh and people will appreciate its road presence.
If Honda prices it super competitive like City then people will consider it as it surely would not do anything wrong. It should do 3-4k/month sales.

Major Pros:
1. Looks (road presence)
2. Pricing (if Honda does it like City)
3. Honda reliability and low maintenance

Major Cons:
1. Nothing really new from it in the segment
2. Missing engine punch because of no-turbo.
121ps is a good number but turbo petrols have spoiled Indian customers as most are used to drive at low revs and expect torque there.
Honestly...I love this 1.5L 121ps naturally aspirated engine, revvvv it

[dextor]

I have a strong belief that Honda is just testing waters by launching Elevate in current avatar and with limited set of features. This is the same strategy which they played while launching Amaze 1st generation in 2013.

If people remember Amaze 1st release was almost barebone with very basic design, plain dashboard and primitive steering wheel. But the 2nd version onwards there were big bang changes where the car design was changed and heavily upgraded (overall). Even automatic variant was introduced. That is when Amaze started getting good sales numbers.

Honda wants to test the acceptance of this model - if they get satisfactory response they might go for better loaded (or may be Hybrid) Elevate.

Honda does not want to face the Mobilio's experience again. Japanese are very particular about failures.

Another thing I feel is that Honda might price this car very aggressively and if we keep hopes high, might undercut City pricing during launch. This car is made for India and seeing the interiors we all can see it is not in same league as Civic, Accord, CRV. Certain things shows evident cost cutting - AC unit, gear knob, tyres, buttons/handles etc.

If Honda has to gain some quick interest and initial high numbers, pricing is the key and that is why as many members suggested Hybrid is not included at launch. Honda Hybrid tech is quite expensive compared to Toyota majorly because Toyota is relying on economy of scale by partnering with Suzuki. And Honda does not have that comfort so pricing for Hybrids will be on higher side until they can reach some good scale.

I doubt that Hybrid will be skipped and replaced with EV. SUV based EVs will be much more costlier compared to Hybrids.

[Revvatron]

Originally Posted by dextor

I doubt that Hybrid will be skipped and replaced with EV. SUV based EVs will be much more costlier compared to Hybrids.

Are you referring to Hybrid for Elevate? Because CEO of Honda India has already declared that there will be absolutely no hybrid for elevate due to cost concern.

[vellatechie]

This is going to be the perfect SUV for MAJORITY of people as long as Honda prices it well.

Just like in the sea of Android phones, Samsung is always a safe bet. Hondas reliability, sensible interiors, and proven no-nonsense engine and transmission will nudge it over the competition.

Honda just needs to do 2 things
1. Price it well. Little premium over Hyundai is fine.
2. Add Panaromic Sunroof at some point. Even Maruti has it!

Front is ugly, but really it's not that much worse than what Creta was launched it and people still lapped it up.

[Artyom]

I own the 1.6L NA VTVT Creta and dad owned the Honda City iVTEC before we sold it off last year.

Both are NA engines and have driven both I can share a few points:-

1.Both are super-silent and refined BUT iVTEC is a notch better.
2.iVETC is rev happier than the 1.6L in Creta. But Creta is by no means a slogger. Its acceptable.
3. iVETC offers better FE in any conditions where as Hyundai engines have never been known for mileage. Creta gives 11.5 in Bangalore City and 13-16 on Highways.Honda used to give 13 in city traffic and easily 16-17 on highway.
4.Both engines are delivering same power figures .
5.iVTEC has shorter gear shifts as compared to 1.6L in Hyundai.

When I was in the market City was the only vehicle with the sweet 1.5 iVETC and the next best option was the 1.6L in Creta so had to buy that.
I am very satisfied with my 1st gen Creta in all aspects BUT the iVETC is still the king in the NA engine world.
If I would have the money today I would buy Elevate eyes closed for the engine alone.
People have acquired the taste for TGDI and Turbo engines but for me NA engine still rules them all.
Elevate the way I see it is a No-Nonsense car with a solid engine which equals to a reliable vehicle in the long term.
Add a 220mm GC to it which is a surprise being a Honda I think you have a winner(Well Almost)
The ONLY thing which bothers me is how well the iVTEC handles a heavier chassis as compared to City.
I hope the engine will be tuned to deliver the same experience iVETCs are known for.
I guess time will tell and i see them doing decent numbers.

[dextor]

Originally Posted by Artyom

1.Both are super-silent and refined BUT iVTEC is a notch better.
2.iVETC is rev happier than the 1.6L in Creta. But Creta is by no means a slogger. Its acceptable.

If you have driven Creta's current 1.5L engine, you would realize that the previous 1.6L was far better. I had the 2016 Creta and now I upgraded to 2022 Creta IVT and I know what I am missing.

So from that point of view 1.5L iVTEC would be much better compared to 1.5L NA of current Creta (although I never got chance to drive a city ).

Will get to know once Elevate test drives are available.

[Artyom]

Originally Posted by dextor

If you have driven Creta's current 1.5L engine, you would realize that the previous 1.6L was far better. I had the 2016 Creta and now I upgraded to 2022 Creta IVT and I know what I am missing.

So from that point of view 1.5L iVTEC would be much better compared to 1.5L NA of current Creta (although I never got chance to drive a city ).

Will get to know once Elevate test drives are available.

I have heard this statement that the 1.6 was far superior but never believed it as Hyundai generally makes good NA engines.
But you being the owner of both engines will add weight to that notion.
I never drove the 2nd gen Creta so could not comment.
The iVTEC is superior in refinement and operation. Hands down.
Surely iVTEC engine alone will pull Honda Loyalists and others alike to Honda showrooms because even today not everyone wants a Turbo Engine and all the bells and whistles. For them Elevate is a perfect upgrade.

[SoumenD]

Do we have a breakup of Creta/Seltos engine variant wise sales? In my circle most of the people I see have bought the NA IVT version. Their reason is the same : DCT & Turbo reliability doubts. NA engine with CVT(IVT in hyundai terms) is looked upon as the safest bet and hence majority go for this variant.

Now when it comes to NA engines, I don't think anybody has a better engine than Honda's 1.5 iVtec currently in our market. Honda probably is eyeing such customers. But yeah, missing panoramic sunroof is a big miss in our market(personally couldn't care less). That's a huge draw for our public

Btw does Honda even have the capacity to roll out 10k+ Elevates for domestic market every month? While we say its competing with Creta, I doubt honda has the capacity to churn out that many cars even if there was a demand. Considering they will be exporting this to other markets as well, I think they would be happy doing City/Amaze-ish numbers in domestic market.

[Dead_Pedal]

Are these finalized models on display? I wonder if it's possible some features(auto up-down on all 4 windows, light on the driver side sun-visor, chrome tip on the handbrake, some chrome around the central AC vents, leather wrapped steering wheel, full sized spare alloy wheel etc) get added once the variants are finalized and the car finally hits the showrooms. Also is that a new orange colour or it's the existing radiant red appearing differently to my eyes.

[motorworks]

Originally Posted by dextor

I have a strong belief that Honda is just testing waters by launching Elevate in current avatar and with limited set of features. This is the same strategy which they played while launching Amaze 1st generation in 2013.

Er..What is there to test? They are extremely late to this segment, the market has been all about SUVs for quite sometime now, and they have success stories like the Creta, Seltos to analyse! Most new launches have been had some strong USPs, The Koreans have always had features, Diesel and Multiple engine gearbox options, someone new like MG brought in some novelty, XUV700 was about everything, Toyota and Suzuki brought in Hybrids. Irrespective of pricepoints, most manufacturers have tried to being something new to the table when they have launched a 15-25 lakh SUV. Skoda and VW failed to do this, but they still brought in two exciting engine-gear box options and also the added safety rating.

Honda has had ample time to learn from all this, so why test waters when you literally have “tried and tested” formula working right in the market!

I’m sorry, this is just lack of effort from Honda. The Elevate might be a pretty decent car, but it doesn’t set any benchmarks and neither does it really exceed the ones set by others in this segment.

[Aaron:)]

While we are talking about how most Creta/Seltos sales are from the NA engined versions, we also have to admit that Honda missed a golden opportunity to offer the 1.5 Turbo that is sold abroad.

Honda could actually have had the best engines across the board -
1.5 i-VTEC >> Hyundai 1.5 NA, Suzuki 1.5 NA and VAG 1.0 TSI
1.5 Turbo VTEC >> Hyundai 1.5 Turbo, VAG 1.5 TSI
e:HEV >> Toyota hybrid

This is a complete lack of effort from Honda’s side. If everyone else in the segment can offer at least one USP among 5-star safety, Turbo, Hybrid, features at the same cost, what is stopping Honda from doing the same?

A saving grace could be if they get the Elevate sponsored for a GNCAP test and it scores 4 or 5 stars under the new protocol. It will then have a unique safety + reliability value proposition. If Honda is even slightly interested in selling the Elevate, they should sponsor a crash test.

I’m sure that the Elevate is going to sell well as a jack of all trades. But I’m still waiting for something to tug at our heart strings like the Hondas of 2000s.