[KeepReading]

Very good thread. Sad to see great cars reaching EOL phase.

Couple of thoughts here.
Due to EV revolution, they will loose the edge currently. After sometime, they can be back in EV avatar.
Considering pricing very close to low end of Luxury cars and good offers, herd is moving to Luxury cars. No offense.

[Annibaddh]

Originally Posted by Shreyans_Jain

I am going to disagree with the general consensus here. The reason sedans lost out was simply because the manufacturers did not update them with time and/or made blunders - either with pricing or positioning or something as basic as reliability and downtime.

Actually there's some truth in that. As roads become better across the road we should have seen a reverse trend - a shift to better driving cars - and yet SUVs have gained significantly across the world. This has to have an element of neglect. Ironically the same trend has not been replicated *completely*, that being the operating word, in luxury cars where sedans still hold water - even if Lambo, Ferrari and RR have had to launch UVs.

The singular reason for UVs gaining market is that UVs are moneymakers. Other than the bottom scrapping (get a decent underbody clad car and there's that solved) I don't find a single reason for UVs for daily driving purposes. Don't entirely agree on the better space argument because the freed up space comes at a cost (and anyway Vento and Compass are identical in their size but Vento has acres more space in every imaginable way so space is singularly a function of using design to great effect). The cost of any higher space in UVs is the loss of a buffer between rear impact and passengers that a sedan provides. I remember one of the mods here on team-bhp even writing a post about us "loving our kids" - talking about the use of third rows for children in cars like the Kodiaq. And I could not agree more.

Frankly the death of sedans is a terrible terrible trend. And the exploding gap between C sedans and all luxury sedans makes it incredibly hard to upgrade. Octavias were brilliant (as were Superbs) but having lived with a VAG for nearly 12 years now - they're not great relationships!

[d.j]

Wow, great work man!, my opinion is sedans will come back for sure, I recall this time, in my teenage days when Mahindra was the only rugged car or that shape car available to us and I always used to wonder why can’t car manufacturer make such cars or suv’s, its more about the time, trend and preference which definitely keeps changing in all consumer spaces, am sure way pass certain time people will get bored of these, manufacturer would get tired improvising designs and then bring back Sedans on board.

Regards/DJ

[motorworks]

Fantastic thread! Extensive coverage of even the most niche sedans sold in India.

Is “herd mentality” the main reason towards the demise of Sedans and subsequently the rise of Cross overs? Partly yes, but one of the main reason is that the typical roads in major Cities and Towns have just deteriorated very badly! Highways have improved for sure, but most cities and upcoming towns have really bad infrastructure. It does not mean that the Cross overs are a solution, but apart from the better ground clearance, there is also a strong perception that a Cross over will deal with such roads better. And obviously the extra space inside the cabin is a huge factor too although most cross overs and sedans fare poorly when it comes to usable boot space when compared to sedans.

One of friends is in need of a lateral upgrade from his 2016-17 1st Gen Creta. And guess what, he has still gone ahead and shortlisted the 5th Gen City, purely because of the value it offers. So I believe basis someone’s need sedans may still make a good buy, but its a highly declining segment.

And its the manufacturers who are laughing all the way to the bank by charging a hefty premium for a Cross over which is essentially based on a hatchback or a sedan!

[IshaanIan]

The utility of a hatchback style vehicle combined with our poor road infrastructure as well as our populous' generally poor driving skills (wherein they prefer the tall seating and the view it gives them as they would otherwise struggle to judge the vehicle footprint) means that SUVs will forever continue to remain popular.

My only worry is that this will exacerbate the traffic issues that we are already facing as SUVs or pseudo SUVs encourage more poorly abled drivers to get out onto the roads with their less than adequate reaction times and lack of understanding of road rules and traffic flow also they block the view of the road ahead making it less safe for overtaking in general if one is in a lower vehicle.

[Freespirit27]

Back in 2012 or so when I wanted to graduate from a Indica V2, the options I looked at were Linea and Manza. City those times was looked down for GC issues and SX4 - well maruti was still to hit a sweetspot on sedans! While Toyota believed people will pay for a Toyota engine with 4 wheels and skinny bench seats(Etios)!
But the deciding factor became do I pay nearly 3-4lacs over a hatch just to get a "Boot"! Linea was also then called, underpowered but for me it was a solid car and I almost placed my money on it, but the declining fortunes of Fiat made me pull back with regret. Then suddenly the X-over XUV trend came and it was a sweet deal! A larger boot, loading bay, hybrid-seating, bells &whistles. I never looked at a sedan again!
So yes the practicality of a hatchback and add a good GC - whatever you call that - becomes a preferred family car. It even gives me a better mileage than 'Premium' sedans which now, make more sense only as maybe company cars and premium cabs. The market for those decides the manufacturers' assembly line configuration.
I do hope EVs bring some radical design change, else there will be more to add to the graveyard list.

[NiInJa]

One thing I never understood about these premium sedans was the fact that they were expensive to begin with in India, even for the starting variants whereas their equivalent UVs offered much more features.

When I was in the market to buy a car at the end of 2018, my requirement was clear that it had to have loads of space and at times should carry 6 people and had to be super reliable. Coming from a sedan (Linea), I gave in to the UV craze and lapped up one thereby sacrificing on driving pleasure and safety to some extent, but gaining a lot on practicality. The only other car that I gave serious thought at that time was the Corolla Altis. But I soon realized that even the base version was priced too high and never really understood why. For the same price I would have got a mid variant of XUV5OO or even the top end Duster (both were reaching EOL by then).

Today, the Honda City VX variant that comes around 16L on road has space and safety features comparable to the Altis whose base variant came to around 18L in Jan 2019 (last I checked).

I like driving sedans and the separate boot space they have, but for me, that is where its USP ends. I've put washing machine, Ikea stuff, 55 inch TV, my kid's bicycle and my nephew's pram together and lots of other things in my current car. Taken half dozen of my in-laws to holy places together and I've realized even my next car won't be a sedan for sure A second car can be a Hot-Hatch like Polo.

[UD17]

A well deserved 5* for the analysis.

IMHO, The sedan segment loose out in India due to:

- Low Ground clearance: Poor road conditions, poorly designed speed-breakers, Flooding situation added fuel to the fire
- SUV propagates a better macho image and who in India don't want that
- Go anywhere perception of SUVs
- Improved comfort quotient (ride & handling) and space management of modern SUVs
- Price overlap with SUVs segment (or lets say competitive price offering of SUVs)

I am a sedan lover, but my family would weigh me out to buy the SUV in future.

[samm]

Originally Posted by sandeepmdas

That was just a hatchback. The XUV500 later was used to bring home a Honda genset, washing machine and a 1.5 ton split AC without breaking a sweat. I can only imagine what a Fortuner can do.

I've transported 8*400W Solar panels in my Innova across states (400km). Driver and co-driver will not have the luxury to stretch... In fact, cant move much

[samyakmodi]

Originally Posted by UD17

A well deserved 5* for the analysis.

IMHO, The sedan segment loose out in India due to:

- Low Ground clearance: Poor road conditions, poorly designed speed-breakers, Flooding situation added fuel to the fire
- SUV propagates a better macho image and who in India don't want that
- Go anywhere perception of SUVs
- Improved comfort quotient (ride & handling) and space management of modern SUVs
- Price overlap with SUVs segment (or lets say competitive price offering of SUVs)

I am a sedan lover, but my family would weigh me out to buy the SUV in future.

Though I do agree to most of your points, I would still like to add a few more.

I think the primary problem with any sedan these days is the comfort of getting in and out. Add to it the practicality what the pseudo and true SUVs provide which are entirely missing from sedans. The boot space is a constraint along with interior room compared to any other SUV from the same segment.

Though I still believe sedans give a much better pleasure while driving compared to any SUV. Add to it lower centre of gravity helps in minimal body roll around curves.

[Asish_VK]

Great analysis. Agree to all your points.
Also I feel the hatch backs are also moving towards a similar fate (atleast the premium hatches for now) because of the micro and mini SUVs.

[sandeepmdas]

Ref. the price difference between sedans and pseudo SUVs, I think blame should not be on manufacturers and consumer demand alone, but on government also. AFAIK the SUVs are taxed differently (read more heavily).

The Innova despite being clearly a people-mover, is treated as an SUV because it is more than 4m long, engine exceeds 1.5L and GC more than 170mm.

The Spresso is also a Micro-SUV according to MSIL but the government won't accept that claim. The immensely popular Tata Nexon is also not an SUV. The Thar? Someone please clarify.

https://auto.hindustantimes.com/auto...727961334.html

[ajayc123]

What's the fuss about. Most of the so called SUVs around are sedans in SUV clothing.

[gupta_chd]

I am amazed by people attributing any and every trend in India as herd mentality but they are ready to offer their intelligent insights into the various global or foreign trends.

Fact is that Indians are far more practical than most of global markets.

- They did not get into herd mentality of Americans in previous decades by buying big butch SUVs as these were too fuel hungry and very costly.

- They didn't buy very small cars like 2 seaters because these offered very little value plus required atleast one more car in the household.

- They leaped up crossovers as these are far more practical than sedans whether you need to carry luggage by folding rear seats, traverse pot hole riddled towards or insane speed breakers. In my city, there are many areas where sedans are sure to scrape their underbelly many times while crossovers would chug along happily.

I was smitten by Verna in 2019 but still went for Seltos as it was far more practical. Parents could sit comfortably in Seltos than Verna. Wife was more happy with it. Upright posture was far comfortable than crouched sitting for driver.

It's a global phenomenon due to various advantages crossovers offer. Sorry to say but cribbing (by few) about sedans going extinct by calling others choices as herd mentality and what not isn't going to help. Crossovers may also become extinct in future when something more practical or desirable arrives.

[ashivas89]

I'm just going to leave this here.

I work in the automotive domain (chassis dynamics and braking). I have a few colleagues who drive SUVs, into which they graduated directly from basic hatchbacks. They did not even CONSIDER sedans despite knowing how easy it is to tune their dynamics compared to raised cars. A Creta 1.4 turbo owner, a Jeep Compass diesel AT 4X4 owner, a Safari (omega arc) owner and an XUV 700 owner were curious about my Slavia.

Their minds were blown when they I took them for a drive in my car (Slavia 1.5 DSG), both in terms of vehicle dynamics and outright performance. They were equally impressed by the manners of my dad's 5th gen City when I took it to work one day.

These are automotive engineering folks whose jobs are made easy by lower cars who did not even consider sedans. Talk about herd mentality.

I will not however, dismiss crossovers. They are relevant. Not to people who value certain aspects of vehicle dynamics, efficiency, performance and sheer pizzaz; but to most others who just want to have a good view of the perils ahead and want more metal for their money.