[jeetumg27]

In the latest issue of ACI, there is a comparison between the Jeep Meridian and the Toyota Fortuner (Legender).

They have picked the Meridian as it is better value, more refined etc.

But the bullet-proof reliability that Toyota is known for is sort of taken for granted. The primary purpose of a vehicle is to take you from point a to b, whatever the condition of the vehicle - everything else is after that.

This horror story is a clear example of that:
- Premium brands not working on Sundays!? They should be giving 24 hours service.
- No help or pickup service provided when stranded. This is clearly on the dealer too; it goes a long way in showing the ethos & empathy on part of both the brand and the dealership. If they can’t understand a consumer’s pain & frustration, even the best product in the world cannot save them.

[tsk1979]

Originally Posted by jeetumg27

- No help or pickup service provided when stranded. This is clearly on the dealer too; it goes a long way in showing the ethos & empathy on part of both the brand and the dealership. If they can’t understand a consumer’s pain & frustration, even the best product in the world cannot save them.

In case of Toyota and even Tata, the helpline is managed by the company itself. When we hit a huge pothole at 1am on a national highway which broke the rim, Toyota customer care dispatched a flatbed which reached us in 2 hours, and it took us to the dealership.

When our Safari broke down in Sangla valley, they sent an engineer with some parts on a bus from Solan, and he reached the next day.

If Jeep wants to position itself as an adventure brand, they also need to provide a support network with it.

To your specific problem, electrical harnesses of the vehicle often have segments which can be replaced. So if some connection goes bad between fuel pump and the power connector, it can be safely replaced. A much bigger problem (and a much more expensive and difficult to debug) is your control harness which carries the control signals between the main ECU to all other ECUs and other parts of the car. Eg ABS controller, Body ECU, Transmission ECU etc.,
This carries data and is usually a complex beast with long interconnected segments. Replacing this requires significant work, often requiring seat, dashboard, steering removal etc.,

In your case it seems like a power circuit issue in the engine bay, and these segments are usually short and can be replaced quickly.
Anyways find out exactly what is being replaced. If you see your dashboard, steering etc., intact, and work only in engine bay, you are lucky.

that said, in many other countries you would have gotten your money back under lemon law. Unfortunately such consumer protection in India exists only if you can go to consumer court and have the patience to fight with the manufacturer in courts for many years.

[Capri89]

@ vinitbhavi
Would pray for a satisfactory resolution for your woes with Jeep, my friend. This shouldn't happen to one's worst enemy.
Regards

[kovilkalai]

@ vinitbhavi

I am so sorry that you had to go through this experience with a brand new car. While I hope Jeep and your dealer step and sort out this problem, there are a few things that we as a group can think about:

1. Lemon Laws - Lemon laws are those that protect the consumer from a clearly defective product (defective is usually defined as the number of days the product is unavailable to the consumer thanks to serious defects). It is about time we start making laws like this. Unlike other reforms, there isn't much debate here. The downside is that it may drive up the cost of a new car marginally, but the benefit is clear

2. Along the lines of GNCAP, we need some robust data on problems faced by customers with new cars (kinda like JD Power's Initial Quality Survey, but with more data). We form a lot of perceptions on this forum based on severity of complaints that get highlighted, but we don't really have a good system where we can assess brands and models based on number of issues/severe issues per 100 cars sold. The government doesn't have to do this. The owners on this forum could be sufficient. We can perhaps conduct detailed surveys here that new car owners can fill out.

[RaviCar]

Really saddened to read your ordeal. I will never buy a JEEP product.

Please don't let this slide and request a new vehicle with free registration or complete refund with penalties on losses I curred.

Hope you come out of this smiling.

[Capri89]

Four years down the line, even with all the troubles I have had with my car, I feel that it is the best car yet that I have brought into my garage.

Talk about Anchoring bias.

[car-go]

Originally Posted by car-go

Vinit, at the outset felt extremely sorry and sad for the ordeal you have gone through. Nobody warrants such experience, even if it's a 3 lakhs car or 30 lakhs+. Being a Jeep owner, it gave me goosebumps thinking about it when I read your post today morning (and was then not sure what to write).

One experience that I have, though not connected to cars, but my home AC, is that if things go wrong, if it does not work even when you complain to the India subsidiary of a foreign business, better to write to their global business. For my AC, the company's India biz was not adequately responding when I faced a problem. Once I wrote an email to it's Japan headquarters (found out the CEO's email), things immediately fell into place. Not sure if this applies only for Japan; they are indeed great (thinking Toyota).

Question to all my TBhpian friends - can't we do this for cars? In this case, Jeep? Does anyone has contacts on manufacturers' head office/ CxOs of their global business whereabouts which can make a difference? That may then be altogether a separate reference post.

Vinit, suggest you to write about your ordeal and progress till now to:
christian.meunier@stellantis.com
(CEO, Jeep Stellantis)

Note that this was his take, and may be a relevant reference, in case it makes any sense: https://auto.hindustantimes.com/auto...778551658.html

It may not help, but there's no harm trying. If this guy receives mails from actual customers, may be he will create the right pressure for this country's market.

[shashanka]

Originally Posted by civic-sense

Have you heard of the bathtub curve? Any new item has a higher chance of failure and then the graph comes down and increase towards the end of its life.

Ever since I discovered that I am getting old (some 10 years ago) I resolved to buy only reliable cars for peace of mind. But with the choices available in the market, it is hard to find one that is reliable, safe and fun to drive. So you have to make compromises. I did end up buying a compass after 5 trouble-free years with a Ford Ecosport because there was no car available which ticked all the three boxes - reliable, safe and fun to drive. And I wasn't willing to compromise in the latter two and for the sake of reliability alone. That resolve automatically excluded all marutis and hyundais from the shopping list - which is like 80% of all cars in the Indian market.

Four years down the line, even with all the troubles I have had with my car, I feel that it is the best car yet that I have brought into my garage.

Does this make me a fanboy? You bet!

That's a neat one - the 'bath tub curve' I mean. The only curve that pops into my mind is the B-H curve in magnetic hysteresis. And I must admit that I have had enough time to get used to getting old - I'm 70+ and I'm mostly happy with that. My idea of automotive nirvana is reliability, durability and abuse-friendliness. And barring the occasional hiccup, I've found it in my Tata Sierra (the original), my M&M Scorpio and currently the BS6 Thar. With a couple of Eecos thrown in for good measure. Of course that puts me firmly in the body-on-frame (I'll leave the Eecos out!), RWD/AWD/4WD corner since I cant abide FWD hatchbacks, big or small. And apart from one brief dalliance with a Hyundai Getz, I've kept my distance from all FWD contraptions.

So let's just agree to disagree - to each his own.

[CEF_Beasts]

Originally Posted by jeetumg27

In the latest issue of ACI, there is a comparison between the Jeep Meridian and the Toyota Fortuner (Legender).

They have picked the Meridian as it is better value, more refined etc.

This horror story is a clear example of that:
- Premium brands not working on Sundays!? They should be giving 24 hours service.
- No help or pickup service provided when stranded. This is clearly on the dealer too; it goes a long way in showing the ethos & empathy on part of both the brand and the dealership. If they can’t understand a consumer’s pain & frustration, even the best product in the world cannot save them.

But the bullet-proof reliability that Toyota is known for is sort of taken for granted. The primary purpose of a vehicle is to take you from point a to b, whatever the condition of the vehicle - everything else is after that.

Well ACI won't and will never get it!

Their long-term cars are sent for servicing and paid for by the manufacturer and not them. If their long-termer car stalls on the road, they will chuck it there and then, and jump into another of their short/long termers and move on. The manufacturer of the stalled car will deal with it and not ACI.

Only a real customer paying through his nose, knows the difference between the actual upkeep and various other after-sales aspects between a Jeep and Toyota.

OT: What were they trying to compare between the Meridian 4x4 and Fortuner 4x2 is best known to them! And I'm not surprised by the result, ACI is an out and out Fortuner hater. Yes I agree wholeheartedly that the Fortuner's ride quality and price increase every few months is obnoxious to say the least, but the higher price paid goes somewhere known for their bulletproof reliability and brilliant after-sales network, and not for features which will not be used 6 months down the line. As long as the basics are fundamentally sorted, the Fortuner will continue ruling the market.

Since 2016, ACI has been carrying out comparison tests of these heavy-weight SUVs, the only SUV constant in them is the Fortuner, which says a lot about the product even if it's not the best, the others have either left the market or are merely selling low double digits. By now they should’ve known the outcome of all those comparisons.

[inwester]

Sorry to hear that you have to go through this ordeal, that too with a brand new car.

However, I'm not entirely surprised to hear about this with the Jeep brand, especially the Compass model. Not sure how different the car is compared to what's available here in the US, but I personally know multiple folks who have had nothing but trouble with this specific car.

Unsurprisingly, it also scores pretty low in the reliability surveys.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/money...vs/6385214001/

[Poitive]

Dear Jeep,

This is an interesting situation for you to be in. A bunch of enthusiasts - the kind who like your cars and one's whose word of mouth has a trickle-down effect amongst their peer-groups - is watching this closely.

Please see this as an opportunity to recover some of your goodwill. Do what is reasonable and right to make the customer not feel cheated of his earnings. This would need both sides to be reasonable while not forgetting that Jeep does charge a premium for it's products and would be expected to treat their customers accordingly. It is for the customer and the company to decide what a reasonable, acceptable, and happy way forward might be.

I am pretty sure if good measures are taken by Jeep to resolve this, ending with the customer being happy, T-Bhpians will also share this good outcome with many. This alone is worth something and would likely offset the costs Jeep might have to bear in process. Image building and marketing costs are quite large for any such company.

Kind Regards,
A T-Bhpian

[manson]

Originally Posted by black.beauty

Many have suggested to give the car back and get full refund or a different car altogether. How does that work? Will they transfer the ownership to the Dealer? Is it common to get a full refund for a car?

Originally Posted by Geo_Ipe

That part is easier said than done and almost never happens.

If at all it happens, the car gets deregistered and goes back to the plant for R&D. The manufacturer and the dealer shares the loss.

Replacing the defective car is usually the most convenient option to the manufacturer. The oldest trick in the trade is to palm off the defective car through one of their used car channel partners and provide a brand new replacement car to the customer. The loss in resale is most certainly insignificant, and a company will only gain from the car being out on the road (service costs, parts, body shop, etc.) than scrapping it and writing it off as defective.

[abhijit 2284]

Originally Posted by inwester

Sorry to hear that you have to go through this ordeal, that too with a brand new car.

However, I'm not entirely surprised to hear about this with the Jeep brand, especially the Compass model. Not sure how different the car is compared to what's available here in the US, but I personally know multiple folks who have had nothing but trouble with this specific car.

Unsurprisingly, it also scores pretty low in the reliability surveys.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/money...vs/6385214001/

from a very humorous point of view have you checked who's on number 27 .

[Mannu]

Originally Posted by abhijit 2284

from a very humorous point of view have you checked who's on number 27 .

Going bit off topic on this thread, but of the top ten in the list, 8 are Japs. Says a lot about their processes which translates into a reliable automobile.
Also, Japanese manufacturers keep a close watch on their dealers which translates into better customer service.

[inwester]

Originally Posted by abhijit 2284

from a very humorous point of view have you checked who's on number 27 .

Ha ha yes, 27.

I actually terminated the lease and returned that last weekend. Couldn't take the bumpy ride anymore.

Still have the #20 though (they're all leases, so no worries about maintenance).