[anujsd]

Originally Posted by bimmer1988

There are two answers to it. Either the luxury brands are selling their cars for cheap or Toyota is pricing their cars on a higher scale. And if it is the latter, I do have a problem with it. Maintain the global order of pricing. Had the luxury cars been priced at 50 lac, and camry at 40, I would probably have accepted it as ok because of taxation reasons and what not. But when luxury cars are able to offer their cars at 40, I kind of expect toyota to offer their cars at 30, because the same tax rules apply to both of them.

I hope I was able to make my point. In totality, I would like the discussion to steer in the direction of why pricing is not adhering to the global pricing scale (camry priced lower than luxury compacts), and avoid talks and justification around why camry is a good car that suits a specific set of people.

There are aot of variables that go into pricing of a vehicle. It's not a simple divide and multiply with the tax / currency exchange. Most of the luxury brands assemble their base level models in India leading to lower taxes (54% on import of parts). Mercedes has even localized parts to a decent level. Camry however is a CBU. Hence higher taxes (110% on import) .

I believe all companies have their own pricing strategies to ensure sustenance. It's all about the value a customer sees in the product and experience provided. If Toyota and it's Camry customers are happy in the niche segment making a decent profit, what's to stop them.

[AMG1]

Originally Posted by anujsd

Camry however is a CBU. Hence higher taxes (110% on import) .

CAMRY IS A CKD, not CBU here, and outrageously priced compared to the Germans. Camry in its defense has extremely high levels of equipment (even a touchscreen rear center armrest), rear reclining seats, 200+ engines, and much more. 12 kmpl in city fuel economy is like the cherry on top of an extremely comforting but pricey cake.

[anujsd]

Originally Posted by AMG1

CAMRY IS A CKD, not CBU here, and outrageously priced compared to the Germans. Camry in its defense has extremely high levels of equipment (even a touchscreen rear center armrest), rear reclining seats, 200+ engines, and much more. 12 kmpl in city fuel economy is like the cherry on top of an extremely comforting but pricey cake.

My bad.. it's not a CBU or a CKD, it's an SKD. Semi knocked down kits with the entire engine with the hybrid motor being imported

[pd1108]

In Dubai, I checked out the Camry. It had ADAS functionality as a part of its offer. Is Toyota skipping that for India spec of the 2022 model? If they are offering it, then the asking price would be compelling? Any info on this?

[JoshMachine]

Originally Posted by pd1108

In Dubai, I checked out the Camry. It had ADAS functionality as a part of its offer. Is Toyota skipping that for India spec of the 2022 model?

I asked for the ADAS (“Safety Sense”, in Toyota speak) during my test drive, but the Sales advisor mentioned that it is not available on the Indian variant.
To corroborate the same, I tried to locate the camera/ radar sensor on the windshield and the bumper, but couldn’t locate.

[goenkakushal]

It would be interesting to note that the actual cost of these cars which are above 50 Lacs is only about 26-30 lacs.

We have GST of 28% and in addition to that a cess of 20 - 22 % which makes it 48-50%.

If these were not enough we have additional road tax which is very high in Maharashtra, Karnataka . Which is around 13-15% for individuals and 20% for company.

Car Price Ex Factory- 28.50 Lacs
Add GST 28% 7.98 Lacs
Add Cess 22% 5.70 Lacs
Car Ex Showroom 42.18 Lacs
Add Road Tax @15% 6.32 Lacs
Insurance 6.20 Lacs

Total On road Cost 54.70 Lacs

TOTAL TAX PAID 7.98 + 5.70 + 6.32 = 20 LACS
Total tax of 20 lacs for a vehicle which the manufacturer actually sells at 28.50 Lacs.

THIS COMES TO A MIND BOGGLING 70% + TAX

After looking at this breakup you will agree that government is making more money than the Car Manufacturers. Cars are cheap in India but Taxes are V High.
If anyone can provide breakup for USA or UAE it will be a good comparison.

[amalji]

Originally Posted by goenkakushal

Car Price Ex Factory- 28.50 Lacs
Add GST 28% 7.98 Lacs
Add Cess 22% 5.70 Lacs
Car Ex Showroom 42.18 Lacs
Add Road Tax @15% 6.32 Lacs
Insurance 6.20 Lacs

Total On road Cost 54.70 Lacs

TOTAL TAX PAID 7.98 + 5.70 + 6.32 = 20 LACS
Total tax of 20 lacs for a vehicle which the manufacturer actually sells at 28.50 Lacs.

THIS COMES TO A MIND BOGGLING 70% + TAX

When I bought my crysta a few years back, ( 23 lakhs ex-showroom price ), Toyota insurance with all bells and whistles costed around 1 lakh INR on top of which they gave a 15k discount. What's the logic for spiking that by 6x for less than 2x the price increase???

[roy_libran]

Originally Posted by goenkakushal

Total On road Cost 54.70 Lacs

TOTAL TAX PAID 7.98 + 5.70 + 6.32 = 20 LACS
[b]Total tax of 20 lacs for a vehicle which the manufacturer actually sells at 28.50 Lacs.

THIS COMES TO A MIND BOGGLING 70% + TAX

After looking at this breakup you will agree that government is making more money than the Car Manufacturers.

Maybe you forget to add the 20 odd lakhs the government would have already received as Income Tax for someone to be able to spend 55 lacs?

[padmrajravi]

Originally Posted by amalji

When I bought my crysta a few years back, ( 23 lakhs ex-showroom price ), Toyota insurance with all bells and whistles costed around 1 lakh INR on top of which they gave a 15k discount. What's the logic for spiking that by 6x for less than 2x the price increase???

That is probably a typo. Insurance will be in the range of 1.6 lakhs.

[goenkakushal]

Originally Posted by roy_libran

Maybe you forget to add the 20 odd lakhs the government would have already received as Income Tax for someone to be able to spend 55 lacs?

Hope you are not being sarcastic.
Although what you said is true but I claim depreciation on vehicle for Tax purpose.
So its kind off give and take, hence not considered

[amalji]

Originally Posted by roy_libran

Maybe you forget to add the 20 odd lakhs the government would have already received as Income Tax for someone to be able to spend 55 lacs?

This is what the real truth is. Sometimes, you feel like working for the government. To buy a car which costs 28 lakhs, you end up spending 68 lakhs in total ( 20 lakhs income tax and another 20 lakhs on GST + Road tax )

[FAIAAA]

Test drove the 2022 Camry Hybrid and here are my observations, in the city and on the highway:

Positives
- Good looking car, from all angles
- Good paint job (the "metal stream metallic" color looks good !! )
- High quality interiors
- Fantastic head, shoulder and leg room.
- Great seats all round especially the rear seats with the touchscreen console for the rear passengers.
- Good suspension

Negatives
- Price , ~48 Lacs in NCR (steep premium over Superb. 3-5 Lacs would have been understandable IMHO. Not 8-10 Lacs)
- The actual driving experience - sluggish in Eco, average in Normal and "no where near the Europeans" in Sport mode. The CVT "rubberband" effect can be clearly felt.
- Low profile tyres (the SA was nervous over big potholes)
- Body roll is evident when pushed hard around the corners. Found it to be "wallowy" at highway speeds
- Rear AC wasn't effective in 37 degrees.

In summary, this is a great car for
- primarily chauffeur- driven folks.
- someone looking for understated luxury, comfort, quality, reliability, good ASS, low maintenance bills

Those who are self driven and crave for the "fun to drive" element, should look elsewhere.

[SR-71]

Originally Posted by FAIAAA

- Good suspension

Actually this is one point I forgot to mention in my earlier post. While the suspension was generally good, I found it bottoming out when I went over sharp speed breakers even in low speeds. I did not scrape but the bottoming out was quiet evident.

[MarutiGuy1977]

OT + Noob question - Why has the Toyota Corolla (Altis) been discontinued in India while the Toyota Camry is still being sold? Corolla is still a solid offering (notwithstanding Toyota's pricing strategy) and I would still prefer to pick this up against many similarly priced cars (or MUVs/SUVs).

[DicKy]

Originally Posted by MarutiGuy1977

OT + Noob question - Why has the Toyota Corolla (Altis) been discontinued in India while the Toyota Camry is still being sold? Corolla is still a solid offering (notwithstanding Toyota's pricing strategy) and I would still prefer to pick this up against many similarly priced cars (or MUVs/SUVs).

Beats me, only Toyota may know why.

They say TNGA is cost prohibitive. The Camry is on TNGA.

They say the sedan segment is dead. The Camry is as sedan as it can be.

Yet, The Corolla is dead for India. To rub salt in the wound, they are not even planning to bring the Corolla Cross here. If they are happy with sales of the Camry to warrant bringing in the facelift, they could very well bring the Corolla too. Especially since the Octavia has paved a good margin for pricing.