[COMMUTER]

I'm sure all of us are using mobile phones, computers and laptops which are made in China only. Our governments will not allow us to manufacture good quality products and even if they do the it will be exclusively for the purpose of exports. We will be allowed to consume first quality goods only after handing out disproportionate taxes which have no other purpose but to serve as psychological barriers. Hence there is nothing wrong in buying Chinese products which the Chinese are bring to us after another round of 'successful negotiations' with our politicians.

[blacksport]

Originally Posted by wrongturn

Remember the 'hindi-chini bhai bhai' (Indians and chinese are brothers) slogans, and they gifted us the war of 1962. A large portion of our nation is still under illegal chinese occupation. China is anti-India, it has proved the same by it's actions very clearly and the world knows it...

Make no mistake. We contributed our fair share to the turmoil - Tibet. And then there is Baluchistan and Tamil Eelam. There are no saints here.

If there is something preventing a war between India and China it is trade. Free trade is the only thing that will bring peace to the world.

If MG succeeds in India it would be one small but sure step towards lasting peace.

but we just would ignore that fact because maybe our sense of patriotism or national pride died during the brutal 200 years of british rule, where our only basic instinct was to remain alive by any means necessary. So even today, for some of us the word Indian doesn't hold any ounce of pride infact some are ashamed of being called Indian.

There is nothing to be proud of in being born in a piece of land you didn't choose. As somebody said, false sense of superiority often originates from a deep rooted inferiority complex. People who feel inferior try to cherry pick small achievements, inflate it and try to feel good.

In reality there are better places, people, cultures around the world.

[delta5]

I have always preferred certain foreign manufacturers over our home grown manufacturers due to lack of appealing products. However, when it comes to choice between buying Chinese vs Indian, I would definitely pick the Indian car even if it's a bit inferior but safe.

One might assume that I am being jingoistic, it's not the case. It's only because I feel the Chinese needs to be treated in the same way they treat others. The Chinese government openly promoted boycotting Japanese cars and also during the missile defence system installation in Korean peninsula, the Chinese people were asked to boycott Korean products.
Hyundai and Kia took such a bad hit that they never recovered and shutting down plants.

Look at their latest sales result here.

Quote
"Korean cars took up more than 10 percent of car sales in China until 2014. Before Beijing encouraged a consumer boycott on Korean brands amid diplomatic row over installment of a U.S anti-missile system in 2016, Korean share in the Chinese car market stayed above 8 percent.

Hyundai Motor Group this year has embarked on organizational realignment to address its poor performance in China. It will plug off a Hyundai factory in Beijing and a Kia production line in Yancheng next month. The Yancheng plant is expected to be handed over to Kia’s Chinese partner Yueda Group to turn out electric vehicles."
Unquote
Cheers,
D.

[mayankk]

Sorry, but isn't the government system essentially a collective that is a single person representing lakhs and millions of citizens in a house?
And, isn't it the government who should then make it so that "unpatriotic" stuff is not sold in India?
So, is Chinese cars being allowed to be sold here a government yojna to test the patriotism of the general public?

[rajshenoy]

Firstly we have seen multiple Chinese cars which flopped big time (premier Rio, Chevy enjoy to name a few)

I don't think they bombed because our patriotism was all time high those days. They did only because they appeared flimsy and not built to last.

Cars are still aspirational unlike mobiles which are part of our lives. In a decade or so, we will catch up with the west BUT future of fossil fuels themselves are plus chocked cities mean that cars may never become a commodity.

Currently the debate is focused around MG and I bet this car will not come cheap. This will only compete with upper D segment cars and it is too early to tell it's success. We all know what happened to rexton. But irrespective of that I don't think we should link success or failure of this car to patriotism.

[Holyghost]

Are we stooping to such a low that now a persons patriotism is going to be judged by what he drives? We have already seen the patriotism being judged on what we eat or against whom we vote/support on WhatsApp/Facebook? It is strange that now it is coming from Team-bhp which consists of educated and technically sound members who has enjoyed the technical advancements from around the world in the form of internet, laptops, mobiles, cars and bikes!

[jaganpec2002]

Originally Posted by Holyghost

Are we stooping to such a low that now a persons patriotism is going to be judged by what he drives? We have already seen the patriotism being judged on what we eat or against whom we vote/support on WhatsApp/Facebook? It is strange that now it is coming from Team-bhp which consists of educated and technically sound members who has enjoyed the technical advancements from around the world in the form of internet, laptops, mobiles, cars and bikes!

I am actually surprised that you think that "patriotism being judged on what we eat or against whom we vote/support on WhatsApp/Facebook" is done by illiterate or technically dumb people. It is nothing to do with education and it is human nature. And all the big scams in India are done by educated, highly talented people with the help of officials in big jobs (again highly educated and intelligent people). We, humans, are selfish by nature and try to find some reasons to justify how good we are. As some one already posted, we may not pay taxes, pay bribes and do not vote but look for some reason to say we are patriotic? This is one such reason.

On a lighter note have you not seen people who buy a car but still claim that they care about environment/nature cause they bought a petrol car? . It is like that.

[wrongturn]

Originally Posted by blacksport

Make no mistake. We contributed our fair share to the turmoil - Tibet. And then there is Baluchistan and Tamil Eelam. There are no saints here.

If there is something preventing a war between India and China it is trade. Free trade is the only thing that will bring peace to the world.

If MG succeeds in India it would be one small but sure step towards lasting peace.

There is nothing to be proud of in being born in a piece of land you didn't choose. As somebody said, false sense of superiority often originates from a deep rooted inferiority complex. People who feel inferior try to cherry pick small achievements, inflate it and try to feel good.

Please forgive me if I am wrong but I am sorry to say this but your whole post screams that you have an inferiority complex about being Indian. Tibet, Baluchistan, Tamil Eelam aren't the situations our government funded to happen unlike Kashmir or exodus of Tibetans by chinese, and those Indian governments had an agenda of their own. This is not that 'India' neither are we dealing with the same 'china'.

If free trade is the only way to peace then why do nations or even UN impose economic sanctions in hostile times.

Indian government cannot expressly void chinese to trade on our soil, I agree with the fact that it brings in a lot of investment and jobs, but if we boycott that product the losses will force their government to rethink about the strategy and nature of relationship they have with India right now. We have the power here to make the change or else they would laugh all the way to the bank without breaking any sweat while still being hostile towards us. Capitalism and expansion are the two pillars on which the china stands and you can't expect that to change just with free trade, they are not going to have a change of heart miraculously. This isn't a fairy tale.

Chinese car market is going through a bad patch, that's why they have their eyes on India now, after so long. It's all about milking the potential market and nothing else. Chinese cars aren't the real product here, Indians are.

In reality there are better places, people, cultures around the world.

Please name those places, people, cultures and how they treat a hostile nation so we may learn a thing or two from them.

Are only those who according to you are better are entitled to patriotism or superiority complex and we must consider ourself backward and inferior beings just beacuse we were born here? I would have felt proud of being a human, and would have had a sense of self respect no matter the land or culture I would have been born in.

I am extremely proud of my heritage, culture, history and motherland. 500 years of bad period isn't going to change the fact that this was once the greatest nation of all for thousands of years. I don't want to get into debate on this here, but Sir I don't have any sort of inferiority complex about being an Indian, I am extremely proud of it.

[Holyghost]

Originally Posted by jaganpec2002

I am actually surprised that you think that "patriotism being judged on what we eat or against whom we vote/support on WhatsApp/Facebook" is done by illiterate or technically dumb people.

There goes another judgement. Why do people have to assume things on their own and come to such conclusions about what/who a person is? World is not just black and white buddy, there are other shades of grey. Just because I am not white, doesn't mean I am black.
The same is applicable for the so called patriotism as well.

Originally Posted by prithvibelli

Many people here say that it should be the government who should be taking such policy decisions and not the people. But is there is a caveat to that?

Since India is a signatory to the WTO and other international trade bodies, is taking such policy decisions by the government permissible, and if so at what cost.
If such policy decisions involves heavy cost to India, then does it not fall to the people to do whats best for the nation?

Isn't this a really dangerous situation for a country? Wasn't this the very same reason revolts, riots and terrorism had ripped apart and destroyed many countries and cultures around the world?

Who are these people who decides what is best for their nation against a written contract with WTO? And who guides these people?

What happens when such a group of people thinks that some parts of our Constitution is not good for the country and they have to do their own bit of action themselves because the Govt's hands are tied?

What happens when such group thinks some sections of our IPC, CrPC is not in the best interest of the country and so they have to take the law on their own hands because the Govt or Police cannot do anything against that written law? Or is it what that is happening in different parts of the country?

[theMandarin]

There are two points here.

A
People act as per their convenience.
I will take a stand as long as I have an alternative where I don’t have to make a compromise beyond a particular threshold. A simple example: I prefer UPI instead of other payment platforms like PayTM, Airtel Money because I have a choice and more importantly I get the discounts either way. There definitely will be a threshold where the discounts on PayTM are so good and not available anywhere else that i'd be forced to use it. Things haven't reached that threshold and therefore I can claim I will "never" use it.
It is not "convenient" to boycott all Chinese goods unless you want to live like a saint but even then the sandals might be made in China. People who voted that it is un-patriotic to buy a Chinese car are definitely using some Chinese product each day. They voted yes because they don’t have to buy the car and can work their way around it.

B
Cars are not a completely rational purchase.
A car might be the perfect car in the world but if it doesn't strike a chord with you, you won't buy it. This thought process goes both ways. I might have my reservations about Chinese influence/actions/animosity towards India but if they churn a car that is so good, these reservations may be ignored. It is all hypothetical and we cannot predict how each of us may react when presented with that choice no matter how we vote on this poll.

If patriotism was such a big factor in our decision making, we would never have the trade deficit that we have with China today.

[wrongturn]

Originally Posted by Holyghost

There goes another judgement. Why do people have to assume things on their own and come to such conclusions about what/who a person is? World is not just black and white buddy, there are other shades of grey. Just because I am not white, doesn't mean I am black. The same is applicable for the so called patriotism as well. Isn't this a really dangerous situation for a country? Wasn't this the very same reason revolts, riots and terrorism had ripped apart and destroyed many countries and cultures around the world?
Who are these people who decides what is best for their nation against a written contract with WTO? And who guides these people?

There are always two sides of a coin. These people are also the kind that brings about a revolution. For example Mahatma Gandhi. Then there are some who turn into terrorists in name of baseless fantasies.

Boycotting a product of a hostile nation which in this case is a car, which is a product of a state owned chinese car company, is a positive form of revolt which doesn't involve any kind of violence, so I am not sure where you are heading with your argument.

Can we, the people of India, forget and disregard the importance of the Swadeshi Movement and it's contribution in our Independence Movement. Would we gladly welcome another East India Company in name of fair trade and liberalism? Would we never learn anything from history, ever?

For some boycotting a car of a hostile nation is a new 'low' on patriotism? whilst buying one would make you a 'high' on what? IMHO It's a new high that people of our nation are once again becoming proud of their motherland, people care about the respect this nation and it's citizens and it's a new high on patriotism that we are discussing boycotting a chinese car on an Indian car forum.

[humyum]

Firstly, I don't think its unpatriotic at all to buy anything from China because the government of India itself buys a lot of things from China

- For example, the rakes for the Nagpur Metro are coming from China

- India reduces duties on 3,142 imports from China, Asia-Pacific nations

https://www.business-standard.com/ar...0200497_1.html

When we were working on a project, our company imported crores worth of goods from China because the Indian guys just could not match the price.

There are many more such examples, don't live in this guilt trip, if Indian government wanted to ban goods from China because of its relationship with China, they should ban it, we won't buy it because it won't be available, when they themselves are facilitating its import, buying stuff themselves from China, why should us the common man think any further?

[wrongturn]

Please read this recent article on the Hindu bussiness line, this will let you know how china is unfairly suppressing imports from India.

https://www.google.co.in/amp/s/www.t...13964.ece/amp/

Just to throw a light on the stand of Indian Government, if Indian government was all liberal on chinese companies there would have been a chinese bank in every major town in India, and our market would have been flooded by their EVs by now.

I really wish that we had honest friendly relations with china, that would have been an immensely progressive factor for the people of both nations, but chinese policies have always been anti-India. Hence I will keep boycotting their products as much as I can.

[rapid_fire]

This is actually a topic that merits a Good debate. I dont really think buying Indian products is a way to show off your patriotism. The more important factor to consider is “Supporting our economy” than “being a patriot”. I am not talking about cars here, about everything thing we use in our day today life. If we buy home grown brands and goods, it will definitely help our economy. It is help to strengthen the ever depreciating Indian rupee, and our market. This is an issue that will have an afect our every day life. If we are heavily dependent on foreign product, it will eventually weaken our currency and economy.

Most of the people in developed countries are very well aware of this fact, and in those countries, for example I have been to New Zealand recently, and the most important used tag line for advertising there is “100% kiwi owned”.

On the flip side, the manufacturer here are also need to bring up with quality products. Many of the Indian manufacturers are focusing on lowering the cost rather than providing the quality stuff. If good quality made in india products are available, i would alway prefer them over the imported ones. But unfortunately those are hard to find in todays market.

[Holyghost]

Originally Posted by wrongturn

For some boycotting a car of a hostile nation is a new 'low' on patriotism? whilst buying one would make you a 'high' on what? IMHO It's a new high that people of our nation are once again becoming proud of their motherland, people care about the respect this nation and it's citizens and it's a new high on patriotism that we are discussing boycotting a chinese car on an Indian car forum.

You are talking about hatred towards a country and that country's car manufacturer and mixing it up with Patriotism. I don't think spreading hatred can ever bring about a positive revolution in any country; it only creates criminals and terrorists. But comparing that hatred with someone like Mahatma Gandhi and his peace movements! I don't have words.

Where was this patriotism when America was providing military equipment's and financial support to Pakistan until a few years ago? Did we boycott American cars? Did we boycott American jobs?

Govt of India has not declared China as its enemy country or a Hostile country nor has it stopped legal trade with China. We have elected a Government in a democratic manner to take care of the country and decide on its International relations. And irrespective of what happens at the Indo-China border, anyone who destroys or burns another Indian citizens car or property is a criminal. He should be punished and be put in jail as per the law of the land.