Team-BHP - Rumour: Honda India starts test production of Civic & CR-V

I don't know if cost factor is actually at play for Honda. Apart from enthusiast, most buyers will not like that their SUV comes with only 1.5 ltr engine. 2.4 sounds more like a big engine for the money they are paying. I believe that most buyers will not get into the details of turbocharged and advanced technology on small engines.
They just want a bigger engine because they are paying big money. Just my thoughts

As a diehard Honda fan, I am deeply disappointed with Honda's decision to bring the CR-V with only the 120 bhp engine - atleast there should have been the option of the higher powered engine. It is time they stopped looking at profits and save the brand from further irreparable damage.

Autocar says the difference in 0-100 kmph times is only about 1.5 seconds - to that I say, it is the difference between a good car and a great one.

I think the new CR-V will do pretty well - it has really good looking interiors and will be very efficient too!

But what worries me is the Honda philosophy in India where performance has well and truly taken a backseat in their new cars.

A Honda without performance is just a Maruti - maybe with slightly better interiors - so why should I pay a premium? Even the much vaunted resale value of older Honda sedans is now gone.

Would the Amaze have been a success, if the Dzire also had a Diesel CVT?

Why not let the customer decide if they are willing to pay more ? after all Honda used the 2 engine tactic to very good effect 20 years ago when the City was offered 1.3L and 1.5L engines.

The City was an average car with the 1.3L petrol but a great one with the 1.5L engine.

I dont think a 140 BHP Civic with CVT auto cuts it either - thats just about 20 bhp more than the current City - it needs atleast 170 bhp I feel and they really should bring in the 1.5L turbo-petrol as the range topper (in limited numbers if need be).

Honda's new tagline should be:"Bringing Run of the Mill cars to the Indian consumer, cause we dont think they deserve better!"

P.S: we have two Honda cars that we dearly love in our family.

A CR-V with 120 horses sure sounds bland to me, at least on the paper. With cars having equal or more power at half the price at which CR-V would be launched, it sure is disappointing.

It will be interesting to see the type of buyer (niche) it would attract with the likes of proper SUV's like Fortuner and Endeavour at the supposedly same price band.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Behemoth (Post 4426238)

Power in diesel engines is very relative and it is actually the torque curve which matters more.

Very true and agreed. Not countering that in anyway, but replying since you had quoted my post-

My query was why there is no talk of a diesel engine for the Civic? Honda should consider plonking the 120hp diesel into the CIvic as well - to take on the Corolla, Elantra and Octavia diesels. Opening post and news article only mentions petrol options for Civic.

I would not read too much into the BHP and torque figures on paper. The cars should be put on a dyno for actual results.

With so many BHPians commenting on the Compass acceleration times, especially from standstill, I am pretty sure that there are huge transmission losses and when on a Dyno it may return probably 130 bhp at the wheels.

End of day a 1.5 ltr 120 bhp CRV may be just as quick as a 170 bhp Compass.

In previous Race Dynamics dyno tests, most manufacturer vehicles including the Octavia( pre facelift) reported lower on Bhp/torque compared to what was stated in the brochures. If I remember right , the Hyundai cars were pretty close to the stated figures.

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/modifi...tock-cars.html

Request the RD team to upload latest tests of vehicles on the page link above. It will really help the Team BHP community.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arjun Reddy (Post 4427157)

End of day a 1.5 ltr 120 bhp CRV may be just as quick as a 170 bhp Compass.

Though you are right in saying that the peak power and torque figures don't project the real picture and the complete curves would tell how good performance a car delivers and there are transmission losses etc to blame as well, I wouldn't compare a 2.0 MJD with a 1.5 iDTech. These are relatively heavy vehicles, just think about how bad turbo lag would be in a 1.5. They would use a smallish turbo to curb it to an extent and make it more drivable and put more gear ratios to take care of the poor top end but this all sounds like compromises to me. A twin turbo setup could have made things better actually but then we are not to get it in India for Honda's well known greed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Screwdriva (Post 4427012)

I really hope that the car is priced lower than the current CRV. With a 120 bhp motor, any price above 20 lacs will lead to a sales disaster.

If they can manage to sell the CRV at 20 lacs, you will see more CRVs than Brezzas and Cretas on our roads (yes even with 120 BHP engine)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guna (Post 4431977)

If they can manage to sell the CRV at 20 lacs, you will see more CRVs than Brezzas and Cretas on our roads (yes even with 120 BHP engine)

I highly doubt that they will aim for a 20 lac ex showroom price. My guess is it will start at 26 lacs ex showroom for the 4x2 AT and go upto 28 lacs for the 4x4 AT version. (These are slightly higher than the current price points of the petrol versions) Being a seven seater diesel automatic it will have an advantage over the Compass as well as the Tucson. I see it doing decently well and managing 800-1000 numbers when it is launched.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aaron:) (Post 4432007)

They are definitely going to price it well above the Tucson. I'm thinking Tiguan territory, means 35-37 lakhs on road for the top end diesel.

The current 2 WD AT is at around 24.38 Ex showroom and Honda ideally should not charge a premium of more than 1 lac for the diesel engine in 120 Bhp guise. Anything more than this will not be making customers happy. Add another 25k more for the third row seats. So my guess and wish ! Is that they price it logically around 26-27 lacs ex showroom.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Behemoth (Post 4432006)

I highly doubt that they will aim for a 20 lac ex showroom price. My guess is it will start at 26 lacs ex showroom for the 4x2 AT and go upto 28 lacs for the 4x4 AT version. .

Even I don't think 20 L kind of pricing is possible (even for a entry level variant). I expect the top of the line variant to touch 40 L on-road.