[Sherlocked]

Originally Posted by nivatakavacha

I dont quite understand SVP's comments in his review. Quoting verbatim.....

How can the same engine with the same power spec feel any different in the Swift and the Baleno?

I know that the reduced weight plays a role in it but will the the difference be so stark and obvious? Can anyone tell me why? Have they played around with the gear ratio?

The first gen swift with Fiat 1.3L diesel engine had a stronger turbo boost which could really push you back in the seats but in the later versions Maruti toned it down a bit and it wasn't as much fun to drive as it was earlier.
I think SVP is saying that with the lower weight than the Swift, the engine does feels more responsive and close to first gen Swift.

[AtheK]

Originally Posted by kippu

so if someone can compare the ford figo automatic and the baleno Cvt? or is that a wrong comparison to talk about?

It will be a good comparison, that said I drove the Figo and I did not like it much, and this is one with DCT. I will drive baleno CVT first day, as otherwise I have my mind set on zest AMT. Just waiting for it to launch, one final run to finish line between Jazz CVT, Baleno CVT and Zest AMT, and I will have my city commuter decided.

[WRXXX]

Originally Posted by sunsetorange

People who usually buy the top variants are those who ask about the 6 airbags. When someone can plop 6 airbags and a new engine into a spanking new car and still price it below 10 lakhs , the only reason I can think Suzuki gives their " premium " car 2 airbags and the same engine as their non -premium car, the Swift (their own perspective ) is just an attitude of taking the customers for granted.

Given a choice of 2 or six airbags in a car which your wife would use to drive to work and drop the kids to school on the way, would you choose 2 or six?

A slightly OT here:

I suggest not to fall for Ford's tricky marketing gimmicks alone :-)

I would like to know the wait times and availability of a 6 Airbag version versus 2/1 Airbag version of ford cars. There was a time when I ordered Palio GTX with SP2 and waited patiently for 7 months only to hear excuses from sales teams saying this is a special order Sir, "made for you" Sir etc... and finally ended up getting an Octavia
within three days!!

I have seen many of my friends made to wait for the Ecosport Titanium(plus) version for 7-12 months, and sales team discouraging you not to order such variants. This only tells they make very little profits and not realistic for manufacturer either. These are there to attract the customer to the showroom thats all. And hence I consider them as marketing gimmick as apposed to any concern to passenger safety alone!

May be I am mistaken,
I agree 6 airbags might come to use in highway or expressways, but in Indian Cities where this car will find its time, you are paying for it for your own mental satisfaction.
I would be more worried about crossing the roads with kids in Indian cities than lack of 6 airbags in my car really!!

Only way you can make car manufacturers give decent safety equipment and compete using the safety ratings is to have crash and safety tests as a norm and hopefully that is going to happen soon too.I personally think till the Baleno price comes out lot of things cannot be said. Can I call a car which has 6 airbags as premium today? Of course yes!
This is the same way I used to call cars with airbags itself 15 years ago in India!!!

As you can see it is tough to satisfy everyone, thats why we have different car manufacturers too :-)

[hybridpetrol]

Originally Posted by WRXXX

I have seen many of my friends made to wait for the Ecosport Titanium(plus) version for 7-12 months, and sales team discouraging you not to order such variants. This only tells they make very little profits and not realistic for manufacturer either. These are there to attract the customer to the showroom thats all. And hence I consider them as marketing gimmick as apposed to any concern to passenger safety alone!

Agreed. Dealers usually find it easy to get most popular car variants.
If majority of the people order the top variant with 6 airbags, then the production lines will function accordingly, and the sales people will try to convince people on the comfort features available on such variant.

A few examples:
For Alto 800, though a VXi version was available, the SA suggested to get the LXI version, and add only the required features as after market. The airbag version was not available. With so many Altos in the stockyard, they would not easily accept an order with airbag.

For S-Cross, the SA told that the Zeta 1.3L version is the most popular and suggested to go with that because it is more VFM. He was not at all ready to talk about or highlight the features of 1.3L Alpha variant or the 1.6L variants. He infact told me fabric seats are better than leather seats, so Zeta makes a strong case! (because leather easily heats up etc).

In that sense, if the dealer wants to promote a particular version, they can do so, but the direction will come from the top. If there is restriction for airbag supply, they would probably try to make a case against such 6 airbag version, and this may be the reason they place the top Figo / Aspire versions about 1L higher than the version below.

Coming back to Baleno, as you said, majority would want only 2 airbags, and they did the right thing in offering it even in their lower most variants. 6 airbag is just to put things into perspective, though Ford doesn't really sell such variant in large number. Whenever companies like Maruti comes up with variants without airbags, they will be reminded and questioned about this 6 airbag version of Figo / Aspire / Ecosport!

[WRXXX]

Originally Posted by The Rationalist

It is Maruti who is shouting 'Premium' from the rooftops. When did an ordinary car start becoming Premium? If you talk premium, back it with Premium features in all ways. Maybe now onwards cars having airbag and ABS can be considered premium! I have no problem with Baleno, but don't say it is superior to other cars, it is just another car.

This is true!
For people who have experienced better cars, none of the cars available in the segment are premium enough. But for a person who has not experienced these features in cars and they could afford now these might turn out to be affordable and premium. So the term "premium" is tricky when used both from manufacturer wise as well as consumer wise.

For example:- what is VW POLO really?? A budget car from world standards but for an Alto800 owner wanting to get that what happens? So we have to compare with a certain perspective of the consumers and the target market really.

The cars in this segment are as much premium as an Android phone for large chunk in India. Not everyone could access iPhone first, but see what has happened?
Features which were exclusive to German luxury cars are being democratized and that phenomena and experience which is new in the segment is what is premium from my perspective. So, we need to see based on Baleno's pricing what kind of consumers it can tempt to upgrade or invite.

[raka1987]

On a lighter note - People out there perceives Merc, BMW, audi as premium cars and here we are fighting for "Baleno as a premium car or not".

Seems maruti has done a wonderful job for opening NEXA as premium brand and creating a halo impact already.

Let's judge this car on basics. That's all. Obviously Maruti has to offer something different than what is already there in the market. Engine is same national engine with same power and torque. Heck even Zest has taken 90ps out of the same engine. Safety features on all variant by Maruti is first(But competition is already doing that). Sorry to say I didn't feel premiumness only in black interiors. By launching this car through Nexa if they want to call it premium then I don't agree to that(no offence to anyon).

[Motard_Blr]

Originally Posted by hybridpetrol

...
For Alto 800, though a VXi version was available, the SA suggested to get the LXI version, and add only the required features as after market. The airbag version was not available. With so many Altos in the stockyard, they would not easily accept an order with airbag.

For S-Cross, the SA told that the Zeta 1.3L version is the most popular and suggested to go with that because it is more VFM. He was not at all ready to talk about or highlight the features of 1.3L Alpha variant or the 1.6L variants. He infact told me fabric seats are better than leather seats, so Zeta makes a strong case! (because leather easily heats up etc).

...

If the SA is trying to push a particular version of a car rather than what the customer is asking for, it's USUALLY because the dealer is stuck with unsold stock. All dealers buy cars stock speculatively before expected high sales periods (festive seasons, etc.) and in some cases, the stock remains unsold because of sales not meeting expectations or cancellations (customer changed his mind, customer could not get loan approval, etc.). Such a situation can give the customer the upper hand in negotiation.

But SOMETIMES, it's because the manufacturer overestimated the demand for a particular model and is in a similar situation as the dealer. In such a case, they will sell the cars at discount to the dealer to promote sales and exhaust the stock.

Either way, the customer stands to benefit, assuming that he or she is interested in buying a slow selling car.

[heavenlybull]

The review by ACI sounds promising. The car has an understated styling with a tried and tested front design and a sober rear (base model looks pathetic though). Interior is not in the same league as Polo, i20 or even the jazz though. Seems a step above Swift only.

At last we have a decent performing 1.2 mill after the disappointing petrols from Honda, Ford and Hyundai. Can't fault Maruti for not giving more exciting engine options. For general pubic premium means great interiors, smashing exterior and lots of space inside and still be able to give excellent fuel economy.

At least they are giving airbags and ABS as standard, which must be applauded.

Looks like this car will effect Polo and Jazz the most. i20 has too much bling and brand name to feel much heat.

[volkman10]

Bookings open officially today for the Baleno.

[AtheK]

I personally do not agree with this approach of opening bookings before disclosing the price by majority of manufacturers these days, seems like a very unfair practice.

I think a better way is to disclose price and open bookings with a disclaimer that cars will be displayed in showroom from a specified date.

[MunnabhaiMBBS]

Images from the official communication:

Source : http://marutistoragenew.blob.core.wi...b7d84e8189.pdf

[itzvicky201]

Looks like we have a start stop button in the offering, a serious miss from Honda in Jazz. The rear thigh support looks average, on par with Jazz and less than i20.

If the pricing touches close to 9L OTR for top end then Ciaz VXI sales will nose dive. At the same time, there can be buyers who would not mind to put another 1.5 L more and get Ciaz ZXI, which seems a pure paisa vasool at this point.

[DieselAddikt]

Originally Posted by WRXXX

May be I am mistaken,
I agree 6 airbags might come to use in highway or expressways, but in Indian Cities where this car will find its time, you are paying for it for your own mental satisfaction.
I would be more worried about crossing the roads with kids in Indian cities than lack of 6 airbags in my car really!!

Only way you can make car manufacturers give decent safety equipment and compete using the safety ratings is to have crash and safety tests as a norm and hopefully that is going to happen soon too.I personally think till the Baleno price comes out lot of things cannot be said. Can I call a car which has 6 airbags as premium today? Of course yes!
This is the same way I used to call cars with airbags itself 15 years ago in India!!!

As you can see it is tough to satisfy everyone, thats why we have different car manufacturers too :-)

You are not at all mistaken my friend. Anybody will be more worried about crossing the road with their children in cities than being worried about lack of airbags in their cars.

But we should also note that the people who wish for 6 airbags may not be the ones who use the cars only in cities. Their purpose of owning the car would be different. Some really really like long distance travel and some are forced to do long distance travel due to nature of work etc. And we all know how treacherous our highways are. Not all of us can afford to buy a million dollar car due to various reasons. More safety never hurts in this case. But yes, for most people 2 airbags would be just about fine. And many do not even care about that (not even seat belts).

Coming to think of it, airbags were something unheard of a while ago in mainstream cars. Now they have started giving it as standard. So the number of airbags coming as a part of standard equipment is also bound to improve over time, which is a good sign.

If Maruti never mentioned it as a PREMIUM offering, I for one, would have been a happier person. Since they mentioned it as a premium offering, people started looking at what is so premium about the offering and then they started pointing out the negatives. If you look at it as just another product from Maruti, it is a wonderful thing to have in the market. But again, I still feel they lost a chance to kill the i20 completely. The not so premium i20 still "looks" more premium than the premium Baleno. Again, that is a personal opinion. From the reports that are coming in, Baleno makes up for the less premium feeling with good ride, handling and FE.

And I agree completely to the last point. Whichever car you buy; you gain some, you lose some. At the end of the day, it depends on each individual as to what he is ready to miss and what he really considers important.

[chncar]

Originally Posted by DieselAddikt

But we should also note that the people who wish for 6 airbags may not be the ones who use the cars only in cities. Their purpose of owning the car would be different. Some really really like long distance travel and some are forced to do long distance travel due to nature of work etc. And we all know how treacherous our highways are. Not all of us can afford to buy a million dollar car due to various reasons. More safety never hurts in this case. But yes, for most people 2 airbags would be just about fine. And many do not even care about that (not even seat belts).

I think it is a mistake to dismiss the importance of side/curtain airbags or consider them to be unnecessary. Sure, the front two airbags take priority over the side/curtain ones but a remarkable number of fatalities (and this is especially so in cities/urban locations with signals) take place when a someone/something crashes into the side of car. Unlike the front which has the engine and larger crumple zones to protect you, the side is very thinly armored on most cars and it takes much less force to create a bad accident.

[SchumiFan]

Originally Posted by chncar

I think it is a mistake to dismiss the importance of side/curtain airbags or consider them to be unnecessary. Sure, the front two airbags take priority over the side/curtain ones but a remarkable number of fatalities (and this is especially so in cities/urban locations with signals) take place when a someone/something crashes into the side of car. Unlike the front which has the engine and larger crumple zones to protect you, the side is very thinly armored on most cars and it takes much less force to create a bad accident.

I am not sure if we will ever get the figures for the monthly sales of the Titanium+ models from Ford but rest assured the market isn't too favorable towards them going by their sightings on the road.

If and when Ford releases Figo with 6 airbags in all its versions, then it would be the epitome of safety (even excluding the non existent crash tests). Until then Baleno offers a large portion of safety to buyers of any of its model than that of Figo. And that in my view is very much commendable.