[Tarun.R]

Just on the topic of RWD cars, would a used 118d + remap not make for a fun hatch priced in the high teens to low twenties?

[CrAzY dRiVeR]

Funny how these threads go!

The Abarth Punto thread mostly had a lot of discussions about the GTi. As if 145hp was not enough at 10L to satisfy our desires. Now the GTi seems to coming with 168hp at 13L, even it can't satisfy our desires and we want the Golf instead.

For a nation of enthusiasts who did not have any such choices till date, we sure are a fussy lot online. Meanwhile, Maruti, Hyundai and Honda- all three of them had their best month ever, with their 'premium' hatchbacks driving home the sales in October.

Let's first welcome the Indian GTI, make it a moderate success, give these manufacturers like FIAT and VW some confidence and then cry for launching an AWD or Golf R, or whatever is needed for India.


That said- What would be the advantages of the Polo GTI over the Abarth Punto, other than the 23 additional horses? The gearbox would also be better, going by the Polo benchmark.

[theredliner]

Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR

That said- What would be the advantages of the Polo GTI over the Abarth Punto, other than the 23 additional horses? The gearbox would also be better, going by the Polo benchmark.

My views:

1. Torque! If the torque output is same as the international version, we are looking at 50% more torque over the Abarth Punto. 320Nm for the manual GTI vs 212Nm for the Abarth.

2. Modification potential: The 1.8 TSI has huge modification potential. With a remap alone, it can apparently cross 245HP at the wheel!
Abarth Punto's gearbox is at torque limit right from the factory. I hope same is not the case with GTI's manual.

[shetty_rohan]

Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR

Funny how these threads go!

The Abarth Punto thread mostly had a lot of discussions about the GTi. As if 145hp was not enough at 10L to satisfy our desires. Now the GTi seems to coming with 168hp at 13L, even it can't satisfy our desires and we want the Golf instead.

Let's first welcome the Indian GTI, make it a moderate success, give these manufacturers like FIAT and VW some confidence and then cry for launching an AWD or Golf R, or whatever is needed for India.

Totally agree. Lets appreciate Fiat and VW in at least trying to launch hot hatches. I hope the VW Polo GTI launch news is not a rumour.

Once VW releases Polo GTI, then we could start asking for more(e.g. 300 HP Golf R).

[differential]

Just wondering why Vw has not considered the 1.4 tsi with either the manual or DSG. Would have made more sense to both consumer and manufacturer. And Vw India already have that engine in their portfolio.

[petrol_power]

Last week, I was in Volkswagen Yard area and I saw nearly 6 GT TSIs and almost 7 - 8 GT TDIs ready in stock yard !!. And that was not the stock for the entire month, but for immediate delivery. I didn't check how many polos would have been there, but may be roughly around 40 nos or I feel even lesser. So 1/4th sale of polo coming from GTs is really good, I feel. (If Mods can get GT version sales for atleast 2 months we can really know the reality).

I guess people like performance hatchbacks (owing to traffic, many people take a hatchback for daily use and who doesn't like to have fun in their daily drive), but not in the price range of A class, Golf, etc. VW can strip down some features (no sunroof, touch screen,etc), give a good engine, decent suspension and feedback, and a choice of manual & automatic. (Lot of people in metro cities buy automatic nowadays no matter he is enthusiastic driver or not).

[ashwin489]

Originally Posted by differential

Just wondering why Vw has not considered the 1.4 tsi with either the manual or DSG. Would have made more sense to both consumer and manufacturer. And Vw India already have that engine in their portfolio.

I thought about this as well. 1.4 TSi makes perfect sense for DQ200 DSG since it can make use of its full torque-handling potential.

VW probably wants to use the 1.8 TSi to secure bragging rights for unquestionably overpowering Abarth T-Jet in the mass-market performance segment. Also, maybe to lure a small segment of enthusiasts from buying a V40, Merc A, BMW-1, Mini or 500, by offering roughly the same power at a fraction of the price.

[GT145]

Now this is super cool. Finally hot hatches are coming to India, hope VW price this sensible. Personally I would love to see 1.4TSI rather than the 1.8TSI. Or maybe both as different variants, with manual and DSG as an option, this will give more options to potential buyers.

[dipen]

It is very much financially possible for VW to plonk the existing 1.4 TSI with 140 hp and price it 2.5 or say 3 lakhs more than the 1.2 highline with some lightly revised exterior bits. The same would also give an ARAI number of 18+ (as Jetta itself is 16+) for mass marketing purpose with power and efficiency mantra.

To me it makes more sense than the speculated 1.8 nearing 15 lakhs unless they sprung a surprise and launch the 1.8 at 11ish ex-showroom for the manual.

[suhaas307]

Originally Posted by dipen

It is very much financially possible for VW to plonk the existing 1.4 TSI with 140 hp and price it 2.5 or say 3 lakhs more than the 1.2 highline with some lightly revised exterior bits. The same would also give an ARAI number of 18+ (as Jetta itself is 16+) for mass marketing purpose with power and efficiency mantra.

To me it makes more sense than the speculated 1.8 nearing 15 lakhs unless they sprung a surprise and launch the 1.8 at 11ish ex-showroom for the manual.

I agree.

However, VW needs to address the gremlins in the chassis / brakes and ensure that it's competent to handle the extra poke. Simply plonking a more powerful engine like what they've done with the GT will not work.

Shoehorning the 1.8 may not work either as the large engine is a very tight fit for the Polo's engine bay. They had to relocate the battery, amongst other things, in order to make it fit. And that will only drive costs up. The 1.4 TSI is the more viable option, IMO and will require less extensive changes thereby helping them keep costs down.

[polo_ankit]

What is this talk of 13 lakhs? The article clearly mentions "in excess of 13 lakhs". And knowing VW, I highly doubt that they would launch a 1.8L at that price range. Even if they do, they'll cheap out of other bits like handbrake leather which is really stupid of them.

Secondly, I've been driving the GT TSI for a while now & I don't think I'd go back to manual. DSG + Paddles is a dream! Only problem being the torque limiter with the DQ200 which can be replaced by the DQ250 I think. They should have an option for the buyer (auto vs manual). Let's hope this isn't another rumour which dies down & something constructive actually happens!

[Vik0728]

So guys, I may sound a bit conventional and old school type but all this was almost bestowed upon me in the last 3 weeks of my run about with the VW service

The 'VW After-Sales' episode started with the EGR on my GT going kaput and needing a replacement. I received a strict instruction from the VW SE that safest option was to ground my GT until the part arrived. I had to use my brother I-gen I20 1.2 for 2 weeks and here's what I realised:

- With a daily B2B commute, a 1.2l underpowered Petrol engine is no different from the 1.6l super quick diesel car.

- Irrespective of the BHP, Torque, 0-100 timings, etc, if you are a person who basically waits for your pay check every month, 5 out of 7 days will get you nowhere in terms of driving pleasure.

- Considering that Polo 1.6 GT TDI was not even an exquisite/exclusive offering, I had to ground my car for over 2 weeks. So guys, you really think these premium models will have an easy & fuss free after sales? I really doubt this bit. So one has to be quite brave to try out any sort of modifications on these highly engineered but probably sensitive products.

- No matter how much potential the car/engine has, >7 out of 10 buyers of such performance hatches will extract >50% of its real capabilities more often than not.

The point I am trying to convey here is that like the others on this thread, I really appreciate and applaud FIAT & VW's efforts in even considering launching such hot hatches. At the end of the day, if I and 4 other friends of mine bought these 2 hot hatches some day:

Our work, family obligations, miscellaneous stuffs will take precedence over us enjoying driving these beauties most of the weekends


P.S - I give a grand solute to these 2 car makers just for being brave enough to cater to Class along with their usual Mass offerings.

[veedub89]

I was in Bombay last week and while I was there, went out to test drive the Vento with a friend who was wanting to pick up a new car.

While we were taking the test drive, I asked the sales rep about the GTI.
He said the launch would happen soon and there would be only 500 cars on offer initially.

Now I don't know, if that will actually be the case but doesn't seem all that implausible. VW is looking to make this a halo car and limiting the numbers should help them in this regard. The price premium over the other Polo's, the superior engine notwithstanding, will also be justified then.

I don't remember who the dealer was but I was somewhere in South Bombay and the Honda dealership was there too.

[Motoringlover]

Originally Posted by Vik0728

Our work, family obligations, miscellaneous stuffs will take precedence over us enjoying driving these beauties most of the weekends


P.S - I give a grand solute to these 2 car makers just for being brave enough to cater to Class along with their usual Mass offerings.

As regular Joe, I don't disagree to the sentiment. I used to drive a remapped Octavia VRS, i used to drive it to work and back, we used to go buy vegetables etc etc.

Now i drive a small hatch or sometimes just a cab, all i can say i miss my VRS a lot, just the ability and having the potential to liberate (within safe operating means) is a pleasure, was the service experience pretty absolutely not, was the end product brilliant absolutely yes. will i do it again - the answer is a big yes.

Don't let routines discourage you from owning a car with potential. I kind of see it as a way of living, within the routines. Sorry mate - totally not related to the car topic, but could not resist.

[Vik0728]

Originally Posted by Motoringlover

Don't let routines discourage you from owning a car with potential. I kind of see it as a way of living, within the routines. Sorry mate - totally not related to the car topic, but could not resist.

Hey Motoringlover please don't be sorry, on the contrary I would like to thank you for getting my point across !!

I really wanted to convey the same thing. Polo GTI with 160 odd horses, Abarth EVO with 140 horses, Polo GT TSI with 100 horses,...does not really matter.

All of these are some brilliant engineering marvels and, we as petrol heads must appreciate and applaud each one of them for their 'From Dream to Reality' journey on Indian soil