[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by rockporiom

If there is one company in india that is worse than tata in service that has to be skoda. I could have also started a skoda thread as many of my friends and family members are suffering from huge repair bills but I didn't.

I have big hopes on Tata for improving their cars and their name in the market. I am sure the market share graph from 6% would at least touch 10%.

BUT,

Skoda is the worst of the lot. No use of getting them in this thread. They will not learn and care for customers and their lives.

Originally Posted by rockporiom

Careless can be rectified but shameless is something that just should be avoided and nothing can be done about it.

No point in talking about Skoda here!

Originally Posted by rockporiom

Yeah but that means that you visited tata A.S.S more in between service internals when compared to the other companies isn't that correct?

You just nailed it man. Have you not read that picture properly that you posted? It says Qualified technicians, 100% assured genuine spare parts and 1 Year warranty on workmanship on all kinds of repairs . If all these are given then the visits to A.S.S decrease. Right?!

Even Toyota, The Leader in reliability and service don't have such an explanation to their service. I guess Tata has the wrong one. We have to send that picture to Toyota rather where it would do justice to the fullest extent.

Anurag.

[mohitk1993]

Originally Posted by sajanjohn

One trend in our forum is month after month is frustrated nephews and neighbors starting a Tata Motors thread with a horror story while last 3 years most of the TATA ownership threads tells a slightly different story.

With due respect to your feelings, none of the members here like to 'bash' TATA, or any other company for that matter just for fun. A majority of the members here have had sub-par experiences with TATA cars and have hence joined such forums to vent their emotions. A customer spending a few lakh rupees on a brand new car expects it to be atleast somewhat reliable and unfortunately, TATA has failed to deliver that.

None of us here expect TATA to be the next Toyota. Far from it. All that we as Indians ask from the company is a basic level of quality that can manage everyday abuse. That's all!

Originally Posted by a4anurag

Somebody please send this thread to Ratan Tata or the higher management!

Even though I somewhat agree, I do not think it would be a good idea to rub salt on their wounds. TATA knows it has made some huge blunders in the past and is all set to rectify it. Give the company some time and I hope we get to see an improved TATA in the near future.

Originally Posted by ritz3645

Problematic Tata cars or Tata service?

Answer = None

The way I see it is we Indians are more mobile than ever, I frequently come across used two years old vehicle done 40K km.

I think 20 K km per year is way more, usually 12k is fine even in Americas.

So if people are driving more we need more reliable vehicles (less breakdown) and support.

It is just that TATA has to adapt, or else 'Who moved my cheese'

Sir, you could not be more mistaken. A car is designed to withstand years of abuse; after all, it costs so much more than a 2-wheeler for that matter. Are you not entitled to a basic level of quality when you pay more than 10 times that of an equivalent motorcycle/scooter?

Regarding American usage patterns, US citizens rank amongst the highest consumers of petroleum in the world and cover the most miles on an yearly basis. Please get your facts right.

[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by mohitk1993

With due respect to your feelings, none of the members here like to 'bash' TATA, or any other company for that matter just for fun. A majority of the members here have had sub-par experiences with TATA cars and have hence joined such forums to vent their emotions.

We all have to take criticism positively and not with a mindset to bash Tata. We have nothing against them but want them to realize where they are and what they are doing to themselves rather than showcase to the world and foreign markets as to how to lead a company.

Originally Posted by mohitk1993

Even though I somewhat agree, I do not think it would be a good idea to rub salt on their wounds. TATA knows it has made some huge blunders in the past and is all set to rectify it. Give the company some time and I hope we get to see an improved TATA in the near future.

I don't mind rubbing that extra salt so that their nerves start functioning and feel the pinch and trouble the customers are facing.

Originally Posted by mohitk1993

Please get your facts right.

+1

Anurag.

[ritz3645]

Originally Posted by rockporiom

That is no excuse for tata cars breaking down all the time. My dzire travelled 45k kms in 2years and there were no issues except for regular maintainence. A better example my 1000 travelled 675000 kms and had only regular expenses and it never broke down even once in the 18 years we owned the car.

Sometime back British company mg had come into partnership with tata to build the indica under their badge named as the rover. The car was basically a rebadged indica. The car got negative reviews from almost all the magzines and shows in uk. It was also declared as the least reliable car and the car was discountinued in 2005 barely 3 years after coming into production. This shows that us Indians have higher tolerance than others, the same car was being sold here for a much longer time and we kept on buying it despite poor customer reviews.

Hi rockporiom, I have never bought a Tata.

I see Tata as a commodity company in cars, and there is a market for it, people have been buying in droves till last year.

Now the problem for Tata, is consumers are comparing with other options and other options are more appealing (apple to apple scenario).

With Tata it is the environment, across india, low TCO, easy inexpensive parts, and even road side garage will fix it.


Will a road side garage touch a big T.

Yes UK reviews were pathetic for Indica, but Indians reviews and sales are a complete opposite, I think sales are The barometer.

Originally Posted by a4anurag

My Ritz VDi has travelled (still travelling though) 100000 kms in 2.8 years, so according to you my car should have broken down a multiple times and I shouldn't be choosing Tata because I have to clock in heavy mileage?

That can't be a reason to defend Tata. I am sorry!

Anurag.

Hi Anurag,
wow 100k another example that we Indians are more mobile than ever. As I said never into Tata products and from the ring side they seems a low TCO environment, and some products are better.

Originally Posted by mohitk1993

Regarding American usage patterns, US citizens rank amongst the highest consumers of petroleum in the world and cover the most miles on an yearly basis. Please get your facts right.

Hi mohitk1993,

I tried, to find average American usage patterns, but umm found Australian, and its in Km 14000 per year for 2012.

link http://www.abs.gov.au/ausstats/abs@.nsf/mf/9208.0

also just realized the KM/Mile thing, so please 12000 miles is what I meant and not KM, which is 19.2 k.

I was assuming 12k mile for American average consumption, I tried and could only find AAA report, which says 2012 cost of ownership was between 6.7k $ to 9.5k $ including gas (for 15k mile), and assuming aprox minimum yearly wages aprox 20k $, should be around that.

link http://newsroom.aaa.com/2012/04/cost...2%80%99-study/

[ameaa]

Originally Posted by rockporiom

Yeah but that means that you visited tata A.S.S more in between service intervals when conpared to the other conpanies isn't that correct? Because that's what I understand from your post correct me if I am wrong.

About the xylo did that happen together? That is seriously shocking did it cause an accident?

I started frequent visits only after buying my Safari and not with indigo. I think this is usual because of old designs still running. About Xylo, brake failed a month back and clutch failed two weeks back. In both cases car was stranded. Brake failed in bangalore traffic at low speed, but the leak had started a day before when it was returning from Kerala and had a very hard braking near Hosur to avoid a moped guy who barged into the highway. Leak was unnoticeable since it was from the rear brake cylinder. Now the reason for leak was the rear brake pad had completely worn off which caused the cylinder piston to protrude more that it it designed for. It was A.S.S fault that they never checked the rear pads during service and the car was at service a month back. At least these things, i can say that Concorde guys are doing a good job because when i gave my safari for 75K service, without even me telling, they opened the rear drum and checked. Same was done at 90K service also.

[9thsphinx]

This post may or may not qualify for this thread, but since this is a Tata bashing thread I thought this may fit in.

A friend owns a fleet of Tata 407 EX2 mini-trucks, which he had bought in bulk, and then some more Mahindra Boleros. Last time when we were talking about business and cars in general, he mentioned how Tata is affecting his business productivity. To him Tata is one of the worst truck manufacturers in the world. He explicitly mentioned that each one of his Tata truck suffers a breakdown every other week. And they've all only run approx 40k kms yet. Because of the frequent breakdowns his goods don't get delivered on time affecting his productivity and the business suffers some losses to an extent. As much as he was dissatisfied with the 407's he was extremely satisfied with the Boleros that he was thinking of replacing all his Tata's with new Bolero's. He said the Bolero's were so well built, he felt, they could last a lifetime!

So there, Tata as a truck manufacturer, at least according to a friend of mine, is a big failure. Mahindra gets a thumbs up!

[mohitk1993]

Originally Posted by a4anurag

We all have to take criticism positively and not with a mindset to bash Tata. We have nothing against them but want them to realize where they are and what they are doing to themselves rather than showcase to the world and foreign markets as to how to lead a company.

Absolutely. Had this been US, UK or even Germany for that matter, TATA would be currently facing multiple lawsuits and would have to pay huge fines for putting precious lives at stake.

Originally Posted by ritz3645

Now the problem for Tata, is consumers are comparing with other options and other options are more appealing (apple to apple scenario).

It was bound to happen. You cannot expect customers to remain under a halo forever, can you?

Till the last decade, Maruti Suzuki was a company that continued to introduce boring designs with no features into the market, assuming that customers will lap it up simply due to the brand name. However, on seeing the changing trends among Indian buyers, MS was quick to realize and started introducing cars that had fresh designs (Swift, Ritz, SX4, etc) and were loaded with features such as ABS and airbags. Very soon, they also improved upon their interior quality and became plusher. The end result is for everyone to see. Even with so much competition around, Maruti Suzuki has managed to hold on to its share and continues to sell in droves.

As times change, everyone has to change according to it. That is the law of nature. Companies that have been stubborn and have stuck to their own principles (read: Kodak and Nokia) have only ended up digging their own grave.

Now, it's all upto TATA to decide which way it's headed.

Originally Posted by 9thsphinx

A friend owns a fleet of Tata 407 EX2 mini-trucks, which he had bought in bulk, and then some more Mahindra Boleros. He explicitly mentioned that each one of his Tata truck suffers a breakdown every other week. Because of the frequent breakdowns his goods don't get delivered on time affecting his productivity and the business suffers some losses to an extent.

Now that is something new. I thought TATA's truck division was fairly reliable and was doing brisk business for the company. It seems I was quite wrong.

[rockporiom]

Was talking to my dad about this thread and came to know somethings that I never knew.

Somewhere in the 80's my dad had gone to tata head office for some business reason where he met the JRD tata and shook hands with him. He goes on to say that suddenly people in the office started treating him as a VIP and he was given an opportunity to test drive the prototype of the first ever indica which was named as the mint. After the test drive he had a chat with the team of engineers. The engineers told him that the car might feel powerful but they told him not to even think about buying the car as tata had done lot of cost cutting to minimise costs.

Can you simply believe that, tata engineers themselves were not confident about the product.

[kutts]

I had a representative from Neilsen which is a market research company visiting me over the weekend to get feedback about my new Tata Nano.

The representative was very particular that the feedback session would be face to face and not a normal telephonic session.

The session was very exhaustive with the conversation recorded on a voice recorder. We covered about 10 pages of questions which literally covered the entire aspects of the car. Everything from the paint job, engines, transmission, A/C, handling, interior fit and finish, fuel economy were covered.

The feedback was a direct Tata Motors initiated one and bypassed the dealers and other mechanisms that normally take feedback from us.

I hope Tata Motors is getting really serious about quality and other issues that kind of define the brand.

[RSR]

Originally Posted by rockporiom

Somewhere in the 80's my dad had gone to tata head office for some business reason where he met the JRD tata and shook hands with him. He goes on to say that suddenly people in the office started treating him as a VIP and he was given an opportunity to test drive the prototype of the first ever indica which was named as the mint.

While I do NOT doubt for even a moment that Tata engineers did not have faith in their own company's products, rockporiom, are you quite sure it was the 1980s, JRD Tata and the Tata Indica? Because the 1990s, Ratan Tata and the Indica sounds more likely. Or the 1980s, JRD Tata and the Tata Estate/Sierra, which happened to have even more quality and reliability problems than the Indica

[rockporiom]

Originally Posted by RSR

While I do NOT doubt for even a moment that Tata engineers did not have faith in their own company's products, rockporiom, are you quite sure it was the 1980s, JRD Tata and the Tata Indica? Because the 1990s, Ratan Tata and the Indica sounds more likely. Or the 1980s, JRD Tata and the Tata Estate/Sierra, which happened to have even more quality and reliability problems than the Indica

My dad is a 100% sure it was jrd tata and the car he drove was a hatch which was completely masked from inside out and was being called as the mint by all the engineers there. It might have been an early prototype of the indica. There was basically very little interior in the car and it was in the early stages of development.

[GTO]

Mod Note: The reliability (or lack of) of Tata cars and Tata's service quality have been extensively discussed in several existing threads.

Repeat Topic = Thread closed.

[discoverwild]

Originally Posted by sary

I'm seeing people often talk about the dynamics and overall looks of this car, which in Tata's case is no where close to other foreign manufacturers cars available in Indian market in that segment.

Therefore the question I ask, how reliable is Tata car on road? How often will it leave you stranding on the road? One of their so called best product (Zest), have been spotted with hood open at several occasions when I travel on NH's.

Looks - definitely subjective. Some like Aishwarya Rai, some like Nandita Das.

Reliability - Please read through long term reviews from other users. Better to be caught hood up than pants down.

[sary]

Originally Posted by discoverwild

Reliability - Please read through long term reviews from other users. Better to be caught hood up than pants down.

Isn't this a compromise or "chalta hai" attitude? Why get 'caught' either ways when you have better options in the market? Likes of Honda's and Toyota's.

[dbaapps]

Originally Posted by sary

I'm seeing people often talk about the dynamics and overall looks of this car, which in Tata's case is no where close to other foreign manufacturers cars available in Indian market in that segment.

Therefore the question I ask, how reliable is Tata car on road? How often will it leave you stranding on the road? One of their so called best product (Zest), have been spotted with hood open at several occasions when I travel on NH's.

Well, I am owner of both Tata Manza and Tata Zest, they are both reliable , I am not stranded by them for last 6 years(Manza) and last 8 months for Tata Zest. Talk about dynamics I see no issues compare to foreign manufactures and overall looks is subjective so will not talk on the same. I have also seen accidents on the highway and by judging by the deformation of body of car I feel I feel Tata cars(above) are much better created than foreign manufactures.