[suhas_raj]

Originally Posted by devil_klm

Can you please list those features in Rapid?
We are still waiting for complete specs of Ciaz

That is just my personal opinion & should be taken with a pinch of salt. I hope we are all entitled to that

Anyways to clear the air, we all know Maruti's strong points i.e. a VFM product, easy maintenance and unbeatable A.S.S. which Skoda can never match. Likewise a tank like build quality, superb ride and handling, interior finesse being strong with a Skoda product which a maruti has not been able to match. In the end, as a buyer its always a tradeoff while we make our ultimate choice.

That being said let's wait for the product to be launched as Maruti may decide to pleasantly surprise us all. Just wishful thinking

[The Observer]

The Chinese version looks chic and we can expect some toning down when launched here. I believe Maruti executives know very well the customer segment they are targeting (in my general opinion)

1. Maruti lovers who want to upgrade from a hatch to a sedan - they will obviously/naturally prefer the Ciaz for Maruti ASS, ownership costs, reliability etc. These buyers will also look at the other offers esp the City but the natural inclination towards Maruti can be counted upon even if Ciaz is not a 100% match to its direct competition ( and nothing wrong with it of course)

2. Maruti neutral buyers looking at C+ segment options like Verna/vento/Rapid/City - who want premium features and a certain snob value, and its exactly here Maruti should get the Ciaz right in terms of expectations , engine options, feature list, interior quality and ensure its nothing less than the competition.

Regarding the engine options there is a wealth of speculation here already but i have a gut feeling Maruti aint gonna do a Verna or Vento with the Ciaz, Maruti will want to stick to its "Kithna detti hai" positioning

I am just hoping the build quality is good, hope they do not benchmark it with the new Honda City! and one among my wishlist is ABS+dual airbags from 2nd variant onward (if not on all variants)

The rear space looks fabulous, may be Sunny ought to be worried a bit?

The cat video is a big turn off, could not watch it for more than 2 - 3 seconds

Off topic : Is Tata also planning a sedan in this segment - may be in the coming years?

[volkman10]

A less than a week away from seeing the CIAZ at dealerships?

Our sources tell us that dealers will start taking bookings from September 1.
More than 2,500 Ciazs seen at Maruti’s Manesar plant just about to be dispatched to dealerships.

Maruti aims to have around 7,000 Ciaz cars ready before the launch. This is to avoid delays in deliveries and prolonged waiting periods.

http://overdrive.in/news/spied-marut...manesar-plant/

[RSR]

Originally Posted by volkman10

Less than a week away from seeing the CIAZ at dealerships?

Maruti aims to have around 7,000 Ciaz cars ready before the launch. This is to avoid delays in deliveries and prolonged waiting periods.

They seem to be aiming to capitalise on the Honda City's shift in production and the resulting waiting periods.

The intense competition between Maruti Suzuki, Hyundai and Honda is spreading to more segments now, which is excellent for car buyers.

Take the tussle to even more segments, I say!

[IshaanIan]

Originally Posted by suhas_raj

That is just my personal opinion & should be taken with a pinch of salt. I hope we are all entitled to that

All of us most certainly are. That being said, it would be appreciated if our opinions were based on reason. Things like the electrochromic day/night irvm shown in the Indian Ciaz, is not even available in the european version of the Rapid.

Originally Posted by suhas_raj

Anyways to clear the air, we all know Maruti's strong points i.e. a VFM product, easy maintenance and unbeatable A.S.S. which Skoda can never match. Likewise a tank like build quality, superb ride and handling, interior finesse being strong with a Skoda product which a maruti has not been able to match. In the end, as a buyer its always a tradeoff while we make our ultimate choice.

It is extremely sad to see educated enthusiasts like ourselves, trying to dumb everything down like such. There are a few Maruti's that have had more qualities than the ones you have listed and certainly a few Skodas too. Just to clear the air, the SX4 is a much more adept handler than the Rapid (not just my opinion, you can check out more reputable sources like autocar etc.). Just like I believe the relatively less modern internals of a Rapid and Fabia, make them comparably reliable to a Swift, reliability being something people don't usually associate with any car from the Skoda stable. There are quite a few examples like this but I hope that's enough to prove my point; our opinions, ought to be based on facts and an acceptable level of reasonable assumptions if we expect them to be valuable and add to our credibility so let's not waste our time with opinions that just emulate the qualities of a human apendix.

Originally Posted by suhas_raj

That being said let's wait for the product to be launched as Maruti may decide to pleasantly surprise us all. Just wishful thinking

Yes let's

[adimicra]

Originally Posted by IshaanIan

A. Just to clear the air, the SX4 is a much more adept handler than the Rapid (not just my opinion, you can check out more reputable sources like autocar etc.). J

Buddy, I had no intentions to jump into this argument but, come on, SX4 handling better than a Rapid. You got to be kidding.Actually, there is no comparison at all. I am not sure which Autocar article you read but I would be more than interested to read it if you can point me to.

[CrAzY dRiVeR]

Originally Posted by IshaanIan

SX4 is a much more adept handler than the Rapid

Debatable, but yes, SX4 handles brilliantly. However, Rapid is better when you consider ride and handling as one department. Rapid strikes a very fine balance, while the SX4 was very stiff to compensate for the increased GC.

[audioholic]

Originally Posted by The Observer

Off topic : Is Tata also planning a sedan in this segment - may be in the coming years?

I would be surprised if they even "break-even"(not just sell cars) with their current line up, zest and bolt. Then they can think of a bigger car. However I hear is on the cards. Moreover I am not sure if Tata can get the 1.6l multijet from fiat like how Suzuki can. They have to experiment with their own engines or get a new range of midsize engines.

Anyways that's OT.

September first week bookings confirmed. As speculated the shipments will be made in advance, and guess strategies are right on Maruti Suzukis part.

What's left to strike is the pricing and actual specifications and performance. If they get the pricing right, I guess they will hit gold, because both the ertiga and the Ciaz can sell parallely, one due to high waiting period of the city and another due to high pricing of Mobilo

Regarding SX4 handling, as an owner, here is my take: The rapid will be superior in terms of body roll. The Sx4 due to its height has greater body roll. However it can take corners brilliantly without throwing tantrums and wont scare the driver or the co passengers.

[adimicra]

Originally Posted by audioholic

Regarding SX4 handling, as an owner, here is my take: The rapid will be superior in terms of body roll. The Sx4 due to its height has greater body roll. However it can take corners brilliantly without throwing tantrums and wont scare the driver or the co passengers.

To put it simply and bluntly, Rapid is a much better handler. Right?
If SX4 has more body roll, how can it be a brilliant handler? Which other aspects of handling are yo talking about?
I guess we need to keep our individual biases aside in a forum like this.
Frankly, I am surprised that we are even having this discussion.
Anyways, I am done with this.

[IshaanIan]

Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR

Debatable, but yes, SX4 handles brilliantly. However, Rapid is better when you consider ride and handling as one department. Rapid strikes a very fine balance, while the SX4 was very stiff to compensate for the increased GC.

Agree with you on the ride+handling package but I was arguing an entirely different point

Originally Posted by adimicra

Buddy, I had no intentions to jump into this argument but, come on, SX4 handling better than a Rapid. You got to be kidding.Actually, there is no comparison at all. I am not sure which Autocar article you read but I would be more than interested to read it if you can point me to.

I cannot even remember which issue covered the topic but off my personal experience; The Rapid, which a close friend owns and I have driven extensively, has an extremely inconsistent steering feel which also disappoints by its lack of heft even as speeds increase so this saps confidence. The Rapid definitely scores over the SX4 for being inherently lower and thus having less body-roll. However, the SX4 comes with 16inch 205 section tyres, more feedback from the steering, better steering weight and less understeer too. These are some of the most obvious observations that one makes when driving the two cars. A friend owned an SX4 sedan in America for a while and he insisted it was a pretty fun car to drive too. He drives a Rapid now, here in India, and his observations are pretty similar to mine.

My intention here was not to start a war. Merely showing people that as enthusiasts, we ought to stop assuming that every car from a certain brand or certain country performs well in xyz categories and performs poorly in abc categories. There are Hyundais like the Santa Fe which do handle pretty well in their segment and there are Skodas which I feel aren't fun to pilot around corners (Fabia/Rapid) unless something was done about the steering and grip.

Originally Posted by adimicra

To put it simply and bluntly, Rapid is a much better handler. Right?
Frankly, I am surprised that we are even having this discussion. Anyways, I am done with this.

Please go through the above observations mate. There are several more criteria to handling than body-roll anyway, hope you aren't offended by this post.

Disclaimer: I haven't driven the diesel SX4 which I hear has softer suspension setup which when mixed with the tall stance sounds like a disaster.

PS: found this link and I believe the Vento is not very different from the Rapid

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wwkNyl4b1I

[audioholic]

Originally Posted by adimicra

To put it simply and bluntly, Rapid is a much better handler. Right?
If SX4 has more body roll, how can it be a brilliant handler? Which other aspects of handling are yo talking about?
I guess we need to keep our individual biases aside in a forum like this.
Frankly, I am surprised that we are even having this discussion.
Anyways, I am done with this.

I guess Ishaan has explained. Sorry, handling is a character and not something to sum up "bluntly". Thats the very reason you started this. If I admit that there's body roll, you still call that bias. Not sure if you would call me a maniac if I claim that I can live with it and not complaining about it.

Anyways, this discussion WAS held because of unnecessary nitpicking and presumption that cars from a specific brand always handle bad, rattle like hell and so on. Totally unnecessary and OT.

[volkman10]

Maruti believes VDI + Diesel variant to have the highest demand, plans for 60% production with VDI and VDI+ variants

This thread is a bit speculative, so let us not bash nor be a fanboy on speculative performance parametes. Let us wait for the official test drive to confirm them.



Source:Gaadiwaadi

[adimicra]

Originally Posted by IshaanIan

. The Rapid definitely scores over the SX4 for being inherently lower and thus having less body-roll. However, the SX4 comes with 16inch 205 section tyres, more feedback from the steering, better steering weight and less understeer too.


Please go through the above observations mate. There are several more criteria to handling than body-roll anyway, hope you aren't offended by this post.

As per this - http://www.carwale.com/marutisuzuki-...ions-1162.html
it comes with 195 section 15 inch tires. May be I am wrong.

Well, let me tell you what I feel - the SX4 feels like a boat in comparison with the Rapid. Rapid/Fabia are one of the best handlers in their segments. I din't ever imagine we will be comparing Rapid with a SX4. Feels like
If you didn't want to offend me, why the dead horse buddy? But let me assure you I got a thick skin ...dont get offended easily.

Originally Posted by audioholic

I guess Ishaan has explained. Sorry, handling is a character and not something to sum up "bluntly". Thats the very reason you started this. If I admit that there's body roll, you still call that bias. Not sure if you would call me a maniac if I claim that I can live with it and not complaining about it.

Anyways, this discussion WAS held because of unnecessary nitpicking and presumption that cars from a specific brand always handle bad, rattle like hell and so on. Totally unnecessary and OT.

I mentioned bias because you said SX4 has more body roll but at the same time called it a brilliant handler in corners. Contradictory..no?
Why would I call you maniac? No ways.
Anyways, I am not gonna go into further argument on this.

[prince85]

Originally Posted by adimicra

As per this - http://www.carwale.com/marutisuzuki-...ions-1162.html
it comes with 195 section 15 inch tires. May be I am wrong.

No. You are not wrong. The Vxi/Vdi versions of the SX4 came with 195 section rubber of 15 inch steel rims. Whereas the top end ZXi/ZDi came with 16 inch alloy wheels shod with 205-60-R16 rubber.

Originally Posted by adimicra

Well, let me tell you what I feel - the SX4 feels like a boat in comparison with the Rapid. Rapid/Fabia are one of the best handlers in their segments. I din't ever imagine we will be comparing Rapid with a SX4. Feels like

You are entitled to your opinion just like everyone else is. The SX4 is not a flawless car by any sense of imagination. But then Ride and Handling has been one of the strengths of this car and for sure it doesn't feel like a boat compared to any car in its segment. The youtube link provided by @IshaanIan only justifies that further.

Cheers

[swiftnfurious]

Originally Posted by volkman10

...Our sources tell us that dealers will start taking bookings from September 1.
More than 2,500 Ciazs seen at Maruti’s Manesar plant just about to be dispatched to dealerships.
Quote:
Maruti aims to have around 7,000 Ciaz cars ready before the launch. This is to avoid delays in deliveries and prolonged waiting periods..

I will be happy if every manufacturer starts doing it rather than making the customers wait. Cross-posting my own...

Originally Posted by swiftnfurious

Off-Topic:
This was the BEST time for Maruti to introduce the Ciaz! Build and inventory give a solid pricing and get a good chunk of City sales! Missed opportunity!

This is how such stupid strategies need to be dealt with!

Off-Topic:: I believe one of the SX4 variant came with a 16 inch wheel and 190 mm GC as well. The GC in the face-lifted version (when diesel was introduced) was reduced to 180mm IIRC. I see that the details are added in the above post.