[desdemona]

Originally Posted by volkman10

Marchionne warm to idea of Fiat Chrysler climbing into bed with Suzuki



Well the above has not happened so obviously somehing did go wrong and Suzuki and hence the tilt to using the Peugeot's DV6 1.6 HDi for future Suzuki's?

http://www.goauto.com.au/mellor/mell...257C9A0021904E

No, nothing went 'wrong'. The 'bedding' of Suzuki by Chrysler fiat can only proceed when the VW arbitration decision is through. VW may be making Suzuki an offer, the wise old Mr. Suzuki may be playing hard-to-get....who knows?

[ku69rd]

Originally Posted by desdemona

The 1.5/1.6 mjd is coming, how soon is the only question.

The 1.6 MJD was told to be coming to India for a good 6+ years. Unfortunately it is in 'only coming' state and never 'came' to the market. With Fiat it is useless to procrastinate on their plans. Where did the Jeep Wrangler/Grand Cherokee disappear to?

[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by ku69rd

The 1.6 MJD was told to be coming to India for a good 6+ years. Unfortunately it is in 'only coming' state and never 'came' to the market. With Fiat it is useless to procrastinate on their plans. Where did the Jeep Wrangler/Grand Cherokee disappear to?

If the 1.6 MJD is launched now in the Punto and Linea, things may get better else this engine will never come to India. Been a long since we are listening to the "it'll come to India!" phrase like you said.

I guess Maruti is tired paying royalty so they need to change the engine too.

Anurag.

[desdemona]

Originally Posted by ku69rd

The 1.6 MJD was told to be coming to India for a good 6+ years. Unfortunately it is in 'only coming' state and never 'came' to the market. With Fiat it is useless to procrastinate on their plans. Where did the Jeep Wrangler/Grand Cherokee disappear to?

The following is OT. Mods, please do what you must.

hi. Fiat India had never EVER said that they are/will bring the 1.6 mjd. At least not till their 'make the move' relaunch plan last year, which btw they are sticking to and implementing as promised this year. This is our wish but they have been too busy meeting the other, much bigger demand for seperate and better dealers and ASS. Jeep launch is delayed because of the recent acute depreciation of the rupee, mainly.

That Fiat is not giving Maruti Suzuki the 1.6 mjd confirms tome at least that it is coming soon on Fiats.

I completely fail to understand this fetish for the 1.6 diesel. If you are an enthusiast: buy the t-jet, like I have! An awesome turbopetrol at this price is not to be missed.

But no we want diesel. Arre baba: the diesel is that much more expensive, requires high milemunching to be justified, the t-jet is quite fuel efficient. But no, we want diesel only! Why: because, see see, the verna, a car much inferior IMO to the Linea, has a 1.6!

This shows me that either many such folk are not enthusiasts, not knowing enough or that they will berate fiat for not bringing the 1.6 but when Fiat does, will proceed to buy verna-s and city-s. The city's diesel is selling hotcake-like, despite being no better than the 1.3 mjd and even worse in refinement for eg.

That tells me that Fiat has been right to not think that launching the bigger diesel will be a magic bullet for sales. Fiat can only grow slowly and steadily, like they are already doing for the last 4-5 months. Their main problem has been the perception of their dealers and ASS, and a lack of marketing/ branding. They have already addressed both these issues well-ish, but they have to keep at it.

[desdemona]

Originally Posted by tbppjpr

First I thought I accidentally landed up in Fiat Future Plans thread.

Guys, there is world beyond Fiat also. I request Fiat fanboys to please stop hijacking

Apologies for the hijacking, you are right.

But the talk on Fiat has not been fanboy-ism, just a discussion of the timing of the arrival of the much vaunted 1.6 mjd and the relationship between Suzuki and Fiat. I completely agree that there is no need to make a fetish of this fiat diesel engine, great though it may be, see my post above. BTW, this new SX4 Cross sells in Europe with the fiat engine. Cheers.

[ku69rd]

Originally Posted by desdemona

The following is OT. Mods, please do what you must.

Mate,
Yes you are right FIAT never made the statement of launching 1.6 MJD in India. But the hype created in the Media & Social Media about its impending arrival does bolster everyone's hopes.

Regarding the CRDE Diesel Vs Turbo Petrol, Both Engines have their unique plus points. CRDEs are a pleasure to drive and one need not be an enthusiast to understand them better. General herd mentality of people when it comes to Naturally Aspirated petrol engines are their poor torque which actually adds to one's misery in bumper to bumper traffic conditions.
However the new generation Turbo Petrol Engines like the one you have are very easy on the drivers. Cost is a different ball game which I would not like to comment. If one is clear that their choice will be a long term vehicle then CRDE Diesel engines wins hands down due to their ability to log thousands of kms without throwing any tantrums.Mileage in CRDE Diesel engines is another feature which is very hard to over look these days.

PS: Mods, this is OT feel free to delete it if it is not in the right spirits.
Am a fan of MJD Engines myself, My swift logged 147000 Kms in a little less than 6 years before I sold it.

[akshay4587]

Originally Posted by desdemona

The following is OT. Mods, please do what you must.

hi. Fiat India had never EVER said that they are/will bring the 1.6 mjd. At least not till their 'make the move' relaunch plan last year, which btw they are sticking to and implementing as promised this year. This is our wish but they have been too busy meeting the other, much bigger demand for seperate and better dealers and ASS. Jeep launch is delayed because of the recent acute depreciation of the rupee, mainly.

That Fiat is not giving Maruti Suzuki the 1.6 mjd confirms tome at least that it is coming soon on Fiats.

I completely fail to understand this fetish for the 1.6 diesel. If you are an enthusiast: buy the t-jet, like I have! An awesome turbopetrol at this price is not to be missed.

But no we want diesel. Arre baba: the diesel is that much more expensive, requires high milemunching to be justified, the t-jet is quite fuel efficient. But no, we want diesel only! Why: because, see see, the verna, a car much inferior IMO to the Linea, has a 1.6!

This shows me that either many such folk are not enthusiasts, not knowing enough or that they will berate fiat for not bringing the 1.6 but when Fiat does, will proceed to buy verna-s and city-s. The city's diesel is selling hotcake-like, despite being no better than the 1.3 mjd and even worse in refinement for eg.

That tells me that Fiat has been right to not think that launching the bigger diesel will be a magic bullet for sales. Fiat can only grow slowly and steadily, like they are already doing for the last 4-5 months. Their main problem has been the perception of their dealers and ASS, and a lack of marketing/ branding. They have already addressed both these issues well-ish, but they have to keep at it.

I drive a Linea 1.3 MJD and drive 120kms a day.
Tjet is simply not feasible.
1.6 MJD is my requirement and other's as well who do 2500kms a month.
I hope you get the point.

[selfdrive]

Originally Posted by desdemona

Er, they just launched the new Linea, it has been only a month. You want a launch every month? New Punto in june, next month. Avventura in october, a mere four months later!

when was the previous launch before this new Linea? Also, how many years are these two going to be flogged before bringing in other options?
I think that is the frustration being voiced
One look at the Maruti lineup is enough to understand the difference in market understanding.

[rsidd]

Originally Posted by selfdrive

when was the previous launch before this new Linea? Also, how many years are these two going to be flogged before bringing in other options?
I think that is the frustration being voiced
One look at the Maruti lineup is enough to understand the difference in market understanding.

Maruti is in a different category -- let's not compare Fiat with Maruti or Hyundai. A better comparison would be Renault (five models, all in two-digit sales except Duster); Nissan (numbers coming from Terrano, other numbers are comparable to Fiat or worse); Skoda (Rapid is doing OK, but all others are struggling and Fabia has been dropped); VW (four models, but only two with serious sales). Rather than lose money on upmarket models like Fluence and Jetta that nobody is buying, Fiat is focusing on their strengths. The Punto and Linea are about as old, in the Indian market, as the Polo and Vento. VW was eating their lunch till recently and is still far ahead, but Fiat is surviving and growing. I'd give Fiat lots of credit for just staying in the game with these two models.

The new Punto and Avventura should help significantly -- the Punto has always had much better sales than the Linea. I am sure Fiat is as eager to introduce them as we are to see them, but it has to be done when they're ready, both in quality/testing and in production capability. It is also a good idea to have their upmarket releases under other brand names (Jeep, Abarth), but I think it is NOT a good idea to have separate dealerships for those! The volumes won't justify it and the current dealers may feel shortchanged.

[Rubbertramps]

Originally Posted by desdemona

As for ostensible enthusiasts and Fiat fans who want the 1.6 mjd: if they really are that, I advise them to buy the glorious T-jet eyes closed! I did. ;-)

Yes. I second. I wish it were on the punto as well. Sick of Diesel and its maintenance costs ! Dont want a sluggish petrol as well !

[mchanna]

if you are looking for a long term and want to crunch many miles then MJD is the machine. I have talked to many mechanics, according to them CRDi extracts more power initially which leads to engine related issues after lakh kms. Where as I have seen personally MJDs running upto 3 Lakhs without any issues.

[swiftnfurious]

Originally Posted by mchanna

if you are looking for a long term and want to crunch many miles then MJD is the machine. I have talked to many mechanics, according to them CRDi extracts more power initially which leads to engine related issues after lakh kms. Where as I have seen personally MJDs running upto 3 Lakhs without any issues.

I am really NOT sure of this statement! MJD is just a naming convention for Fiat's CRDi engines as far as I know! I mean, even MJD employs CRDi technology.

Different manufacturers name their engines in different ways; some of the names used for CRDi engines are as below.

Hyundai - CRDi
TATA - DICOR / Quadrajet / Varicor
Fiat - MJD / JTD
Maruti - DDiS
Ford - TDCi
Toyota - D-4D
Mahindra - CRDe
VW / Skoda - TDi
Chevrolet - TCDi / VCDi
Nissan / Renault - dCi

More Details:: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_rail

Edit:: If you meant Hyundai's engines by "CRDi", could be true!

[desdemona]

Originally Posted by swiftnfurious

I am really NOT sure of this statement! MJD is just a naming convention for Fiat's CRDi engines as far as I know! I mean, even MJD employs CRDi technology.

Different manufacturers name their engines in different ways; some of the names used for CRDi engines are as below.

Hyundai - CRDi
TATA - DICOR / Quadrajet / Varicor
Fiat - MJD / JTD
Maruti - DDiS
Ford - TDCi
Toyota - D-4D
Mahindra - CRDe
VW / Skoda - TDi
Chevrolet - TCDi / VCDi
Nissan / Renault - dCi

More Details:: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_rail

Edit:: If you meant Hyundai's engines by "CRDi", could be true!

A couple of points.

Fiat invented common rail direct injection technology.

Theirs are, along with those from BMW, widely regarded as among the best diesels in Europe, including the big hefty diesels of VM Motori, a Fiat company, used in Jeeps and by Maserati.

A pity we don't get the Multijet2 engines here yet: 15 to 20% better low-rev torque, mileage and emissions, via big improvements in fuel injection. These engines are arguably the best small-displacement diesels in the world.

Originally Posted by swiftnfurious

I am really NOT sure of this statement! MJD is just a naming convention for Fiat's CRDi engines as far as I know! I mean, even MJD employs CRDi technology.

Edit:: If you meant Hyundai's engines by "CRDi", could be true!

Thanks for sharing, but you missed a difference.

There is a common rail in all these engines. But the technology actually emphasizes on compressing the diesel fuel in the rail and pushing it to the cylinder at a high pressure causing better combustion and generating more power.

Some engines have One common rail where the whole pressure is built up, and the contents of this rail are used by all cylinders. Sharing

In case of others, Every cylinder has its own Common rail. So 4 rails in a 4 cylinder configuration. There might be one pump which pushes the fuel to rail hard. Or there might be 4 pumps which does again the same thing.

Technically the concept is same. But configuration wise, they are different.

The CRDI falls under the first category. The TDI falls into the second category. The CRDE and DICOR naming conventions were used just to evade paying royalty. Not sure about the rest.

Bud, Hyundai has some serious capability. They have rights to almost reproduce the MB engines with the best quality. But they do not prefer to do it. And they use it for their advantage to earn more on service. The Tucson has a very good engine.

As it is a FIAT thread, lets try to provoke them. Despite of creating the best technology, they sold it just for what. Peanuts. And now they are regretting.

[PVPal]

New scoop pics of the Aveentura released (source: Team Fiat). The alloys showcased on the AutoExpo vehicle seem to be replaced on these test mules. Same with the projector headlamps that the AutoExpo vehicle sported. Roof rails seem to be a common fitment across variants, which appear to be tested in the scoop. Link (here).

On another note, the S-cross, as driven by AutoCar's Harmazd Sorabjee, will get the Fiat 1.6 MJD engine. See link (here). Would have loved it on the Linea 2014.

P.S. Mods, just read that the move to the new servers is complete. Hence the post, though Team BHP is read only today.