[shortbread]

As per latest new coming in, Mr Ratan Tata has clarified in an interview that the next gen Defenders will be made in Pune, India.

This is very important as Land Rover has decided to price the new Defender very competitively rather than the present Defender which is a niche low volume product. Also using India as a manufacturing base will help them be closer to the main market, Asia. Here are the highlights:

• Will stick to a body on frame construction, no monocoque.
• To use updated, lightened T5 platform, presently used for the Range Rover Sport and the Land Rover Discovery.
• Styling very close to DC100 concepts displayed in the Delhi auto show.
• Will share chassis and suspension parts with a 'REVISED' version of the Aria, which is due in several years time!! But they will not be made on identical chassis.
• To lower manufacturing costs and price it competitively.
• Powered by new 4cyl. Petrol/Diesel engines made at the two new engine plants located at Wolverhampton and Pune.

The full interview will be in the latest issue of Autocar which I shall buy as soon as my work finishes, regretfully still 3 hours to go!! Shall provide updates.

source:LR to build next Defender in India - Autocar.co.uk

[suhaas307]

The Defender, as far as I know, is built on a ladder-frame chassis. The Aria on the other hand is a monocoque. While one is a hard-core SUV and mud-slinger, the other is a bit of a glorified mini-van on the lines of the Innova. I'm not sure how Tata-LR are going to make the connection work.

Either the Aria will greatly benefit from this development, or the Defender is going to plummet in terms of off-road prowess.

Going by the concept displayed at the Auto-Expo though, one can safely say that the new Defender seems promising.

Wouldn't it make more sense to continue this in the Auto-Expo thread instead of starting a new thread altogether?

[niranjanrvce]

Originally Posted by suhaas307

The Defender, as far as I know, is built on a ladder-frame chassis. The Aria on the other hand is a monocoque.

The Aria is body on frame as far as I remember and not a monocoque. A key point on which the XUV scores over it.
But, I guess they will only end up using 'technology' from the Defender chassis in a future Aria.

[aaggoswami]

Originally Posted by shortbread

As per latest new coming in, Mr Ratan Tata has clarified in an interview that the next gen Defenders will be made in Pune, India.

• Will stick to a body on frame construction, no monocoque.
• Styling very close to DC100 concepts displayed in the Delhi auto show.
• Will share chassis and suspension parts with a 'REVISED' version of the Aria, which is due in several years time!! But they will not be made on identical chassis.

1) Good news that one of the most famous offroader will be made in India. This is very famous offroader in league of Landcruiser/Patrol.

2) LR cannot afford to have this car as a monocoque. The international market wont accept it.

3) The DC100 concept was not much appreicated and many say its toned down. LR will have to stick to more traditional offroader design IMO.

4) I dont think that the chassis will be shared with new Aria. The new Defender is most likely to come to market in 2013/4. By no means we will have a new Aria by that time. Even after than I dont think that Tata will make take this step due to cost.

Originally Posted by suhaas307

5) The Defender, as far as I know, is built on a ladder-frame chassis. The Aria on the other hand is a monocoque.

6) Either the Aria will greatly benefit from this development, or the Defender is going to plummet in terms of off-road prowess.

Originally Posted by niranjanrvce

The Aria is body on frame as far as I remember and not a monocoque. A key point on which the XUV scores over it.

5) Aria is Body on Frame, not monocoque. Also the weight of Aria is too much by people mover standards. They should have come up with a new Safari instead IMHO.

6) Exactly my fear!

[suhaas307]

School-boy error, there.

Was under the impression the Aria was built on a monocoque. I know that the XUV has been designed and built on a monocoque frame, which obviously gives it the edge.

One question. Would it be hard for a company like Tata to derive a monocoque frame from say, Land Rover's Freelander, and use it as a platform to build an entirely new SUV that could compete with the XUV, or maybe derive the Defender's ladder-frame chassis and build a very capable SUV on the same body-on-frame platform?

[shankar.balan]

Glad to hear ths piece of news. Hope this extends to the Freelander and others too and I sincerely hope it impacts the price for us Indians in a positive manner!

[teamveevee]

it will probably send some models back to Europe for final assembly in the UK as part of a ‘reverse CKD’ operation. Land Rover already builds Freelanders in India for sale in Asia

.So the final assembly will UK except for the ones to be sold in Asia.

It is good to see Aria is still in TMs future plans, irrespective of the miniscule numbers it sells currently. This technology sharing will help both the companies in the long term. If customers are willing to pay a premium, TM will be able to incorporate more and more JLR technology in to their upcoming products.

[mayankjha1806]

Sure folks are excited, i was also very excited as it would then be cheaper and more options on the SUV segment, until i looked at the pictures of it on the UK site. It looks um. too basic like Sumo (pardon me for saying that), or alternatively too hardcore offroader, unlike an urban SUV with good offroading capabilities like a Fortuner.

Excited and disappointing at the same time (very strange)

[Aroy]

Originally Posted by mayankjha1806

Sure folks are excited, i was also very excited as it would then be cheaper and more options on the SUV segment, until i looked at the pictures of it on the UK site. It looks um. too basic like Sumo (pardon me for saying that), or alternatively too hardcore offroader, unlike an urban SUV with good offroading capabilities like a Fortuner.

Excited and disappointing at the same time (very strange)

Defender is primarily targeted at the farming/off roader market and not at the SUV market. Hence it is a basic 4x4, which is extremely rugged and past was a trouble free vehicle.

By the way Sumo looks are derived from the Mercedes G Wagen, which was till recently in the same rugged off roader market. I will welcome the Defender with its basic functionality, as long as it is priced sensibly, so that it can compete in the Scorpio, Safari and Force bracket.

[zipperone]

This is indeed very good news. Very happy to see Tata making this decision. I have always admired him for this and being a patriot. I will surely pick up a defender when launched. Starting to save up already.

I don't understand why he mentioned Aria, perhaps to add some value to the product that is not moving off the shelves at all. Perhaps they should have launched the current defender rather than wasting resources on the Aria.

[theMAG]

Originally Posted by suhaas307

One question. Would it be hard for a company like Tata to derive a monocoque frame from say, Land Rover's Freelander, and use it as a platform to build an entirely new SUV that could compete with the XUV, or maybe derive the Defender's ladder-frame chassis and build a very capable SUV on the same body-on-frame platform?

You may have inadvertently spilled out Tata's future plans there! I guess they had bandwidth constraints during the adaptation of the Aria platform to the Storme. Which leads us to another possibility of them utilizing the Storme's new platform to design a future XUV competitor, since the Safari package is now really long in the tooth.

I think we both just might have spilled Tata's future beans !

[himavanth_m]

Originally Posted by theMAG

You may have inadvertently spilled out Tata's future plans there! I guess they had bandwidth constraints during the adaptation of the Aria platform to the Storme. Which leads us to another possibility of them utilizing the Storme's new platform to design a future XUV competitor, since the Safari package is now really long in the tooth.

I think we both just might have spilled Tata's future beans !

I hope Tata heads the way you and suhas307 were discussing


However, I have a question here. Does Tata setting up a plant to manufacture Defender in India got anything to do with Tata sharing the technology with JLR? Since they already own the JLR brand, they might do the sharing of technology and expertise. The Defender to be made in India just got to do with the cost strategy I believe.
Please correct me if I am wrong.

[teamveevee]

Originally Posted by theMAG

I think we both just might have spilled Tata's future beans !

TM need many new vehicles in the near future to stay competitive in the passenger vehicles segment.

If i were the head of Passenger Cars at TM (lol), i will assemble teams to develop the following..

1) A mini SUV, a soft roader. An all new vehicle based on Vista Platform.
Is it possible to share technology with Freelander and/or Evoque for this?
2) A MPV/Minivan. A mini van with sliding doors etc. Probably on a stretched Vista?.
3) A Large cross over. A monocoque. Some point JLR need a large soft roader. Majority of LR customer never use them for off road.

It may be a good idea to built an all new Monocoque platform for 2 & 3, which can be used for future JLR models or a larger Tata Car(Even though RT categorically denied this). Use existing Aria/Strome platform for large 4x4 vehicles including Defender.

[shortbread]

Extracts from the Autocar Ratan Tata interview (25 Jan 2012):

• questions about post retirement plans - 'I have no idea'
• When Ratan Tata lands in the UK every 4 to 6 weeks, he spends time with Mike Cross (Jaguars chief engineer and chassis guru) at JLR's Gaydon test track.' I try to spend a couple of hours on the track with Mike, but we often run out of time because we started driving our competitors cars as well as our own.' Somebody should send them a Sumo for evaluation.
• Jaguars 3 series (rival) project is proceeding at top speed behind the scenes.
• On the next gen Defender, he quotes ' We are looking at producing the platform for the new Defender in India, then modifying it so that it can be shared with a Tata product'
• adds 'If TML was able to use parts designed specifically for a JLR model, I believe that would be okay. But I think there would be an obvious danger in having a Tata part showing up in a Jaguar' lol!!

source: Autocar 25 Jan 2012 issue

Also adding to the other comments posted, Tata or JLR will never allow the next gen Defender to be based on a monocoque, it will spell deathknell for the product. Personally I also belong to the old school SUV ladder frame brigade.

The T5 is perhaps one of the best SUV platforms available in the world. It is clearly visible from the on road handling of the Range Range Rover Sport or the off road prowess of the Discovery. If the updated T5 is brought to India it will easily be the best SUV platform available in the country by far!!

That said both the India made next gen Defender and consequently other Tata derived variants are still sometime away.

[suhaas307]

Originally Posted by himavanth_m

I hope Tata heads the way you and suhas307 were discussing


However, I have a question here. Does Tata setting up a plant to manufacture Defender in India got anything to do with Tata sharing the technology with JLR? Since they already own the JLR brand, they might do the sharing of technology and expertise. The Defender to be made in India just got to do with the cost strategy I believe.
Please correct me if I am wrong.

You're right!

You see, sharing technology is expected somewhere down the line. It's inevitable. Why wouldn't Tata take the advantage? But the real reason behind the Defender being built here is the fact that any car with high levels of localization is bound to be cheaper. Not only will it be cheaper to build, it would be cheaper to buy.