[ICECutlet]

Let me start my Team-BHP journey by asking you all 2 simple questions, and later state the horrible experience faced with my recent purchase of a Toyota Camry 2.5 Hybrid in Burning Black shade from Saini Toyota, Kolkata.

“You purchase a car marketed to you with a buyback offer/scheme on the 5th Year/60 Months (with written details of Offer, Car Details and Terms) on Dealership/Company Letterhead with stamp sign. NOTE: This copy of letterhead was sent on two email IDs of the Dealership with other pending lists with the Subject line being TOYOTA CAMRY BUYBACK.

After one month, while speaking to the Head of Guest Relations and brand Customer Care on con-call for other pending accessories, cashback and matters, it urged a discussion of this offer, and this lady informed me that there was no such offer(with shock).
Further, they clearly & easily informed me that it was not valid and it was under the capacity of the employee of the dealership (of Toyota).



TIME MACHINE runs you to the 5th year-end:

Q1. Whom would you go for the buyback offer - Rs. 31 Lakhs approx. (as per present Ex-showroom price)

The Sales Executive? The other employees or owner of the Dealership? The Brand’s AWESOME Telephone/Email Customer Care? The Toyota Trust(Used car)? Consumer Complaint Forum? NCDRC(dot)NIC(dot)IN? Legal Case?

Q2. How do you report and prevent such wrong experiences, and ill-commitments by Dealerships where the brand is not participating to help in any matters as listed below? “

The need for an upgrade from Skoda Superb 1.8TSI:

We were using the 2012 model of this car, and performance was upgraded to Stage 2+ by Tuneotronics, Bangalore. I have ridden this car a lot since I started driving, and have driven around for a good 11+ years, although among the hustles with Skoda’s After Sales Service network which was not present in Kolkata for a good 2+ Years. (The Skoda’s DSG is another day’s thread that I will write). The car faced an engine breakdown, and it was a lot more to maintain it this time, so decided to part ways, with this Skoda aka Jahaaj.

The must-haves for a new ride must be a sedan, back seat space & comfort, brand reliability, after-sales, and strong engine efficiency. So, after all rounds of blogs, vlogs, test drives and feedback concluded that the Toyota Camry for its Back seat ride, space and comfort like no other in the segment, Toyota’s after-sales cost, fitting my pocket, and decent features available on this Hybrid which must be a CKD or SKD, afaik. I felt I made a fair decision rather than hitting on the Premium Brands.

After visiting and understanding the delivery time frame and offers from both Topsel and Saini Toyota in Kolkata, I booked the better deal at Saini Toyota, which was as follows:

1. Quick Delivery (Although the colour decision changed in between), and it was delayed to July end, booking done in February;
2. Rs. 1 Lakh Discount;
3. FOC accessories - Front Door Lamps 2pcs, Floor Mats;
4. Most Importantly Buyback offer is at 67% on or before the 60th Month.

The Hustle starts:

I was informed in mid-July about the car being in transit, and I can come for a quick PDI just 4 days from then. I was very happy.

I loved the look of the Burning Black colour with Purple pearls in this metallic shade on this car. Sat to finalise the timelines ahead and was informed of the Ex-showroom Price Hike of Rs. 88,000, whereupon negotiating an offer from the manager Mr Simon, finalised with additional Cash Discount as Cashback of Rs. 70,000.

Did the payment transfer, as per my commitments on 25th July 2023, and was promised quick delivery, and with regret and all hustles got it delivered on 3rd August 2023, An unfortunate delay due to which the car was standing inside my garage until 23rd August 2023, due to good mahurat days for car Puja.

Note: I took the delivery with all necessary documents and, most importantly the buyback offer document.



I sent them the received/ pending issues via email on 5th August and marked a cc to other executives, as the dealership was not ready to write the same on the car delivery note. I also made the necessary remarks and requested the Home demo on Toyota Bharat’s Form given to me for my father and brother.



After more than one and a half months of delay to deliver the promised, after repeated emails, WhatsApp and calls, I finally decided to write to Toyota Customer Care, and the GM, Sales Head, CRM and CEO of the dealership came into the scenario and started to understand the below-mentioned concerns, which I have been given to them in writing, and all they had was to “regret the inconvenience caused” where also they had multiple irrelevant reasons to offer for all the delay. Till today, no one from the Toyota Team has gotten in touch to resolve the matter rather I had to arrange the contact of Mr. Varun Gupta, from Toyota, looking after this dealer, who also was supposed to revert by 25th September 2023, but unfortunately not to rescue me.

How I came to know of this fishy fraud:

So, in between all this, while speaking to customer care and CRM Saswati, in a quick discussion, I told her that “today he is in your company and you are not aware of the cash-back since it is on WhatsApp and no emails, tomorrow if the advisor is not there in your company, you will tell me that the Buyback is not in your knowledge, so the Letterhead would only help me” and to my shock it was found that Saini Toyota does not offer this particular buyback scheme!

The representatives of Saini Toyota visited my office to consider it invalid, and they cannot offer such offers. NOTE - Mr. Simon accepted in front of all colleagues that he had offered me the same with no undue pressure or forced situations. (I have recently learnt how fraud can be diverged)

I regret, this has been one of the most horrible experiences and pathetic situations, with the problems faced as under:-

1. 67% Buyback after five years offered on Saini*Toyota*letterhead with Stamp seal, with Terms & Conditions during the purchase of the car-*now being informed to me that it is “not validated” by Saini*Toyota, and offered by the sales executive on his capacity. My POV: How can I understand by this document that it is on who’s capacity executive or Dealership until founded? This offer was informed to me during the Test Drive around February, and based on this, I decided on such a strong and lucrative offer.

2. Because of the above lucrative plan, decided to purchase the ICICI LOMBARD (a precondition for the offer) Insurance as well as the car from Saini*Toyota at an extra cost of Rs. 34,000/- approximately, which was again an extra burden where I had informed Mr Simon of the offer I am getting outside.

3. The cash-back amount of Rs. 70,000/- was transferred back from Mr Simon's bank account on 20th September 2023, instead of Gurmaan Automobiles Pvt Ltd, and further, no descriptive email for accounting purposes has been received to date. This delay of an additional 20-25 days, was done after all possible requests and emails to the entire team. I felt as if I owed him and the dealership, for which they are not letting this conclude.





4. For the Front Door 2 Lamps Accessories, it was left on to Toyota Kirloskar for the delay and not ready, whereby another dealer Topsel Toyota, was ready to deliver me quickly in 3-4 days. So I have declined to install on the car until the primary concerns are solved. This accessory installation seems to be irrelevant and not committed for this dealership.

5. Delivery of the car delayed more than seven days. Payment date 25/07/23, delivery date 04/08/23. Because of this the car couldn’t be driven around for 20 more days due to the good mahurat days of the Puja Ritual, written earlier.

6. Had requested for Home Demo of the car on a form offered by Saini*Toyota*during delivery, but for one month after the regular requests, and with no confirmation on the date and time, cancelled my request on 31/08/2023. It seems that no reports, forms, or papers are being read by seniors who are there in the dealership, which I had requested in the form given to me. I state the above due to quick feedback given on the other delivery papers; the CRM should be reading to help customers.

7. The dealer collected a Misc. Charges amounted to Rs. 12,346/- and gave me a debit note. When asked for an Invoice of the same to clear the accounts, they could not comply and informed it was as per their pricelist. Here, this manager, Mr. Simon, was arrogant enough to inform me to send a request email for a refund, which sounds unreasonable.*How illogical a person can be. At last, they refunded me the extra amount.

8. In short, the overall experience, dealing, sale and after-sale of purchasing the most premium*Toyota* sedan product was very sad and unpleasant for me, and unfortunately, I cannot forgive myself for such a decision based on such offers, and the financial planning done for same goes for a toss.*

On any next purchase, my steps of Intra & Post Delivery would be:

1. To necessarily take a receipt of all pending points from the Sales advisor, signed by another senior on the hierarchy.

2. To call and meet in person, update about special offerings, at least two 2 immediate senior hierarchy, and validate it also before the car gets registered on my name.

3. I have this habit of asking for invoices(including Road Tax, Registration, Fancy Number charges, Fastag, HSRP, Insurance) for the entire amount of payments to the dealership. Payment of Rs. X should = Invoices of Rs. X.

Never accept debit notes as a valid document for payments done to the dealer. They cannot keep holding Debit notes. Members are strong in accounts, could you also clarify your stand on the same?

I suggest as a forum, we can make more detailed pointers and create awareness for all three Delivery Inspection situations- especially INTRA & POST period, and update such brands about malpractices or fraud being done at their dealership to sell cars and reluctantly being pointed on the Manager and no responsibility of the dealer.

Presently, I would like to ask fellow Team-BHP members to guide and advise on how to prevent myself from this situation, along with the above 2 questions and what steps are at my disposal.

- I decided to purchase this car after receiving such a lucrative scheme, but as a consumer, I am at a loss now, as the offer is not validated.

- At,Toyota, is this the Customer after Sales? False commitments and wrong experiences?

- Is it also the same across all Toyota dealers in India? On top of that no help from anyone from, Toyota. I have heard of really good experiences from Toyota, but unfortunately, my first-hand experience is very horrible. Please see - my immediate family owns Corolla Altis, Innova Crysta, and Glanza.

- Are such practices applicable and acceptable at Toyota?

As a customer, I am left helpless and hopeless of such fraudulent malpractice to sell a car!

Until then, Happy Driving!

[GTO]

Disappointing to see dealers resorting to such scams to make a sale, but the thing is, if an offer feels too good to be true, it probably is.

Their letter states they will give 67% of the ex-showroom price of today (46 lakhs) or then (meaning 5 years from now), whichever is higher. With time, a car's price only goes higher & higher. Going by recent trends, a Camry will probably cost 60-65 lakhs ex-showroom 5 years from now and here the dealer is committing to 67% of the price then!!

The offer is untenable, even for gold standards of resale value like the Fortuner. No one can offer 67% of the ex-showroom price 5 years from now. 67% of today's ex-showroom can be offered for a few cars, but not the ex-showroom price of year 2028.

You can hold that offer in court though. It's on their letterhead with a stamp & sign. You can use it to get a great settlement 5 years from now.

[TheFonz]

Agree with GTO. As you have the offer on a signed letter head, it’s a good option to go to the consumer court.

[Cresterk]

As far as I know, no dealership offers to 'buy the car back' after a few years. The whole buyback offers you see being heavily advertised by Mercedes, BMW, Audi etc are misleading and are just balloon EMI payments where in the last year you can either pay the final amount (buyback amount) to them to keep your car or they will just take it away. It's just a way to reduce EMIs and are not for purchases where you pay the full amount.

Anyway, since you have the stamped letterhead, you can try to drag the to court.

[ICECutlet]

Agree with the same, and I have already filed a consumer complaint against Saini Toyota, Kolkata regarding the scam at the Department of Consumer Affairs, and waiting for the response.

But going by it, if I file a legal suit in upper courts around now or 2028, and hypothetically the dealership is away from Kolkata, I shall be at a good loss to miss this excellent offer at 67%.

I now understand that I have no option but to wait, after understanding the dealer's reply and no sincere thoughts towards the customer. They have completely left it to the Employee of the Dealership.




In today's world, all commitments, offers, or even features for that matter (might be Booking a lower variant compared to a top-end variant Test Drive/Display car or features not mentioned on the Brochure) need to be thoroughly visited times before coming to a decision. The dealership and the brand can simply push the blame on the employee's capacity and escape.

[humyum]

This is Scam 2023. If I were Toyota and someone had given a signed/stamped document from a dealership, I would honour it and take action against the dealer for fooling a customer as the dealer represents the company.

A customer can't be made to suffer because of the misrepresentation by the employee, its the dealers and toyota's lookout, not the customer.

[Turbanator]

Even if the employee has done anything wrong, it's 100% the dealership's responsibility; they need to honour such commitment. Let's see what Toyota does with the dealer and what happens to this person after termination. I have doubts about any salesperson, especially those who is handling premium cars at Toyota, doing something. Besides, that person cannot make all the terms on his own. I cannot think of why the dealership is doing something like this, as Camry or most other vehicles from Toyota (except Hilux) are usually on booking only, and offers are not required to sell.


However, I won't fret much over this; one of the conditions is - No Claim of over Rs 25,000 per Year and mandatory insurance by ICICI. This isn't easy.

[rt363]

Sounds absurd !
Makers should understand that dealers are an extension of them and their image ! BMW had changed their dealer in cochin due to some unethical practices. The dealer shifting responsibility to their employee shows the lack of depth in the principles. New age management tend to pass on the responsibilities or blame a third person just to bypass the issues. We have a thread in Tbhp about Kia owing up and dealing with the front windshield distortion issue.. such should be the attitude of makers. Mistakes happen, but how you own up and resolve matters a lot!
I had a different issue with CGH kumarkom (a 5star property in kumarakom, kerala) where there was a theft in my room and the management shifted responsibility to their security contractor. We pay the amount trusting the brand and not some of their outsourcing contractors or dealers.

Hope this issue is solved by Toyota themselves and the dealer is made responsible for offering false promises.

[IamNikhil]

Even if any employee indulges in misrepresentation of facts and/or fudging details, ultimately the onus should lie with the dealership he's engaged with. It's appalling that Saini Toyota and also the parent Toyota brand are washing their hands off of this whole mess.

The very fact that you have the mentioned offer in writing, that too on a company letterhead with due stamp/sign; this itself is enough evidence to sue them to eternity. Consumer forums have increasingly started frowning upon such fraudulent practices and giving decisions in favour of consumers.

Stay strong and don't let this unsavoury experience affect your overall ownership of an otherwise wonderful car. More power to you ICECutlet.

[CarNerd]

If I have understood correctly, you have an official /unofficial buyback offer document that will give you 67% of the car's ex-showroom value as on the date of purchase or after 5 years, whichever is higher. I would suggest you use the car for 3 years and approach them with the offer. If they can pay 67% of the value after 5 years as per the offer, they should have no problem paying the same value after 3 years right? Obviously, they will deny it and you can start preparing for a solid consumer court case against Toyota and the dealer after 3 years. Just make sure you have every paper, every communication related to the purchase stored safely. I'm sure the case will be in your favour and hopefully you will receive 67% of the value plus monetary compensation at the end of 5 years.

[RDS]

Originally Posted by ICECutlet

Let me start my Team-BHP journey by asking you all 2 simple questions, and later state the horrible experience faced with my recent purchase of a Toyota Camry 2.5 Hybrid in Burning Black shade from Saini Toyota, Kolkata.

“You purchase a car marketed to you with a buyback offer/scheme on the 5th Year/60 Months (with written details of Offer, Car Details and Terms) on Dealership/Company Letterhead with stamp sign. NOTE: This copy of letterhead was sent on two email IDs of the Dealership with other pending lists with the Subject line being TOYOTA CAMRY BUYBACK.

After one month, while speaking to the Head of Guest Relations and brand Customer Care on con-call for other pending accessories, cashback and matters, it urged a discussion of this offer, and this lady informed me that there was no such offer(with shock).
Further, they clearly & easily informed me that it was not valid and it was under the capacity of the employee of the dealership (of Toyota).

All you need to do is (immediately) write a mail to grievance email id/escalation ID of Toyota as well as the Dealership with your buyback/exchange request + You need to give details of the ordeal and what has happened - including date and time.

Then wait for a week for response and in case they do not agree, raise a ticket with NCH (National Consumer Helpline). Just a call shall work and you will need to upload the mail, invoice etc as proof. You can also fill in details yourself and upload the proofs. You don't need to invest any money in process, just some time.

Usually, most cases are solved through NCH directly as they send letters to companies on the consumer's behalf if required. If NCH is not able to resolve, the NCH grievance number and communication becomes a strong proof for Consumer court case.

No need to take crap from any dealer or any business. They gave you in writing on letterhead and the dealer is responsible for fulfilling the deal - period.

However, now that you have started this thread, if you agree to the dealer or "DO NOT" respond to them in the appropriate time, it will taken as your agreement to what they say. If you need this deal, you ought to push and ensure they agree to this.

[Silver Knight]

The letter starts with We Saini Toyota and ends with For Saini Toyota. And the person has signed with the seal of Saini Toyota. So the dealer is responsible. Go ahead with the case.

[greenhorn]

What I'm not able to understand is that 67% isn't that bad a deal for the dealership. If you look at prices of 5 year old camries on online, that seems pretty reasonable.

And to get out of this, the dealer is willing to make public statements that we are not bound to documented commitments made by an authorised employee, you're on your own - they're admitting to massive leadership and governance failures. Maybe a lesser manufacturer might make a claim, but Toyota tends to run a tight ship, and making such statements is embarrassing. I wonder if nobody from corporate is watching.

I wonder then what Toyota expects us to do then, conduct business only with the dealership principal? Who do they propose we can deal with from their end who has some accountability?

[gauravdgr8]

It's a proper Saini Toyota letter head. I think the dealership would be hand in glove in this. They would have hatched this plan thinking no customer would verify the offer within the initial few years, and later on they would deny stating insurance claims, or condition of the car.

What I am surprised is that Mr. Simon paid you 70k from his pocket?

[svsantosh]

Originally Posted by ICECutlet

my recent purchase of a Toyota Camry 2.5 Hybrid

Only silver lining in this overall deal is you sold a Skoda and Bought a Toyota. Had it been other way around you would have cursed your Kundali! Anyways, Its a Toyota, and a hybrid too. Enjoy the 1st million mile car in your garage, these cars are made to age like fine err, you know. You have a rare car and a rare technology too. You need to co-exist with the dealer and have access to the maker, drop this fraud of a letter and patch it up with the dealer. Anyways your car wont have much resale value considering its rarity, might as well extract the maximum kms out of that.

These days I find showroom car sales man more deceitful than a used car salesman. Same applies to showroom behavior to make a sale is equally deceitful from top management to service floor level to meet their targets and bottom line.

Only - I repeat - ONLY Maruti dealers in my experience shivers at the very thought of loosing their license or rights of sales or service. Brand is a cash cow and irrespective of it being a tin-can, they know how to sell cars and how to keep the dealers on a leash and it is a highly standardized system across the nation. Such silly tak-tak fraud does not have place in Maruti.