[SmartCat]

Conventional wisdom is that if you are into gaming, you buy gaming peripherals. And if you are not, there is no need for a separate graphics card or fancy mouse/keyboard. However, gaming peripherals typically offer superior technology and also noticeable performance/usability boost - even for normal productivity work like web browsing, MS Office or OTT movies. These hardware upgrades offer significant bang for the buck when compared to the usual upgrades like "latest" processor/motherboard. Let's look at one such use case of gaming peripherals:

GOAL:

Most of our smartphones have 120 Hz display that results in buttery smooth web browsing and scrolling experience. So, the idea is to upgrade PC peripherals to achieve similar results on a desktop computer (or a laptop connected to external peripherals).

WHAT YOU NEED:

- 120 Hz refresh rate gaming monitor
- Dedicated graphics card (for best results, but not compulsory)
- Infinite scrolling or free spinning wheel gaming mouse

120 Hz REFRESH RATE MONITOR:

Obviously, if we want the same scrolling experience as a 120 Hz display smartphone, the key peripheral we need is a 120 Hz refresh rate monitor. I picked up 24 inch Acer monitor for Rs. 6,600. Typically, you pay 20% more for 120 Hz monitor over its 60 Hz variant.



(I prefer removing monitor stand and placing it against wall. So that I 'look down' at the screen, like you would when working on a laptop)

Note that Windows automatically does not switch to 120 Hz. You have to:

- Right click on desktop
- Display Settings
- Advanced Display Settings
- Refresh Rate
- Select 120 Hz from the drop-down list.

DEDICATED GRAPHICS CARD:

If you are not a gamer, very likely your computer will not have a dedicated GPU. However, it is a myth that GPU is needed only for gaming. These days, browsers offload lots of tasks to the GPU, including when scrolling a graphics intensive website with photos and streaming videos. To confirm this, on your system:

- Open photos.google.com
- Press AltCtrlDel, open task manager and click on 'performance' tab
- Now keep scrolling on your Google Photos page

If your system does not have a dedicated graphics card, you will notice that CPU usage hits high percentage levels and the system won't bother to allocate the load to the integrated graphics. And because of that, the system might see occasional stutters/freezes while scrolling fast, despite having a 120 Hz monitor. But if you have dedicated graphics card, the browser/system lets the GPU take care of this load, resulting in stutter or break-free scrolling (see GPU usage % in the screenshot)



Now unfortunately, because of the AI story, GPUs are super-expensive. Entry level GPUs start at Rs. 12,000 to 14,000 but this is enough for our goal (smooth scrolling). I picked up a pre-owned Nvidia GeForce GTX 1050 Ti for Rs. 5,999 from GameLoot.

Laptop users do not have the option of adding a GPU though. However, CPU and intergrated graphics will do a good job of smooth scrolling 80% of the time. Dedicated GPU is optional and only needed for those who have 'perfect' smooth scrolling all the time. And for those using older desktops, picking up a GPU makes lot of sense. It is much cheaper upgrade than changing processor + motherboard and will result in noticeable improvement in overall performance - even if you do not do gaming.

INFINITE SCROLLING or FREE SPINNING WHEEL MOUSE

Your typical mouse wheel when scrolling -

- is notchy
- makes a gentle sound
- offers gentle feedback to your fingers

while scrolling a website or a long document. This is of course intentional and perhaps desirable for most use cases. However, if we want smartphone like buttery smooth scrolling, we need a free-spinning mouse wheel that has no notches, makes no sound and offers no feedback while scrolling. I picked up a Razer Basilisk V3 wired gaming mouse for Rs. 4,200



What you get with that impressively named mouse is -

- Free spinning wheel that is a pleasure to use
- on/off button for the above feature. You can go back to traditional notch feel anytime.
- 5 or 6 buttons you can customize and use for even productivity tasks
- Heavy feel
- Bappi lahiri style bling and lights

Of course, the last 2 features some might put under 'cons' list. There are few other free spinning wheel mouse options (do a search for these on Amazon):

Logitech G502 Hero (Rs. 4,200)
Logitech MX series (Rs. 6,500 & above)

CONCLUSION:

1) Buttery smooth scrolling on your computer is not needed for most people. Until you spend some time working on such a computer. And after that, you will never go back to the old way.

2) Always buy gaming peripherals. More often than not, they are technologically superior. Even gaming keyboards too offer desirable features (eg: mechanical keys). These peripherals are better than their non-gaming counterparts in most parameters that matter. Even gaming laptops offer more for less.

[deathwalkr]

er should not your monitor be at eye level?

[SmartCat]

Originally Posted by deathwalkr

er should not your monitor be at eye level?

Again, conventional wisdom that "top of the monitor should be at eye level" is not entirely accurate. This guideline is more of a maximum level rather than a strict recommendation. That's because if you tilt your head upwards even slightly, it will strain your neck.

However, it is perfectly allright if top of the monitor is below the eye level. Your head will now be gently tilting downwards which is normal human head position while walking or sitting or reading newspaper/book or working. If you are sitting in front of a laptop, the top of the display will ALWAYS be lower than the eye level. Ditto if you are working on a tablet or just looking at a smartphone.

[sandeepmohan]

Originally Posted by SmartCat

It is much cheaper upgrade than changing processor + motherboard and will result in noticeable improvement in overall performance - even if you do not do gaming.

It maybe cheaper on the face of it. However, one must factor the energy draw for older equipment. There is a day and night difference if you were to compare the energy draw of an older cpu (Or even gpu) to a modern one.

A cpu cranking up to 50% utilization is not bad for bursts. It is designed to do that. Most modern cpu's are multi threaded. If one core/thread bursts to 100%, it still leaves the others to pick up any additional load, provided the application in use can tap into that unused compute.

Any modern Cpu can take quite a thrashing before it chokes up. The Integrated Graphics on AMD Ryzen G's are pretty solid for day to day use. Won't break a sweat no matter how hard you go with browsing or the occasional photo edit. I am pretty sure the equivalent Intel chips do equally well.

I'd say it is better to upgrade older hardware to something more modern for an overall better experience, versus trying to stretch the life of older hardware. I mean, it is fine if the use case permits and if funds are tight.

For example, I managed to extend the life of an old AMD Cpu rig based on your Chrome Flex thread. However, for Windows, that cpu was running at almost 50% utilization while doing nothing. With Chrome browser fired up, it went to 100%! Maximum power utilization and heat generated and I still could not get it to run optimally. Adding a gpu may have helped, however, the cpus side it still limited due to age. It simply could not cope.

[SmartCat]

Originally Posted by sandeepmohan

For example, I managed to extend the life of an old AMD Cpu rig based on your Chrome Flex thread. However, for Windows, that cpu was running at almost 50% utilization while doing nothing. With Chrome browser fired up, it went to 100%! Maximum power utilization and heat generated and I still could not get it to run optimally. Adding a gpu may have helped, however, the cpus side it still limited due to age. It simply could not cope.

There is something wrong with your rig, either on the hardware or software side. This is the CPU usage at idle on my 2nd gen core i5 test rig, which is exact same vintage as yours:



However, we can troubleshoot this problem.

- Go back to Windows 10 (fresh install)
- Go to Windows Store and download 'camomile' app. We can keep an eye on CPU temperature real-time. It also throttles the processor if needed to keep temperatures low.
- Open Task Manager -> Processes -> CPU. This will show CPU usage % by apps in descending order. Send screenshot.

Recommended hardware upgrades:

- Replacement of HDD with SSD (256 GB sata SSD costs Rs. 1,000)
- Higher RAM (16 GB minimum). 8 GB DDR3 RAM costs Rs. 700.

[sandeepmohan]

Originally Posted by SmartCat

There is something wrong with your rig, either on the hardware or software side

I gave up. Chrome Flex is more than sufficient for this education PC. Don't see myself going back to Windows. Ever.

It was a clean install. There was no other App other than Chrome loaded.

The system does have a brand new SSD and 16gb of ram. Far exceeds the requirements.

Yes, something is clearly wrong, software or hardware side.

Also, I could not install Windows 11 due to a lack of TPM Chip (Trusted Platform Module). Is just a suspicion cause Windows 11 said the hardware is incompatible. Fortunately I could reuse the license on Windows 10. However, it is now wasted again, as I swapped operating systems.

I'll attempt what you said with the camomile app, if I feel like dual booting the rig.

[SmartCat]

Originally Posted by sandeepmohan

Yes, something is clearly wrong, software or hardware side. I'll attempt what you said with the camomile app, if I feel like dual booting the rig.

Dual boot with Windows and hardware troubleshooting is a good idea. So put that on your 'weekend timepass projects' list.

CPU temperature (as shown by camomile) should be 40 to 50 degrees celcius. But if something is wrong with the cooling, it can touch 80 to 100 degrees celcius. At this point, the BIOS software will intervene and stop the CPU from killing itself (throttling). So take screenshots or note down the temperature when CPU usage shoots up. If CPU is overheating, steps to take are:

- Cleaning the cobwebs inside the box
- Checking if the CPU fan is actually spinning!
- Re-apply thermal paste on top of the processor (needs to be re-applied every 8 years apparently)

I just did that (Rs. 300 for thermal paste) for my test rig and replaced the CPU fan with higher rated one (Rs. 600).

[rajathv8]

Originally Posted by SmartCat

- Cleaning the cobwebs inside the box
- Checking if the CPU fan is actually spinning!

These two may seem trivial but make a significant difference. A lot of fine gunk remains inside.

Originally Posted by SmartCat

- Bappi lahiri style bling and lights

Seems to gel well with your Daler Mehndi keyboard

[d3mon]

Good points, but for 99% of people, getting a larger 2560x1440 or even a 4K monitor will be more productive and easier on the eyes, which will require far less alt-tabbing and scrolling to begin with.

My setup includes a 43" 4K 120Hz monitor and a 32" QHD monitor (mounted vertically) and it's hard to give up either the smooth 120Hz or the large real estate.

But if I had to pick only one, I'd definitely pick real estate and resolution (outside of gaming use cases).

[SmartCat]

Originally Posted by d3mon

But if I had to pick only one, I'd definitely pick real estate and resolution (outside of gaming use cases)

- Is the difference between Full HD & QHD/4k noticeable?
- Won't the fonts/apps appear too small at these high resolution? Do we have to use the Windows OS scaling feature?
- With larger than 27 inch screen, we have to sit further back right?

I know you are on 120 Hz monitor too, but any idea if 144 Hz or 180 Hz monitor offers even smoother experience? (I'm not much of a gamer, so gaming related gains are not that important)

[d3mon]

Originally Posted by SmartCat

- Is the difference between Full HD & QHD/4k noticeable?
- Won't the fonts/apps appear too small at these high resolution? Do we have to use the Windows OS scaling feature?
- With larger than 27 inch screen, we have to sit further back right?

I know you are on 120 Hz monitor too, but any idea if 144 Hz or 180 Hz monitor offers even smoother experience? (I'm not much of a gamer, so gaming related gains are not that important)

You can use windows scaling - works very well and on high resolution monitors, you can get your preferred font size with much better clarity.
Personal preferences vary, but here's my experience:

24" FHD is pixelated. QHD will require display scaling.
27" QHD is close to perfect DPI.
32" QHD is slightly pixelated.
32" 4K needs display scaling to be usable (Which still works great)
43" 4K is perfect DPI (but large - needs adjustment)

About refresh rates - it's very much a case of diminishing returns after 120 or even 90Hz.
60Hz = 16.66 ms
120Hz = 8.33 ms - delay cut down by 8.33ms
240Hz = 4.16 ms - delay cut down by only 4.16 ms

So 144 or 180Hz is completely useless unless you are a hardcore gamer.

[Venkatesh.C]

After experiments over several years, I've settled on a single monitor setup of 32" 4k (Samsung m7 smart monitor) with tiled windows for any side-by-side operations. I find it more comfortable than multi-monitor setup. Been using this setup since 2020. So far so good. Eyes line up at 80% mark of the top of the screen which is also perfect. I wear progressive lens specs, and I place the monitor further than my arm's length (~3ft) and it lines up perfectly for my middle portion of the glass to help me read without tilting my head too much and just use my eyeball movements to look at 2 windows tiled next to each other. I don't use 4k resolution either. I use QHD. In 4k, fonts are too small and I have not found a way to adjust font size independent of resolution in MacOs. Font sizes and resolution seem to go together in Mac.

[rohan_iitr]

Does this logic work for laptops too ?

Is it advisable to go for a gaming laptop, even if your current usage does not require such performance ?

I am in the market for a laptop and split between regular 15 inch laptop vs 15 inch gaming laptop. The extra weight and bulk of the gaming laptop does not bother me since I already have a 14 inch personal laptop and another 14 inch official laptop which I use while travelling.

Which would be a better option at similar price point:
1. Regular 15 inch laptop with 13th gen i7 (integrated graphics)
2. Gaming 15 inch laptop with 12th gen i7 (Nvidia graphics 4 GB)

I keep my devices for a long time. I sill have a 2008 Dell Inspiron, in usable condition.

[SmartCat]

Originally Posted by rohan_iitr

Does this logic work for laptops too? Is it advisable to go for a gaming laptop, even if your current usage does not require such performance ?

Absolutely. All chromium based browsers (Google Chrome, Microsoft Edge, Brave browser etc) will use the dedicated GPU if available. Not so much if webpage has only text, but a lot more if it has images/graphics/videos.



In chrome URL window, type chrome://gpu/ and hit enter to see your browser's graphics settings & performance. Even Office 365 shares workload with GPU if it is available, making things smoother. Especially if your Excel/Word/PPT document has graphs and images.

However, the GPU does NOT help with app loading time or multi-tasking. But it might help load a heavy webpage faster. GPU mostly helps you get stutter/freeze/hiccup free scrolling (which gives the feeling that your laptop is fast and fluid)

The extra weight and bulk of the gaming laptop does not bother me since I already have a 14 inch personal laptop and another 14 inch official laptop which I use while travelling.

Gaming laptops have 3 negatives compared to work/professional laptops:

- Extra weight/bulk/form factor
- Lower battery life (eg: 3 hrs on full charge vs 4 hours)
- Relatively poor shock resistance (work laptops are built for absorbing shocks while travelling on the road)

However, gaming laptops will have the following advantages over work laptops:

- Much better cooling system. Not susceptible to dust as much as work laptops
- Better equipment (120 Hz display, GPU etc)
- 'Performance' variant of the processor. Core i5 of a work laptop might focus on power efficiency (battery life + low heat generation) while core i5 of a gaming laptop might focus on performance. Intel processors have suffixes like N/U/K/P etc for each processor.

I keep my devices for a long time. I sill have a 2008 Dell Inspiron, in usable condition.

Regarding longevity, it is probably a draw. Work laptops have better shock resistance while gaming laptops have better cooling/ventilation. And longevity primarily depends on the price. Premium work/gaming laptops will have longer life than entry level or mid level work/gaming laptops.

[rkv_2401]

Originally Posted by rohan_iitr

I am in the market for a laptop and split between regular 15 inch laptop vs 15 inch gaming laptop. The extra weight and bulk of the gaming laptop does not bother me since I already have a 14 inch personal laptop and another 14 inch official laptop which I use while travelling.

I keep my devices for a long time. I sill have a 2008 Dell Inspiron, in usable condition.

On a laptop, you should definitely get the high refresh rate variant, and for your use case the gaming model sounds perfect. They are so much easier to maintain and upgrade, their beefed up cooling system provides adequate redundancy in case, say, the fans break, their large power supplies don't freak out as much as the ultra-portables (I once plugged in my old Yoga to charge at my college and the laptop started smoking), and in my experience they've been incredibly reliable. Plus, there's a large performance overhead in case you need it.

My laptop, 17" Strix, w/ 2.5TB of storage started out as a 512GB model. And there's still another NVMe slot left. I broke both the fans in 2022, was able to easily, manually unplug the CPU fan and have been using it w/ only the GPU fan for 2.5 years now. I have been putting this laptop through the ringer w/ heavy, continuous usage, including GPU mining, OCed gaming, and worst of all me poking around it's internals with screwdrivers and it's tanked it all. Yeah, it runs hot thanks to the broken fans, but it hasn't caused any problems, and the GPU is just about powerful enough that I can run it locked at the lowest voltage and still meet all my performance requirements. I've owned ultra-portables that turn off due to overheating even with perfect ventilation and additional cooling. One uber-premium ultra portable I used in 2007/8 would even BSOD after running a screensaver for 30 mins!

I don't feel that a GPU with 4GB of vRAM has any business being used in a 15" "gaming" laptop in 2025. But that's not too relevant for your planned use case.

RE: The discrete/integrated graphics discussion - it was a great idea @Smartcat to pick up a dedicated graphics card for your old PC! I'm pretty curious to see how far you'll be able to push this almost 15-year old CPU. Can it play YouTube videos at QHD/4k without lag?

Modern integrated graphics are getting pretty good. AMD's stuff has been decent for a while now, but Intel has really stepped their game up first with Intel Xe in 2020 and now Intel Xe 2 for Lunar Lake chips. Xe 1 is itself surprisingly good, I once played Helldivers 2 (modern, resource-intensive game) and got close to 50FPS at 720p low-medium. It would have been unimaginable to do that on a 14" laptop with integrated graphics 5+ years ago!

I think anything later than an 8th gen Intel Core i-series processor/2nd gen Ryzen G APU, with sufficient amounts of system RAM, should be powerful enough to drive a 120/144Hz display without stuttering or hiccups. My 10th gen i7 laptop can be comfortably used at 1080p 144Hz even with the dGPU disabled. And my 8th gen i7 Surface could run heavy wallpapers (Wallpaper Engine) at QHD+ 60 FPS.