The TV Thread - LCD, LED etc.

jassi · 11th October 2010, 19:42

was out shopping a plasma for my parents in Pune. I am not sure about the shops, but did goto this recommended place called Vijay Sales on Sadhu Vaswani Chowk.
We were approached by a salesman, who initially tried the usual banter on lcds and edge lit LED lcds being God's finest creations. Finally I caught hold of another salesman, and made clear to him, I want plasma and nothing else. He said lg/samsung is there, but they don't stock panny, but can get them in 5 days if I place an order.

Here are the prices
THP42V20 - 68875
TH42X20D - 41990
THP50U20D - 79990
TH50VT20D - 112955 (3d tv)

Question which one of these are 2009 models and to be avoided? I am guess X20, but what about U20?
Are these good prices and is there any one better than Vijay Sales for panny plasma in Pune. As this is for my parents, and I won't be around in Pune when they make the decision, I don't want them to end up with a showroom used plasma.
Any inputs would be great.

NetfreakBombay · 11th October 2010, 20:12

Its tough to avoid plasma unless you are there yourself to check the piece. Store employees just take the order, fulfillment is done by back office.

harry10 · 11th October 2010, 22:46

@@JAssi- All are 2010 models. The best one is V20 no doubt. However price quoted is on higher side. People are buying it at 64k around.

jassi · 12th October 2010, 09:17

thanks Harry - I am concerned about the last gen models which had long term black level issues as tested by cnet Panasonic admits plasma TV black level change but says picture quality still 'excellent' | Crave - CNET
I see good reviews on the v20 and vt20
Panasonic Viera TH-P42V20S (42-inch plasma) Review - TVs - CNET Asia
Panasonic Viera TH-P50VT20S (50-inch plasma) Product Review - TVs - CNET Asia
Can't find anything on the U20 though.
Also does anyone know 50PV20 price?
I think I will goto the panasonic brand store on dhole patil road today.

Dud_Dodo · 12th October 2010, 09:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by jassi

Finally I caught hold of another salesman, and made clear to him, I want plasma and nothing else.

Hi Jassi,
Any particular why you want only a Plasma? Just asking since I thought Plasma as a technology had failed due to certain reasons, despite having an extremely high response time. I could be wrong about the latest Plasmas though.

I have stopped keeping a close watch on technology due to time constraints etc, but the last I had heard is a Plasma screen 'burns off' the pixels if a particular picture stays on for a long time, without any change in it. (The concept due to which Screen Savers were introduced). In fact I have also seen this in person on a friend's Plasma, the top right corner on his TV which shows the DTH symbol has burnt off & thus is visible as lit pixels even when he isn't tuned in to the DTH and is watching a DVD movie from his DVD player.

Also, Plasma screens are very sensitive to tilt. I work for Dell and remember we were being given this demo of Plasma, way back when we'd launched them in the US. One of the points that the Product Group guys had mentioned was that a Plasma TV shouldn't be tilted more than 30 degrees etc.

jassi · 12th October 2010, 09:42

^^ thats what this whole thread is about :-) plasmas have evolved a lot over the last few years. Pioneer and Panasonic did a lot of work on plasmas, while others abandoned plasmas for LCDs which had inferior picture quality. As most manufacturers are on LCD, there are more margins on selling LCDs for store salesmen and more bad mouthing of plasmas.
Plasmas still rule in picture quality, especially black levels and hence rank on top of the cnet top TVs and land editors choice on most AV publications.
Best HDTVs overall - CNET Reviews
Plasmas are now pre-burnt in, which means burn in issues are all but gone. However general recommendation is first 100hrs, run on low contrast to avoid any issues. Also tilting the plasma tv during transportation is still a no no afaik. However these are small prices to pay for the great price at which these sets deliver picture quality (PQ).
LCDs and the new edge lit LED LCDs are inferior in black levels - ask your dealer the static panel contrast ratio, not the bloated dynamic contrast ratio.
The backlit LED LCDs (pixel illuminated) are the only ones that can rival plasmas in PQ and black levels. However they are not available in India and still quite expensive. So currently plasmas are still the best bang for the buck. Maybe in the future OLED will eliminate these technologies :-)

Edit - read the last 100 or more pages and you will see more and more people buying plasmas. My opinions are based on the tvs I have owned 2008 panny plasma, sony bravia rear projection (beats plasma), sony bravia LCD (now replaced by my plasma). Also I have friends who own edgelit and backlit LEDs and so have had the chance to compare in non-store settings.

NetfreakBombay · 12th October 2010, 10:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by jassi

Plasmas are now pre-burnt in, which means burn in issues are all but gone. However general recommendation is first 100hrs, run on low contrast to avoid any issues.

I know for a fact that burn-in is still an issue. A member on hifivision bough a plasma in April and got a demo piece with channel logo burnt in.

Pics and details : HELP! I've got a demo piece with IR and am not sure what do now!

I do agree that Plasma is MUCH better in picture quality. I have both Plasma and LCD and I use plasma as my primary display for home theater.

jassi · 12th October 2010, 10:55

^^ yes it is an issue if for the first 100hrs it is used in store in showroom mode with max settings turned on and the same logo is on it for days at a stretch. However on my plasma at home, I notice some image retention if i see a channel for 10+ hrs at a stretch - note this is image retention not burn in and goes away after you change channels or turn off and on after few mins.
Back to my research - between the U20 and V20, the V20 has a digital audio out. Anybody knows if this audio out is just 2 channel downscaled dolby/pcm or can carry actual 5.1/7.1 dolby.
I see this as a good feature to avoid hassles of connecting multiple audio cables to my 7.1 HT (non-hdmi reciever) which I am passing on to my parents.

neoonwheels · 12th October 2010, 12:10

Any idea about the specific time interval which can cause a burn in in plasma? I have recently bought Panasonic X20D and I am using the zoom functionality to avoid all static images (Logos etc) on the TV and I watch all the movies in 16:9 or zoom 1 so that the entire panel is used to render the movie. I have used the set for around 20 hours in last 5 days with the above adjustments. Also I have kept the contrast at 35 (100) and color 35 (100).

Let me know the time interval for which I can watch the TATA sky channels at a stretch without using zoom and with all stupid logos and other static images.

jassi · 12th October 2010, 12:31

^^ neoonwheels - i have used my panny plasma for extensive gaming (score text) and specific channels (vh1 logo) - at 10-12hrs there is no burn-in issues and I am pretty sure there will be no burn-in beyond that as well.
Also I use the plasma as my laptop monitor for conference calls (webex), movies, etc and a lot of times I have left the laptop running without screensaver for 4-5 hours and have had no issues!

edit - neoonwheels - you seem to be in pune. where did you buy the plasma from. whats a reliable shop and how much did it cost you for the x20 (42" or 50")?

Sn1p3r · 12th October 2010, 13:04

@neoonwheels: Burn in is a thing of past.
You can play with the TV just as the normal and enjoy the PQ. Cheers!

neoonwheels · 12th October 2010, 13:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sn1p3r

@neoonwheels: Burn in is a thing of past.
You can play with the TV just as the normal and enjoy the PQ. Cheers!

Quote:

Originally Posted by jassi

^^ neoonwheels - i have used my panny plasma for extensive gaming (score text) and specific channels (vh1 logo) - at 10-12hrs there is no burn-in issues and I am pretty sure there will be no burn-in beyond that as well.
Also I use the plasma as my laptop monitor for conference calls (webex), movies, etc and a lot of times I have left the laptop running without screensaver for 4-5 hours and have had no issues!

edit - neoonwheels - you seem to be in pune. where did you buy the plasma from. whats a reliable shop and how much did it cost you for the x20 (42" or 50")?

Thanks a lot guys. I guess to be on safer side, I will go on easy on the contrast ratio.

@jassi: I have bought the TV in Pune from Panasonic authorized dealer in Baner for 37.5K without any exchange.

jassi · 13th October 2010, 09:02

ok guys - I went to panasonic store on dhole patil road in Pune yesterday. The guy was knowledgeable (also posts on hifivision.com). I also researched a lot on hifivision.com and surprisingly found a lot of you tbhpians there :-)
Here are the prices from panny brand store
42v20 - 67k
46x20 - 55k
46u20 - 71k
50x20 - 73k (10k more than hifivision research)
50u20 - 89k (10k more than vijay sales!)
50v20 - 115k

I noticed that the 50x20, although not fullhd, at distances of 15 feet is a good option for my parents. One concern though is the resolution in 2010 hd ready models has been dropped from 1366 to 1024 - not sure if connecting a laptop via hdmi for video chat, etc is possible at these resolutions, can someone confirm? This is something for sure my parents intend to do with the tv, once a week or so.

Further research on hifivision revealed 50x20 can be had for 63k.
Can someone confirm if its practical to get 50x20 at 62-65k or are these demo pieces being dished out under the garb of new?

djkher · 14th October 2010, 09:07

Got my v20d yesterday. i had seen at my friends place and i knew it was 'the' tv i was looking for. Drooling over it as of now

drbabuanand · 14th October 2010, 14:18

after owning a panasonic pv8 for the past 2 yrs without a hitch,i am planning another 42" for my bed room.the cheapest in the market is x20 available for 34k in grey market.
neon wheels ,please share your experiance with x20,how is it different from v20?are u sure it is a 2010 model.
burning is not at all an issue,but be careful for the 1st 100 hrs.heat emmission,huge current bills are all a myth as far as 42" are concerened.not sure about 50" inches though.
i myself have convinced two of my friends for a plasma,both went for 50" and are happy,except for the heating issue.both say the room heats up within 30 min.they also feel a burning sensation of the eyes.
plasma 50" owners please confirm?
@jassi - waiting for your valuble inputs as i did for my 1st plasma.

11th October 2010, 19:42	#4006
jassi BHPian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Melbourne Posts: 980 Thanked: 12 Times View My Garage	was out shopping a plasma for my parents in Pune. I am not sure about the shops, but did goto this recommended place called Vijay Sales on Sadhu Vaswani Chowk. We were approached by a salesman, who initially tried the usual banter on lcds and edge lit LED lcds being God's finest creations. Finally I caught hold of another salesman, and made clear to him, I want plasma and nothing else. He said lg/samsung is there, but they don't stock panny, but can get them in 5 days if I place an order. Here are the prices THP42V20 - 68875 TH42X20D - 41990 THP50U20D - 79990 TH50VT20D - 112955 (3d tv) Question which one of these are 2009 models and to be avoided? I am guess X20, but what about U20? Are these good prices and is there any one better than Vijay Sales for panny plasma in Pune. As this is for my parents, and I won't be around in Pune when they make the decision, I don't want them to end up with a showroom used plasma. Any inputs would be great.
	() Thanks

11th October 2010, 20:12	#4007
NetfreakBombay Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Bombay Posts: 1,478 Thanked: 1,073 Times	Its tough to avoid plasma unless you are there yourself to check the piece. Store employees just take the order, fulfillment is done by back office.
	() Thanks

11th October 2010, 22:46	#4008
harry10 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Faridabad/Delhi Posts: 2,740 Thanked: 3,899 Times View My Garage	@@JAssi- All are 2010 models. The best one is V20 no doubt. However price quoted is on higher side. People are buying it at 64k around.
	() Thanks

12th October 2010, 09:17	#4009
jassi BHPian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Melbourne Posts: 980 Thanked: 12 Times View My Garage	thanks Harry - I am concerned about the last gen models which had long term black level issues as tested by cnet Panasonic admits plasma TV black level change but says picture quality still 'excellent' \| Crave - CNET I see good reviews on the v20 and vt20 Panasonic Viera TH-P42V20S (42-inch plasma) Review - TVs - CNET Asia Panasonic Viera TH-P50VT20S (50-inch plasma) Product Review - TVs - CNET Asia Can't find anything on the U20 though. Also does anyone know 50PV20 price? I think I will goto the panasonic brand store on dhole patil road today.
	() Thanks

12th October 2010, 09:42	#4011
jassi BHPian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Melbourne Posts: 980 Thanked: 12 Times View My Garage	^^ thats what this whole thread is about :-) plasmas have evolved a lot over the last few years. Pioneer and Panasonic did a lot of work on plasmas, while others abandoned plasmas for LCDs which had inferior picture quality. As most manufacturers are on LCD, there are more margins on selling LCDs for store salesmen and more bad mouthing of plasmas. Plasmas still rule in picture quality, especially black levels and hence rank on top of the cnet top TVs and land editors choice on most AV publications. Best HDTVs overall - CNET Reviews Plasmas are now pre-burnt in, which means burn in issues are all but gone. However general recommendation is first 100hrs, run on low contrast to avoid any issues. Also tilting the plasma tv during transportation is still a no no afaik. However these are small prices to pay for the great price at which these sets deliver picture quality (PQ). LCDs and the new edge lit LED LCDs are inferior in black levels - ask your dealer the static panel contrast ratio, not the bloated dynamic contrast ratio. The backlit LED LCDs (pixel illuminated) are the only ones that can rival plasmas in PQ and black levels. However they are not available in India and still quite expensive. So currently plasmas are still the best bang for the buck. Maybe in the future OLED will eliminate these technologies :-) Edit - read the last 100 or more pages and you will see more and more people buying plasmas. My opinions are based on the tvs I have owned 2008 panny plasma, sony bravia rear projection (beats plasma), sony bravia LCD (now replaced by my plasma). Also I have friends who own edgelit and backlit LEDs and so have had the chance to compare in non-store settings. Last edited by jassi : 12th October 2010 at 09:46.
	() Thanks

12th October 2010, 10:55	#4013
jassi BHPian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Melbourne Posts: 980 Thanked: 12 Times View My Garage	^^ yes it is an issue if for the first 100hrs it is used in store in showroom mode with max settings turned on and the same logo is on it for days at a stretch. However on my plasma at home, I notice some image retention if i see a channel for 10+ hrs at a stretch - note this is image retention not burn in and goes away after you change channels or turn off and on after few mins. Back to my research - between the U20 and V20, the V20 has a digital audio out. Anybody knows if this audio out is just 2 channel downscaled dolby/pcm or can carry actual 5.1/7.1 dolby. I see this as a good feature to avoid hassles of connecting multiple audio cables to my 7.1 HT (non-hdmi reciever) which I am passing on to my parents.
	() Thanks

12th October 2010, 12:10	#4014
neoonwheels Senior - BHPian Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Pune Posts: 2,069 Thanked: 1,881 Times View My Garage	Any idea about the specific time interval which can cause a burn in in plasma? I have recently bought Panasonic X20D and I am using the zoom functionality to avoid all static images (Logos etc) on the TV and I watch all the movies in 16:9 or zoom 1 so that the entire panel is used to render the movie. I have used the set for around 20 hours in last 5 days with the above adjustments. Also I have kept the contrast at 35 (100) and color 35 (100). Let me know the time interval for which I can watch the TATA sky channels at a stretch without using zoom and with all stupid logos and other static images.
	() Thanks

12th October 2010, 12:31	#4015
jassi BHPian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Melbourne Posts: 980 Thanked: 12 Times View My Garage	^^ neoonwheels - i have used my panny plasma for extensive gaming (score text) and specific channels (vh1 logo) - at 10-12hrs there is no burn-in issues and I am pretty sure there will be no burn-in beyond that as well. Also I use the plasma as my laptop monitor for conference calls (webex), movies, etc and a lot of times I have left the laptop running without screensaver for 4-5 hours and have had no issues! edit - neoonwheels - you seem to be in pune. where did you buy the plasma from. whats a reliable shop and how much did it cost you for the x20 (42" or 50")? Last edited by jassi : 12th October 2010 at 12:34.
	() Thanks

12th October 2010, 13:04	#4016
Sn1p3r Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Germany Posts: 1,022 Thanked: 232 Times View My Garage	@neoonwheels: Burn in is a thing of past. You can play with the TV just as the normal and enjoy the PQ. Cheers!
	() Thanks

13th October 2010, 09:02	#4018
jassi BHPian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Melbourne Posts: 980 Thanked: 12 Times View My Garage	ok guys - I went to panasonic store on dhole patil road in Pune yesterday. The guy was knowledgeable (also posts on hifivision.com). I also researched a lot on hifivision.com and surprisingly found a lot of you tbhpians there :-) Here are the prices from panny brand store 42v20 - 67k 46x20 - 55k 46u20 - 71k 50x20 - 73k (10k more than hifivision research) 50u20 - 89k (10k more than vijay sales!) 50v20 - 115k I noticed that the 50x20, although not fullhd, at distances of 15 feet is a good option for my parents. One concern though is the resolution in 2010 hd ready models has been dropped from 1366 to 1024 - not sure if connecting a laptop via hdmi for video chat, etc is possible at these resolutions, can someone confirm? This is something for sure my parents intend to do with the tv, once a week or so. Further research on hifivision revealed 50x20 can be had for 63k. Can someone confirm if its practical to get 50x20 at 62-65k or are these demo pieces being dished out under the garb of new? Last edited by jassi : 13th October 2010 at 09:04.
	() Thanks

14th October 2010, 09:07	#4019
djkher BHPian Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Mumbai Posts: 83 Thanked: 24 Times	Another p42v20d arrives! Got my v20d yesterday. i had seen at my friends place and i knew it was 'the' tv i was looking for. Drooling over it as of now
	() Thanks

14th October 2010, 14:18	#4020
drbabuanand BHPian Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: trichy Posts: 60 Thanked: 8 Times	after owning a panasonic pv8 for the past 2 yrs without a hitch,i am planning another 42" for my bed room.the cheapest in the market is x20 available for 34k in grey market. neon wheels ,please share your experiance with x20,how is it different from v20?are u sure it is a 2010 model. burning is not at all an issue,but be careful for the 1st 100 hrs.heat emmission,huge current bills are all a myth as far as 42" are concerened.not sure about 50" inches though. i myself have convinced two of my friends for a plasma,both went for 50" and are happy,except for the heating issue.both say the room heats up within 30 min.they also feel a burning sensation of the eyes. plasma 50" owners please confirm? @jassi - waiting for your valuble inputs as i did for my 1st plasma.
	() Thanks