[deathwalkr]

@agspins: dude nice DIY work on the tank. First up get rid of those sharks and save yourself and them a lot of trouble later on. They are huge fishes meant for ponds or really big tanks as they grow upwards of 2feet! IMO they should never be sold to a home hobbyist.

"Now after two years the tank holds( sorry havent been able to click'em) a pair of sharks, pair of firemouth cichlids, pair of albino rainbow sharks, pair of spot finned spiny eel and a green sevurum..."

As for the eel, they love sandy bottoms into which they can dig into. What was your tank size again? Hope i did not miss it

[deathwalkr]

Originally Posted by ruchirtnt

In continuation to my aquatic family, i added a pair of blue acara which were quite expensive, and they did not survive a single day. i could not understand the reason for it when i had most cichilds in my tank.
Now I have ordered a bigger aquarium of size 120X45X60 cm and has planned to put a flowerhorn in it,

Hope you the new tank is just for your flowerhorn alone. A 4ft tank would be just about right for a flowerhorn to be good and happy.

Originally Posted by ruchirtnt

I came across a flowerhorn parrot hybrid fish as told by the shop keeper, he told that they can be kept in pairs and they do not grow big like a flowerhorn, do anybody has any idea that are they ok to keep in pairs that too in aquarium which already have parrots, oscar, neon acara, angel.

i have never been a fan of parrots. but yes they do not grow big as regular flowerhorns. what is your tank size and what are the sizes of the fishes you have? surprised that the angel is still there

[ruchirtnt]

Originally Posted by deathwalkr

Hope you the new tank is just for your flowerhorn alone. A 4ft tank would be just about right for a flowerhorn to be good and happy.

i have never been a fan of parrots. but yes they do not grow big as regular flowerhorns. what is your tank size and what are the sizes of the fishes you have? surprised that the angel is still there

All are of almost 2" size except oscar of 3", shark & crocodile fish at 5"

I have now ordered a new aquarium of 135X60X45 cm size and will do a partition at 60 cm for flowerhorn

[shashank.nk]

Originally Posted by ruchirtnt

I have now ordered a new aquarium of 135X60X45 cm size and will do a partition at 60 cm for flowerhorn

Partitioning the tank may not be a very good idea, as i learn't the hard way. If one of your fishes catches an infection, its almost certain the other tank inmates will suffer from it and you may have a total wipeout.

[ruchirtnt]

Originally Posted by shashank.nk

Partitioning the tank may not be a very good idea, as i learn't the hard way. If one of your fishes catches an infection, its almost certain the other tank inmates will suffer from it and you may have a total wipeout.

That is very true but it is also applicable for those who keeps all fishes in one
doing a partition is a Plan B, Plan A is to keep a small size flowerhorn among my current set of fishes and if they do not adjust then i will go for a parition,

[kri$hna]

Originally Posted by Abhi_abarth

Hi Krishna,

These are lovely pics, your dog is a cutie. I like the third picture the most. It seems to be a short haired German Shepherd (correct me if I am wrong). I just love dogs, trying to get one home but lost in a dilemma between a pedigree or adopt one from Blue cross. Should take the decision soon.

Wish you good times with your Tiger !

Cheers.

Thanks Abhi.

Yea, you are right. My pet is a short haired GSD, but with a shunted growth due to his reaction during 1st dose of vaccination. He looks a little smaller in size and resembles a puppy of 9mnths to 1yr age while he actually is 2.5yrs old. Stays young

There are many people in my locality confused on what to do with the name tiger. Many kids here have started thinking Tiger is actually this kinda dog and any other GSD they see, they call it tiger itseems. They are having a hard time convincing them tiger is something else and not a gsd!! Infact, my tiger is more popular in my locality than me with all kids calling his name while we walk around in the evenings.

If you are not really keen on getting your pet registered, show him off in dog shows etc, then any breed (including indian) will do. I would suggest adopting from blue cross. Pedigree doesnt mean anything to you if you are not going breed the dog or show it off.

My earlier two pets were adopted only. Tiger was the pet that i bought, though not a pedigree or show quality, i bought him because he resembled my earlier pet like a true Photo Copy !!

[KarthikK]

Originally Posted by Abhi_abarth

I just love dogs, trying to get one home but lost in a dilemma between a pedigree or adopt one from Blue cross. Should take the decision soon.

Originally Posted by kri$hna

Pedigree doesnt mean anything to you if you are not going breed the dog or show it off.

Not really true . I used to do dog shows with my golden. Pedigreed breeds aren't necessarily only for showoff. Different breeds are meant for different things, and have specific traits. Labradors and Golden retrievers were meant for assisting hunters by fetching the hunted birds - they have an excellent skill of swimming and staying focused. They are also extremely friendly, largely family oriented and love to interact with other 'strangers' (totally non-aggressive). In contrast, the dobermann is an aggressive breed meant to hunt down prey and is a wonderful watchdog, hence is no good with strangers. Dachshunds are long and funny looking, but it is because they were meant to hunt rabbits in underground burrows. They are habitual mud-diggers due to this origin. Bottomline is, each breed has its own traits and you have to pick what best suits your requirements. Just make sure you get papers for the pup you buy.

- Do you want a normal pet that just loves to be petted and be your couch potato buddy? Get some small breed which doesn't need much exercise.
- Do you want a jogging companion whom you would love to jog with, for an hour or two everyday? Get an athletic breed like a lab or golden or german shepherd (many more options)
- Do you want a no-nonsense watchdog to guard your property? Then you need an aggressive breed.

What a dog show does is trivial - they examine different participating dogs and judge the best ones as 'Best of breed' etc. What this means is that those 'winner' dogs are actually fine specimens of that particular breed. When this certification is given, it is like a license for the breeders to go ahead and breed those specimens to continue the good lineage and produce pups which conform to the breed standards. Good pedigreed breeders never breed without a champion certificate, and they never sell pups without registration certificates. For this reason, always make sure you get papers for the pedigreed pup you buy. It is a proof that your pup's parents and grandparents are certified as good examples of the breed. Without papers, there is no guarantee to the pedigree quality. So with such uncertified pups, you may have a golden going agressive, or golden with some black hair, a GSD developing a deformed leg, or contracting a hereditary defect or some such violation.

A Dog-show does not and need not make sense for a normal dog owner to participate. What it will do is it will certify your dog as being a good specimen of his/her breed. Nothing more.

@Abhi-abarth - I suggest you google up different breeds and see which one suits your household, your requirements and what kind of dog you would like. Adopting a stray is a very noble cause and I would like to salute you for even thinking in that direction. Normally, you should go for pedigreed breeds if you have specific requirements in mind. If you would like to adopt a stray and give it a loving home, nothing better. Do let us know about your decision, and share some pics after your doggie comes home

@kri$hna - lovely pics of tiger btw, he does look menacing. Do post a few more pics if you have. I am a huge fan of GSDs, one of the most intelligent breeds ever!

[kri$hna]

Originally Posted by KarthikK

... Adopting a stray is a very noble cause and I would like to salute you for even thinking in that direction. Normally, you should go for pedigreed breeds if you have specific requirements in mind. If you would like to adopt a stray and give it a loving home, nothing better. Do let us know about your decision, and share some pics after your doggie comes home

@kri$hna - lovely pics of tiger btw, he does look menacing. Do post a few more pics if you have. I am a huge fan of GSDs, one of the most intelligent breeds ever!

That was a nice post karthikk. I was trying to tell Abhi that he wouldnt need a pedigree if he not after a specific trait/breed. Like you said, a certified champion usually means the pups will be crazily priced and come with their own benefits of predictable characteristics etc. But unless you are in the market looking for a specific quality/breed/trait you will not need a pedigree pup.

All said and done, i myself would not be very comfortable adopting a stray (though i would like to feed & take care of the strays in locality) because I like having a GSD around for their intelligence and behaviour with strangers & children. So, in my case, i will look for a GSD either on sale or adoption, which need not be registered (my tiger is not regd) and not necessarily from any particular lineage.

BTW, my I think if i start posting pics of my tiger, this thread will be overloaded ! I ll take some time sorting them out and post them soon. Thanks for your interest, tiger smiles

@Abhi- I would suggest you to be careful in your choice because there are quite a few breeders who sell registered (fake regd) dogs with no particular lineage & also with illness history. This is why i say, adopt from known friends or a society like Blue Cross (hyd) or CUPA (blr). Good luck with your decision and i m waiting eagerly!

[Ragul]

Personally I think this craze for foreign breeds is the typical Indian craze for all things "phoren". Especially when I see large GSDs in a tiny flat where the owners themselves cannot walk 2kms daily because they are unfit - how the dog gets its daily quota of exercise to keep fit is a mystery to me.
The love for only specific breeds like labradors is an acquired taste that comes with watching Hollywood movies and reading pulp fiction novels. Of course phoren dog owners will attribute their likes to superior and discerning minds much like scotch and single malt lovers

While the love and affection one feels for a pet is genuine, the mental decision to consistently choose only phoren breeds and ignore Indian ones has a certain snob value behind it.

Edit: I still go for furry cats with bushy tails always, so I do agree about liking certain looks and going for that breed. I just think many dog owners get too mental about it, thats all. And oh! I love daschunds...and that little terrier clinging from the door knob from the movie "Mask" or the Pug for example, but would I keep it? A street dog certainly( I keep wanting to but think about my desire to keep many cats and postpone), a pedigree maybe not!

While I agree animals like horses need to be bred for certain functions, I see absolutely nothing inferior about Indian dogs to be kept as house pets. After all they are just supposed to laze around all day and do nothing. Maybe guard the house when empty.

Here is an interesting article about Indian dogs: Business Line : Features / Life : Mongrels to the rescue
The Army now uses these dogs for Jungle Warfare with very good results. Earlier the foot patrols had to return early because the "phoren" breeds did not have the stamina and always needed expensive medical attention and vets. In contrast

“They may have been a little temperamental at times, but they hardly ever require a vet, they never fall asleep on duty and their endurance over jungle terrain is formidable.
...<snip>...
...the mongrels, picked from streets in Chhattisgarh, a hotbed of Maoist insurgency and where the CTJWC is based, have exceeded all expectations. One drill found that three of the four original street dogs out-sniffed the two pedigree labradors they had been trained alongside.

or

The pedigree dogs and mongrels share the same diet and training schedule, but the so-called country dogs rarely require vet visits and can work long hours and walk 30-40 km without displaying any signs of tiredness or exhaustion, says Ponwar. They also adjust well to the jungle terrain in hot and humid weather, as also under severe cold conditions or during heavy rains, he adds.
While the Labrador and Alsatian dogs sometimes require veterinary care, the mongrels rarely ever fall sick.

Personally I never found the ISD any less intelligent. But hey I am not a dog owner so my views dont "qualify" I guess

--R

[agspins]

Originally Posted by deathwalkr

@agspins: dude nice DIY work on the tank. First up get rid of those sharks and save yourself and them a lot of trouble later on. They are huge fishes meant for ponds or really big tanks as they grow upwards of 2feet! IMO they should never be sold to a home hobbyist.

"Now after two years the tank holds( sorry havent been able to click'em) a pair of sharks, pair of firemouth cichlids, pair of albino rainbow sharks, pair of spot finned spiny eel and a green sevurum..."

As for the eel, they love sandy bottoms into which they can dig into. What was your tank size again? Hope i did not miss it

@deathwalkr Thanks mate, My tank size is 30X15X18, As of now i lost half of my fishes eels, albino sharks & Sevrum are gone ( Pet store guy says its due to tempratures (46+ it was)). Now Sharks and fire mouths rule the tank, I am planning a Lobster and few snails.What do you say?

[deathwalkr]

Please do not listen to what your LFS says. For most of them it is just business and they will sell maximum numbers of fishes to a customer no matter how small a tank he buy because they know that the fishes will die and the customer will come back and he can sell more :(

for a 1ft tank, the amount of fishes you had is way too much dude. the kind of bio load it had to handle could be the culprit for the death of your fishes.

Loose the sharks immediately. they do not belong in a home aquarium.

get a crayfish, snails [though they will over run your tank very fast] and keep a pair or 1 firemouth.

if you want to keep more number of fishes, then look for a nano planted setup and keep neon tetras. do a google image search for small planted tanks and you will get an idea.

before buying fishes, find out ask around how big will they grow and what conditions they need to live in

[ruchirtnt]

I came across a kind of flowerhorn parrot fish and the shop keeper told me that they are sold in pairs only; i asked the basic difference and he told me that they do not grow much bigger in size just like flowerhorns and he also had the flowerhorn living seperately
the question is that can i keep this 2" pair with my other cichilids like green terror, parrot, oscar, firemouth and angels?

[KarthikK]

Originally Posted by Ragul

Personally I think this craze for foreign breeds is the typical Indian craze for all things "phoren". Especially when I see large GSDs in a tiny flat where the owners themselves cannot walk 2kms daily because they are unfit - how the dog gets its daily quota of exercise to keep fit is a mystery to me.

+1. a very valid point. This is one of the major reasons why dog shelters exist today. Many owners end up buying some breeds just because they look "cute" or "wicked" and then there is just a mismatch between what the owner thought and what the dog turned out to be. The culprit is always the ignorant owner, and the poor dog has to suffer. I have seen so many examples of this scenario - Some busy office-going person buys a lab just because he thought that 'yellow ball of fur' looked cute. When he doesn't have time to exercise it, the dog ends up getting frustrated by lack of exercise, and becomes naughty or develops a habit of barking. The owner punishes the dog for being naughty. Dog doesn't know what it did wrong, becomes more frustrated. The owner starts tying up the dog, increasing its frustration and confusion. One fine day, the owner gives it away and tells people he "couldn't take care of it, so gave it to a friend's farmhouse" or some such excuse. All of this could have been prevented had the owner done some research into what each breed requires and whether he can provide it or not. I feel so sorry for the innocent dog which got trapped in all this. A very common scenario in our cities.

While the love and affection one feels for a pet is genuine, the mental decision to consistently choose only phoren breeds and ignore Indian ones has a certain snob value behind it.

it might be true for most ignorant owners, but it may not always be the case. Some people buy some breeds with specific requirements in mind. Some intelligence-oriented tasks cannot be matched by indian breeds. Ditto with stamina. Some athletic breeds can run all day long, or can even swim across rivers and lakes. An average stray dog hates water and will likely drown in the water. If I travel and hike frequently, I would obviously prefer the athletic one. That said, the showoff buyer will always choose a breed for snob value, usually something which was popular in some movie / TV ad. When I go out for walks, some children who play close by refer to my golden retriever (her name is Ginger) as 'that dog in the Pedigree TV advertisement'. some weeks back, one child who lives in an apartment supposedly got good marks in the exam and her parents bought her a golden retriever pup as an award. Will it go down the same route as what I explained above, I guess so.

While I agree animals like horses need to be bred for certain functions, I see absolutely nothing inferior about Indian dogs to be kept as house pets. After all they are just supposed to laze around all day and do nothing. Maybe guard the house when empty.

+1. I do agree with this

Here is an interesting article about Indian dogs
The Army now uses these dogs for Jungle Warfare with very good results. Earlier the foot patrols had to return early because the "phoren" breeds did not have the stamina and always needed expensive medical attention and vets.

Interesting article. Our local dogs are generally rough and tough and are from our own climate, hence can withstand our Indian climatic conditions better than european / american breeds in general. Good job on the part of the army to use these. That said, there are specific breeds meant for this kind of rigorous activities, GSD being one of the best examples. Perhaps the army did some breed mismatch too .

Personally I never found the ISD any less intelligent

You're right - As a house pet, intelligence requirements are minimal and should not matter. But pedigreed dogs are deployed for a plethora of reasons. Some act as companions/guide dogs for blind people, helping them cross the roads and commuting within the city etc. Some are used with spastic/physically challenged children as therapy dogs (most of the therapy dogs are golden retrievers / labradors). Note that most of these applications require an unusual amount of patience and intelligence, which cannot be guaranteed by mongrels. Some dogs have an exceptional sense of smell and scent tracking - like bloodhounds and basset hounds. They will obviously be used as sniffers where possible, similar reason again.

[Abhi_abarth]

[quote=KarthikK;2801905]

@Abhi-abarth - I suggest you google up different breeds and see which one suits your household, your requirements and what kind of dog you would like. Adopting a stray is a very noble cause and I would like to salute you for even thinking in that direction. Normally, you should go for pedigreed breeds if you have specific requirements in mind. If you would like to adopt a stray and give it a loving home, nothing better. Do let us know about your decision, and share some pics after your doggie comes home

Originally Posted by kri$hna

That was a nice post karthikk. I was trying to tell Abhi that he wouldnt need a pedigree if he not after a specific trait/breed. Like you said, a certified champion usually means the pups will be crazily priced and come with their own benefits of predictable characteristics etc. But unless you are in the market looking for a specific quality/breed/trait you will not need a pedigree pup.


@Abhi- I would suggest you to be careful in your choice because there are quite a few breeders who sell registered (fake regd) dogs with no particular lineage & also with illness history. This is why i say, adopt from known friends or a society like Blue Cross (hyd) or CUPA (blr). Good luck with your decision and i m waiting eagerly!

@kri$hna/KarthikK: Thank you for your suggestions friends. Right from my childhood days I used to get stray puppies home but had to put them back due to space constrains since we were living in a rented house then. Instead, all of us used to feed them regularly as long as they stayed in our locality. My parents who used to hate dogs have also started liking them due to their unconditional love which is no surprise. I have a special corner for the strays as throughout my childhood I have seen their entire life cycle on survival.

Need advice from you : I initially wanted a Labrador but due to their over-friendliness with strangers it might not work for me since our colony is not fully developed and we have not many houses/families staying. Done a lot of research and narrowed down on GSD due to their sheer intelligence and alertness. We never had dogs at our home but used to feed stray dogs, so this will be our official first pet. Yes, I am ready to spend time with the pet daily for long walks/jogs and grooming.

My questions :

Will it be difficult for a newbie dog owner to handle the GSD ? I am ready to train it with basic obedience and socializing. One of my friends is a dog trainer.

Will my parents have trouble handling the dog (GSD) ?

Are the Indian breeds at par with GSD in terms of intelligence and watchfulness ?

And can both GSD and the mongrel (adopted dog) stay without fights if I plan to take both ?

Please help me with the answers.

[KarthikK]

^^ Nice to know about the long association with strays. They are definitely very affectionate and loyal. Some of them come near my house, but my girl (my golden I mean) doesn't tolerate them getting attention when she is here *lol*.

Originally Posted by Abhi_abarth

Need advice from you...
...
My questions :

My answers below

Will it be difficult for a newbie dog owner to handle the GSD ? I am ready to train it with basic obedience and socializing. One of my friends is a dog trainer.

Should not make any difference whether you are a newbie or not. You can definitely go in for a GSD, as long as you are aware of the breed's traits. You may want to train it yourself. Quite a few people have this trainer thing which will not work properly most of the times. I can explain in simple terms- for the dog who is staying with you, you are the master. He would love to be guided by you, rather than by someone who comes in for half an hour on weekends or something. I've seen some people employ trainers who will train the dog, but the dog might either forget the commands because the actual owner doesn't use it the same way as the trainer, or else the dog doesn't feel he needs to obey the actual owner in the same way. Either way, it is a lose-lose situation. I'd rather have YOU do the training yourself, and the results will be permanent, plus you and the dog will bond better during the training. Lots of videos on the web available on these things, so it shouldn't be difficult. Drop me a PM in case you need any assistance, will be glad to help out.

Will my parents have trouble handling the dog (GSD) ?

Not at all. I suppose you are referring to difficulty during taking the dog for walks, etc. Lots of dogs pull like crazy, because they have not been trained to walk at the same pace. Most of the cases, the dog ends up taking the owner for a walk, with the owner clinging on for dear life

All the dog needs to be trained for is NOT to pull during walks, and not to be distracted by other people/ stray animals / situations during walks. These are very easy things to train. Soon you will have your dog walking/jogging at exactly the same pace as you. If you speed up / slow down, he/she will do the exact same thing without a fuss.

Are the Indian breeds at par with GSD in terms of intelligence and watchfulness ?

Depends on what kind of intelligence you are referring to. GSDs can take care of children at home, and be trained to attack intruders on the property at the same time, for example. By Indian breeds, do you mean mongrels / strays? There are lots of Indian pedigreed breeds too. When a particular breed is termed as intelligent, note that I only mean that breed is easier to train complex commands. It is not that the other breeds are inefficient of doing those things, it is just that they take longer to pickup and understand the training.

On a lighter note, here is a ranking list of the top 10 most intelligent dog breeds
http://www.petmedsonline.org/top-10-...the-world.html

P.S - After training my golden retriever (which ranks pretty high in intelligence) pretty easily, I had gone to one of my friend's houses where they were trying to train a Basset hound (a slightly dumb breed). The amount of time it took to teach the Basset to wait till it was allowed to eat (Stay command) was hilarious. It just would not understand even after good 20-30 attempts, so they had try again after a day. That's the kind of difference I am referring to.

And can both GSD and the mongrel (adopted dog) stay without fights if I plan to take both ?

Definitely yes, if you acclimatize them properly. While most people would suggest bringing both as pups so they grow up as siblings, I would suggest the reverse - that you get a GSD pup, bring it up for a year or so, and once it attains mental maturity, then you can go in for the next dog. I say this for 2 reasons -

- Housebreaking / toilet training of 2 new pups is going to be a nightmare you do not want to get into. House will soon start smelling of you-know-what

- When the second pup is brought into the house in the presence of a bigger, trained, mature guy, the younger one watches and learns the older one's mannerisms and picks up the trained habits quicker. Also, the newer pup learns to respect the older guy and leaves it that way. If 2 pups are brought in together, you will have sibling rivalry every now and then. Competition for food, for attention, for petting, etc. It (rivalry) becomes quite a handful at times, because what will be sacrificed will be your mom's favourite cushions or bedsheets, or your dad's favourite pair of shoes.