[ferrarirules]

Originally Posted by volkman10

It’s unclear what the cause of the fire was.

A better image to attached should have been this. The car was up on the ramp. It could be simply improper handling of the car by the service technician. Also the area of the 12 volt battery is damaged not the lower HV battery area

[NomadSK]

There was already recalls for Audi e-tron GT for its high-voltage battery issues, with Audi warning of potential fire risks, report by NHTSA.

On December 6, 2023 Audi was informed by Porsche that a safety-related defect in HV battery modules in certain Porsche Taycan vehicles had been determined and a safety recall had been decided. Because the Audi e-tron GT is a substantially similar vehicle and uses the same HV battery modules, Audi submitted a foreign recall report under 49 CFR Part 579 and started the investigation for Audi.

December 2023 - March 2024: Audi started investigating this issue together with Porsche and the battery cell/module manufacturer, using in particular data analytics and hardware analyses. With this additional investigation and analyses, on March 15, 2024 Audi determined that a safety-related defect exists in vehicles identified via data analytics and hardware analyses. As there are different batches of potentially affected Audi e-tron GT vehicles which require different remedies, Audi decided to conduct two different recalls on March 15, 2024 (manufacturer recall identification code 93VM and 93VN):

Recall Report

[sharathkamath04]

Originally Posted by PreludeSH

I had posted in another thread regarding EV fires. In ICE cars the fire starts in the electrical circuits powering accessories, for airbags etc which is common to EVs. EVs could have these fires too.

In EVs, additionally the fuel source itself self combusts which doesn't happen in ICE cars. Added risks are putting it out is difficult and even after putting it out, it might keep re-igniting. So there are some differences. I park my cars in my garage and not sure I am confident to park an EV and wouldn't even want to charge them there.

The ICE fuel source is flammable and can easily catch fire. Over decades, testing, tech updates, and research have ensured that petrol is kept safe even during fires, avoiding disasters.

For EVs too it is the same. The batteries are tested under tough conditions before being put in a Car. So chances of an HV battery causing fire are low (as low as a petrol tank catching fire).

Dont you feel scared to keep 40lt of flammable liquid in your garage?

[volkman10]

A woman suffered burns while using an EV charging unit in North Paravur,(Kerala) leading to inspections by electrical inspectorate officials and the installation agency.
Although no faults were found in the unit, possible issues with the earthing system and being examined.

The charging unit where the incident happened remains closed to prevent further accidents.

Link:

[volkman10]

EV fire case – Court orders Tata Motors to refund Rs 16.95 Lakh

The court order:

After hearing both parties, the consumer court has ruled in favour of the complainant. In their opinion, the court concludes that the said car has a manufacturing defect. The court also points out that the actions of the opposite parties reveal unfair trade practices and deficiency in services. The court has ordered the opposite parties to pay the following compensation. Refund Rs 16,95,000, which is the original cost of the vehicle. An interest of 9% is applicable on the outstanding amount, till the date of realization. Rs 2,50,000 to be paid for causing mental agony, physical trauma and inconvenience to the complainant. This amount also covers the treatment cost of and compensation paid to V. Balanarasaiah, the motorcyclist involved in this accident. Rs 10,000 to be paid as the costs incurred by the complainant

Link:

[sri_tesla]

Originally Posted by volkman10

EV fire case – Court orders Tata Motors to refund Rs 16.95 Lakh

The court order:
Link:

Why did Tata give a refurbished battery when it's under warranty. instead of a new one in the first place?

Tata claims that the fire happened due to the accident with the motorcycle or a short circuit in the wiring caused by the collision.

So, an EV will catch fire if it collides with a 2-wheeler? Maybe they should mention that when they are selling the vehicle. Wiring done by Tata or their dealer. So, how will it be an external factor as Tata claims?

Tata EV's bad reliability, incidents like these, and Tata's response to them are hurting Tata's sales and EV segment. It's one of the main reasons their EV sales stagnated and even declined.

[ferrarirules]

Originally Posted by sri_tesla

Why did Tata give a refurbished battery when it's under warranty. instead of a new one in the first place?

This is the standard approach by all manufacturers, they change the damaged cells and give the customer a battery at same or better SOH. If they start giving new batteries, they will be in deep trouble.

Example - my battery was already run 1,00,000 km and the SOH of the battery was 94-95%. If i get a new battery, I am the happiest as now I will use my car for another 1,00,000 kms (Total - 2 lakh kms on ODO) and my battery will be still at 94-95% SOH.

So, an EV will catch fire if it collides with a 2-wheeler? Maybe they should mention that when they are selling the vehicle. Wiring done by Tata or their dealer. So, how will it be an external factor as Tata claims

Has it never happened a car has caught fire due to an accident? Just two example out of many on our forum - this car which burnt after rear ending a bus - link (Accidents : Vehicles catching Fire in India) or this porsche which burnt after colliding with a tree - link (Accidents : Vehicles catching Fire in India)

[Rahul Bhalgat]

Originally Posted by ferrarirules

Has it never happened a car has caught fire due to an accident?

Agree with you. We need not pay attention and respond to a post that has been posted just to bash some manufacturer.

Just ignore those comments summarily stating that Tata (or Some XYZ company) is a bad company making unreliable cars bla bla.

I appreciate Tata for their turnaround in the last few years. I appreciate Tata for their success and market share in the passanger cars including EVs. You will see some incidents/ some problems with every manufacturer. Each one has their own strength and each one has positioned themselves in a particular way in the market.

[sri_tesla]

Originally Posted by ferrarirules

This is the standard approach by all manufacturers, they change the damaged cells and give the customer a battery at same or better SOH. If they start giving new batteries, they will be in deep trouble.

Example - my battery was already run 1,00,000 km and the SOH of the battery was 94-95%. If i get a new battery, I am the happiest as now I will use my car for another 1,00,000 kms (Total - 2 lakh kms on ODO) and my battery will be still at 94-95% SOH.

The original issue was not due to battery capacity being reduced after long usage and duration. If you read the article linked, the issue was:

While the initial experience was good, the complainant started facing issues within 11 months of using the car. The complainant mentions that the car won’t run even when the battery was showing 18%. Moreover, the normal drive mode could not be engaged. This occurred a couple of times.

At the Tata Motors authorized dealer and service centre, it was found that the HV (High Voltage) battery pack was depleted. A replacement was ordered, but it took more than a month. During this time, the owner was asked to drive the Nexon EV without letting the battery charge drop below 50%.

If it's just a regular capacity reduction issue due to usage then why would Tata replace the battery in the first place? The warranty for such cases only applies if the capacity goes below 70% if I am not wrong.

But in this case, Tata and the dealer determined that there was an issue with the battery. Then why did they replace it with a refurbished one? Warranty applies as there was some defect in the battery and customers should get a new one.

Has it never happened a car has caught fire due to an accident? Just two example out of many on our forum - this car which burnt after rear ending a bus - link (Accidents : Vehicles catching Fire in India) or this porsche which burnt after colliding with a tree - link (Accidents : Vehicles catching Fire in India)

What are the chances of a new EV catching fire vs the one which has a refurbished battery?

Tata clearly has a lot of reliability problems with their EVs. The sooner they resolve the better for them and their customers. Many people are already staying away from their EVs due to these issues. Same thing is happening with Ola in 2-wheelers.

[ferrarirules]

Originally Posted by sri_tesla

What are the chances of a new EV catching fire vs the one which has a refurbished battery?

Lets agree to disagree on the refurbished vs new battery capacity part.

For the questions "What are the chances of a new EV catching fire vs the one which has a refurbished battery?" - Chances are the same as the battery of the vehicle didn't catch fire.

[volkman10]

Tesla bursts into flames after hurricane Helene floods garage.

The footage was released by Florida officials, who warned residents about the dangers of EV fires.

Florida officials have released video of a Tesla catching fire after apparently being flooded in the wake of Hurricane Helene.
Little is known about the incident, but the vehicle was partially submerged and its battery pack apparently sparked a blaze.
Automakers and officials are warning flooded EV owners to move their vehicles away from structures and other combustible materials.

Link:

[thomahawk]

Originally Posted by volkman10

Tesla bursts into flames after hurricane Helene floods garage.

I was reading about the power outage during the hurricane and thinking about VTL/VTG features of an EV coming handy in such situations. Guess you can't have everything.

[Turbanator]

Originally Posted by sri_tesla

Then why did they replace it with a refurbished one? Warranty applies as there was some defect in the battery and customers should get a new one.

Even. my understanding was the same. Say at least in the first 2 or 3 years of ownership, one should get a new one. Looks like everyone gives the refurbished but in the case of Tata, these numbers should be very high as we see so many complaints. Am sure the Judge would have taken note of this.

What are the chances of a new EV catching fire vs the one which has a refurbished battery?

Difficult to say but if everything is done taking all the steps that the factory has recommended, there should be none. I think up to very recently Tata EVs used to be hand-assembled.

Originally Posted by ferrarirules

Lets agree to disagree on the refurbished vs new battery capacity part.

I agree, it's difficult to blame a refurbished battery for causing an accident/ fire but as we have recently seen on another post, one person got his car hit by something as the battery died.

Most of the customers continue to give Tata another chance, thinking that the others had an exception and they won't face the same issues besides Tata keeps on bringing newer technology like the different type of batteries on Curvv, but I will say-

“Some Things Never Change. They just Become Different.”

[ferrarirules]

Originally Posted by Turbanator

as we have recently seen on another post, one person got his car hit by something as the battery died.

Can you please point out this post, I might have missed it and i cannot find it.

Most of the customers continue to give Tata another chance, thinking that the others had an exception and they won't face the same issues besides Tata keeps on bringing newer technology like the different type of batteries on Curvv, but I will say-

“Some Things Never Change. They just Become Different.”

I did an analysis of the team-bhp thread for Fire incidents (Accidents : Vehicles catching Fire in India) posted from 1-Jan-2023 to till date. Below are my findings -

Brands with cars reported

1. Maruti - 10 - Grand Vitara (Post#790,798,849x2,850), Fronx (Post#798), Wagon R (Post#810), Dzire Tour (Post#829), OMNI (Post#832), XL6 (Post#837)
2. Tata - 8 - Nexon ICE (Post#776,834), Harrier (Post#769), Punch (Post#772,797), Nexon EV (Post#774, 803, 855), Tiago (Post#807)
3. Kia - 4 - Seltos (Post#805, 806x2, 843)
4. Hyundai - 3 - Creta (Post#842), i20 (Post#836), Accent(Post#853)
5. Mahindra - 2 - XUV 700 (Post#785), E20 (Post#815)
6. Porsche - 1 - 911 (Post#784)
7. Toyota - 1 - Glanza (Post#802)
8. Volvo - 1 - C40 (Post#840)
9. BMW - 1 - 3GT? (Post#848)

Analysis

1. 31 car fire related posts were posted on the thread.
2. 10 Maruti cars were posted + 1 Toyota Glanza which is essentially a Maruti built car. 8 Tata cars were posted with 3 EVs
3. 5 fire incidents for Grand Vitara were posted. 4 for Seltos.
4. Out of all cars, 5 were for EVs and 26 were for ICE cars.

Nobody is questioning Maruti or Kia but everyone does question Tata and even Mahindra. Is it because Maruti, Kia come with the Japanese or Korean pedigree?

P.S. - Above analysis doesn't mean that Tata is exonerated for all the quality issues that they have. It just shows that there are problems elsewhere as well just the questioning is missing.

Finally on the Tata EV refund incident, my opinion is that the person was out of insurance and there was a third party injured as well. The best way to get money was to lodge a case and prove it was a manufacturing defect. The technicality of refurbished battery helped them win the case. It is good for us consumers, Tata will have to make sure that issues with batteries are resolved

[Turbanator]

Originally Posted by ferrarirules

Can you please point out this post, I might have missed it and i cannot find it.

I will try and share. It was somewhere, for sure.

Above analysis doesn't mean that Tata is exonerated for all the quality issues that they have.

The thing is that the human mind does not work or think in isolation. There are numerous threads with hands-on experiences, of members facing issues with Tata EV's, especially HV errors and these are not hearsay. So, no wonder Tata gets bashed more than say a Maruti.

The best way to get money was to lodge a case and prove it was a manufacturing defect. The technicality of refurbished battery helped them win the case.

Tata has not yet paid and I doubt they will. They will spend more money on lawyers in my opinion.

Anyway, I think you have a Tata EV and will have a better hands-on experience than most of non-Tata folks like me.