[vtires2018]

Originally Posted by techspark

OTR comes to 36L Mumbai registration.
I really liked the car but have zero confidence in the brand right now. It is very new and shelling out 36 big ones is a risk.
The salesperson told me they have 8 year warranty on battery, I want to know after 8 years if the battery goes off, how much do you think it will cost?
Will I get good resale value after 8 years?
I have a quote of 42L for audi a4 - i know it’s like comparing oranges to apples but I feel it’s better to spend 6l more and get the Audi?

-> You should go with whatever feels best for you, your driving comfort, budget, choices etc.

-> Regarding EV's - all EV's are new, but Tesla and BYD have the most experience, since their cars are running for more than 6 years at least.
BYD blade or any other LFP batteries definitely last more than 8 years, see youtube videos. But again nothing is sure, every product may have a defect in EV, similar to ICE vehicle.
In India, BYD e6 owners have shared their positive experiences so far with range and reliability, see youtube.

-> BYD has been in India since 2007, but who knows what is the future.

From BYD India website
BYD India was established in March 2007 in Chennai, India and set up an office in New Delhi. The Indian subsidiary has two factories, covering more than 140,000 sqm, with a cumulative investment of over $150 million USD. The business covers mobile components, solar panels, battery energy storage, electric buses, electric trucks, electric forklifts, chargers, rail transit, and more, also providing customers with product solutions and related after-sales services.
BYD has a large market share of e-buses commercially operating in India.

-> Some stats
https://cleantechnica.com/2023/01/03...es-globally-2/


Again, its your decision, go with what's best for you !

[Turbo Head]

I got the delivery of my BYD Atto 3, drove around 50 kms so far in sports mode with short burst of acceleration, still battery is 95% left. Going by stats the range ateast in city should be really good.

Infotainment system leaves a lot of things to be desired as lot of features including navigation and inbuilt SIM connectivity are still not active. Apple car is functional with wire though, so is Wifi with hotspot taken from mobile.
As per the dealership most of the functions will be available within next quarter or so.

Here are couple of pics from delivery.

[vtires2018]

Here BYD e6 owner had detailed what he saw with e6

https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/elect...ip-review.html (BYD E6 Electric MPV | Ownership Review)

Also research about battery chemistries here ->
https://batteryuniversity.com/articl...of-lithium-ion

https://batteryuniversity.com/articl...ased-batteries

personally I would prefer LFP batteries over NCM chemistry, since there is no nickel or cobalt in LFP, as well as higher charge cycles, safer than NCM.
But LFP is less dense than NCM, and that is its disadvantage.

[AtheK]

Test drove the car today, it’s a pretty well built car and has a decent road presence, the blue Color looks very nice too. I test drove in Bangalore traffic so was usually stuck in traffic, but did get a few open stretches and put the car in sports mode and the power delivery is fantastic. Loved the throttle response and how eager the car was to gain speed. The cabin also feels spacious and overall wife was happy in the rear seat. The sunroof also adds up to roominess feel and all the parts felt well put together.

The interiors might be hit and a miss depending on what you are looking for, I personally liked it and so did missus. It’s different from the usual single dimension approach taken by mainstream cars and for me personally it stood out. The gear lever which feels like the one you get in planes and adds to premium look of the car. I drove in day time so can’t comment on lights but hopefully are good. The ac worked well and cooled the car considerably fast.

The main speedo is very very small, while the ICE is so big, they should have given a bigger speedo also, it just looks too tiny with too much information. Missing rain sensors and ventilated seats are a sore point for a car that costs more then 36 lac rupees on road, BYD should have not skipped these features at this price point.

They should have ideally priced it close to Mg EV with maybe a premium of few lacs, at current price point it is tough to justify the purchase, and although I am ok to live with few missing features I am not happy spending so much for a relatively new brand in India.

We walked into adjoining MG showroom and hector at almost 9 lacs cheaper felt much more VFM, the 9 lacs saved will easily foot the bill for fuel and services for next 5 years plus no range anxiety. I think just like others I will wait for EV technology to become more mainstream.

In the meantime hopefully BYD can update the car with wireless android auto and airplay quickly. All in all a great car but let down by price and young age of company in India, looking forward for them to establish the brand and add some more cars to the portfolio.

The speedo just looks tiny and for a driver who will spend quite a bit of time looking at it, it is not a pretty sight.

[WRXXX]

Originally Posted by AtheK

They should have ideally priced it close to Mg EV with maybe a premium of few lacs, at current price point it is tough to justify the purchase, and although I am ok to live with few missing features I am not happy spending so much for a relatively new brand in India.

We walked into adjoining MG showroom and hector at almost 9 lacs cheaper felt much more VFM, the 9 lacs saved will easily foot the bill for fuel and services for next 5 years plus no range anxiety. I think just like others I will wait for EV technology to become more mainstream.

@AtheK If BYD were to manufacture the car like MG does and get the battery imported and assemble it here then the Atto 3 will be priced around 26-28L which is nearly the same price as zs EV with L2 ADAS included.

About your Hector observation, it is nothing new, I don't get swayed by floating sofas at the cost of lung space. Your 9L saved is being saved because no one is taxing you for the hospital bills that they might pay later after inhaling carcinogens in the city space. Future is about cleaner air, efficient transportation and renewable energy consumption. I am not saying we should have less fun, Atto 3 alone has showed you that. In fact BYD got their international model in CKD format and hence we have this price(just like Ioniq is 45L), CBU will make it unviable and local manufacturing will take time. Instead BYD might do what they are already good at, supply their batteries and drivetrain to companies like Suzuki and Toyota to mass market the technology at cheaper price. But both companies are sleeping beauties when it comes to EVs. In that way ZS ev is operating at the best price in this segment, but if I have the money to spare with long term ownership point of view will go with Atto 3, not Hector come on....

[AtheK]

Originally Posted by WRXXX

@AtheK If BYD were to manufacture the car like MG does and get the battery imported and assemble it here then the Atto 3 will be priced around 26-28L which is nearly the same price as zs EV with L2 ADAS included.

About your Hector observation, it is nothing new, I don't get swayed by floating sofas at the cost of lung space. Your 9L saved is being saved because no one is taxing you for the hospital bills that they might pay later after inhaling carcinogens in the city space. Future is about cleaner air, efficient transportation and renewable energy consumption. I am not saying we should have less fun, Atto 3 alone has showed you that. In fact BYD got their international model in CKD format and hence we have this price(just like Ioniq is 45L), CBU will make it unviable and local manufacturing will take time. Instead BYD might do what they are already good at, supply their batteries and drivetrain to companies like Suzuki and Toyota to mass market the technology at cheaper price. But both companies are sleeping beauties when it comes to EVs. In that way ZS ev is operating at the best price in this segment, but if I have the money to spare with long term ownership point of view will go with Atto 3, not Hector come on....

Thanks for your observations and also very relevant points. That said has any company come up with plans how they plan to dispose of such huge batteries when they come to End of life. E-Waste also is a potential hazard, and what about the Long range Anxiety, Though EV infra is improving really well, I am still not very comfortable waiting in a queue to charge my car for next 300 Kms while on a long drive. I might want to skip and hope that the next charger will have no one, but that is exactly what others will think and move on in search for next charger and thus increasing the range Anxiety even more, and it gets worse if you have a family and a small kid with you.

Now couple of them will be overthinking at my part but I would rather be in a space where in I can just get in a bunk and be out in few minutes. The fast charging infra needs to evolve more, EV as a primary car is a tough justification for today, heart might agree, mind does not. Once we have cars which can do upwards of 700 Kms a day, we will have more adoption as a primary car. I will rather invest in Hector + Tiago EV then just BYD as of today. That can be better 9 lacs invested, where city run abouts are mainly on Tiago and highway runs on Hector, but then that necessiates the requirement of two cars.

Also regarding the source of what charges your car "the electricity" this is what google throws at me.

In India, power is generated from conventional (Thermal, Nuclear & Hydro) and renewable sources (Wind, Solar, Biomass etc.). However, Major production of Electricity is achieved through coal a thermal power plant which is around 75% of the total power generation.

75% is through Coal + Additional headache of how manufactures will dispose such a huge battery in future is still a question that needs answering.

[WRXXX]

Originally Posted by AtheK

Thanks for your observations and also very relevant points. That said has any company come up with plans how they plan to dispose of such huge batteries when they come to End of life. E-Waste also is a potential hazard, and what about the Long range Anxiety, Though EV infra is improving really well, I am still not very comfortable waiting in a queue to charge my car for next 300 Kms while on a long drive. I might want to skip and hope that the next charger will have no one, but that is exactly what others will think and move on in search for next charger and thus increasing the range Anxiety even more, and it gets worse if you have a family and a small kid with you.

Now couple of them will be overthinking at my part but I would rather be in a space where in I can just get in a bunk and be out in few minutes. The fast charging infra needs to evolve more, EV as a primary car is a tough justification for today, heart might agree, mind does not. Once we have cars which can do upwards of 700 Kms a day, we will have more adoption as a primary car. I will rather invest in Hector + Tiago EV then just BYD as of today. That can be better 9 lacs invested, where city run abouts are mainly on Tiago and highway runs on Hector, but then that necessiates the requirement of two cars.

Also regarding the source of what charges your car "the electricity" this is what google throws at me.



75% is through Coal + Additional headache of how manufactures will dispose such a huge battery in future is still a question that needs answering.

I agree to most points above, yes, we as a country not yet ready for long distance EV travel, infact most of the countries are not ready. Even in the US only Teslas and their charging network enables them to take this chance.
As you rightly pointed out: Majority of us (can I say 90+%) do 90% City drives and occasional highway trips and even very rarely exploratory all India and Interstate trips, for majority public you will see that even a single EV like ZS or XUV400 will suffice, and for some it has to be two car strategy like you are mentioning and is worth it(I am one of those)!

About the Grid being dirty, that is a collective effort of the country to make it cleaner. I don't won't to go to that discussion here but it is clear that even then, electric is cleaner since producing Petrol/Diesel still requires power and then transported and you burn only 22% of the produced energy and cause emissions.

About Recycling : There are already companies(Redwood Materials, Li-Cycle for example) working on it and it is already a reality that 95+% can be recycled but wait, you will not arrive to recycling unless you are a heavy user like cabs or public transport, here is why.
BYD batteries known to serve nearly 10L km+ before you decide to say swap it with new, even when this happens it will serve another 10-15 years for secondary stationary power storage applications and when it fails here is when it arrives at recycling and there is an elaborate plan to re-use the materials already. Also, there is in the future plan on using V2L and V2H and V2G technology to supplement Grid, so the batteries even when used from secondary state are going to be used for solar and wind energy storage applications for even longer.

Even in case of non BYD batteries the battery when charged and used properly will easily last 3-5L kms according to my calculations(1700 charge cycle LFP for 200km). Also, the knowledge and know-how of batteries and their life is only getting better as the time is progressing. If one is not going to use the car for long time leaves it idle then EV is a bad choice, but as a commuter car and city only car even today it is a no brainer choice given the two car strategy can be executed. But for those who use mostly public transport and/or rental cars for long distance and private small city EVs make immediate sense. But yes, I agree that blindly buying large EVs are not the solution, but making the right choices for the intended use case is.

[sri_tesla]

Govt has increased the import tax (customs duty) on CBU (priced <$40,000) and SKD imports. BYD Atto 3 may now attract 35% customs duty instead of 30%. We may see a price increase unless BYD chooses to absorb the increase. BYD needs to start CKD assembling their EVs quickly like MG ZS and Hyundai Kona EVs.

[sheelRP]

Duty for EVs as CKD was reduced to 5% from 12 for ev like Kona I believe

[shyampsunder]

Originally Posted by sheelRP

Duty for EVs as CKD was reduced to 5% from 12 for ev like Kona I believe

Are you confusing GST with customs duty? Irrespective of whether car is made in India or CKD, GST for EVs is 5%.

[GoBabyGo]

Originally Posted by AtheK

The fast charging infra needs to evolve more, EV as a primary car is a tough justification for today, heart might agree, mind does not. Once we have cars which can do upwards of 700 Kms a day, we will have more adoption as a primary car.

Hello, although I am not in market for an EV, I did some calculations on possibility of driving an EV from Noida to Jammu (where I often travel) which is 650km one way. Today I have added another 250km just to get an idea if driving 900 km distance in EV is possible.

I would like to add that whenever I travel such long, I normally take a break every around 200km. In my last visit to Jammu in November 2022, I saw fast chargers in every motel / hotel / restaurant I stopped at. I feel that range issue is not so big, however, one has to make extra efforts for charging his / her car.

[AtheK]

Originally Posted by GoBabyGo

Hello, although I am not in market for an EV, I did some calculations on possibility of driving an EV from Noida to Jammu (where I often travel) which is 650km one way. Today I have added another 250km just to get an idea if driving 900 km distance in EV is possible.

I would like to add that whenever I travel such long, I normally take a break every around 200km. In my last visit to Jammu in November 2022, I saw fast chargers in every motel / hotel / restaurant I stopped at. I feel that range issue is not so big, however, one has to make extra efforts for charging his / her car.

Yes the infra is rapidly increasing which is great, what you missed in your calculation is that how long would you need to wait if all the chargers are already occupied. That proportionaly increases your travel time, or you just move on to the next charger hoping that it won't have too many people, and also adding to your range anxiety.

This obviously gets solved if all the places you want to reach have an option to prebook the slot, so that when you reach your slot is free and this works out as per your plan. I really at this point of my life am not interested to add so many complexities and permutations and combinations to a long distance travel. Hence I have cancelled the plan of buying an EV for now, maybe I will buy a small EV in next couple of years for my local run abouts, but for my long drives I will stick to my petrol car for next 4-5 years.

[GoBabyGo]

Originally Posted by AtheK

This obviously gets solved if all the places you want to reach have an option to prebook the slot, so that when you reach your slot is free and this works out as per your plan. I really at this point of my life am not interested to add so many complexities and permutations and combinations to a long distance travel. Hence I have cancelled the plan of buying an EV for now, maybe I will buy a small EV in next couple of years for my local run abouts, but for my long drives I will stick to my petrol car for next 4-5 years.

Hello, your observation is right, but as of now availability of charging points is more than sufficient and it is very easy to find a fast charger on our highways, hotels & big restaurants (in North India). I think mainstream EVs will come in market starting mid 2025, but by then govt may discontinue subsidies and I am very much hopeful that govt will introduce a different price slab (per unit charges) & electricity meter for charging EV at home (I hope I am proved wrong). In reality it is difficult to image the difficulties (or ease) of charging an EV unless one own it. To me it is not difficult to do long distance travel in EV, if one drive within major cities under 600 to 900 km a day (except remote places like Leh etc.)

[shyampsunder]

Originally Posted by AtheK

Yes the infra is rapidly increasing which is great, what you missed in your calculation is that how long would you need to wait if all the chargers are already occupied. That proportionaly increases your travel time, or you just move on to the next charger hoping that it won't have too many people, and also adding to your range anxiety.

It's not perfect and definitely adds a bit of friction but do keep in mind that all charger status is online, so you don't have to physically go there to find out that the charger is occupied. On long drives, we usually check if the charger is free before leaving the highway to reach the charging point. If it is occupied, we don't bother stopping there and move on to the next one.

On infra, according to me, it's much harder to install chargers when no one is doing long trips with them rather when there are many cars hogging a limited number of chargers. So we have got past the most difficult part of highway infra creation. The business case to expand is much more sound with reduced risk. So outside of certain peak holiday periods, I expect the DC charging infra to be more than sufficient with the increased number of EVs on the road.

The majority of my KMs are on highways and for me, the driving pleasure and economics of driving EVs outweigh the charging hassle. In fact, every time I charge up I feel I am living in the future and part of a wider community which gives me a lot of satisfaction but that's subjective and I don't expect everyone to share the same thought.

[volkman10]

BYD Atto 3 garners 2000+ bookings since launch, deliveries underway.

BYD Atto 3 deliveries underway.

First batch of over 340 units delivered in January.

Bookings were open from October 2022.

It has an ARAI-claimed range of 521km.

The first batch of the Atto 3, comprising over 340 units, was delivered in January. It has garnered over 2000 bookings since launch, however, order books opened back in October, so it’s likely that much more orders are pending delivery.

Link