[RahulNagaraj]

According to a new survey by Consumer Reports, the Tesla Model 3 and Nissan Leaf are among the most reliable electric vehicles occupying the second and third positions, respectively. Although the top slot is taken up by the Kia EV6, the report cannot yet determine if the EV will be able to match the proven track record of the Model 3 in the long term, since it's a relatively new product.



The survey is said to have collected data from hundreds of thousands of EV owners. The data also includes serious issues such as breakdowns & malfunctions. This history is then taken to predict the reliability of the model in the future. Reports also state that while the Kia EV6, Tesla Model 3 & Nissan Leaf are more reliable than other EVs, they still lag behind conventional ICE cars.



While EVs are theoretically expected to be more reliable than ICE-powered vehicles, the survey offers a contrasting result. As per the report, EV owners have reported multiple issues related to battery packs, charging, electric motors and heating & cooling systems. This is said to be because today's EVs are manufactured by companies that have traditionally been producing ICE cars and are now facing a learning curve when manufacturing EVs. Tesla & Nissan are among the few brands, that have been producing EVs for over a decade, giving them a clear advantage over their competitors.

Source: Consumer Reports

Link to Team-BHP news

[EV NXT]

This is the height of misleading information. Kia has obviously paid big bucks for this scam report.

Its only 2 months since the car was launched (Oct 4th) and within 2 months its declared the most reliable EV?

@ Kia, when you pull tricks on customers either go the whole hog and do it properly or don't do anything. No one is going to believe that a car can be adjudged the most reliable within 2 months of launch!

[the.dogfather]

Originally Posted by EV NXT

This is the height of misleading information. Kia has obviously paid big bucks for this scam report.

Its only 2 months since the car was launched (Oct 4th) and within 2 months its declared the most reliable EV?

This survey does not seem to be India specific considering it is comparing the EV6 with the Nissan Leaf, Hyundai Ioniq, and Tesla 3 which have not been launched in India. The EV6 was launched in UK in 2021, and even earlier in other parts of the world.

[supertinu]

I would take such surveys with a pinch of salt and understand how it was assessed. By volume its certain that Model3 would have sold multitude times more than EV6. So eventually from a DPPM standpoint how these numbers get normalized is the key and tough to get.

[Iyencar]

Originally Posted by EV NXT

This is the height of misleading information. Kia has obviously paid big bucks for this scam report.

Nope. This is a Consumer Reports finding. It is one of the most transparent organisations ever to exist on the consumer's side. They have been around for almost a century now and every single report they publish is backed by sound science and data collection methods. In the rare event they have been wrong, they have issued front page apologies and been upfront about it while retracting said articles.

Originally Posted by supertinu

I would take such surveys with a pinch of salt and understand how it was assessed.

The article is behind a paywall/login page. But they have always been very transparent about how they go about their surveys.
Link

[Thilak29]

Do we have enough sample space to arrive at such a conclusion?

Its sales run started not too long ago (even internationally), have they sold enough count to make comparative study?

[EV NXT]

Originally Posted by the.dogfather

This survey does not seem to be India specific considering it is comparing the EV6 with the Nissan Leaf, Hyundai Ioniq, and Tesla 3 which have not been launched in India. The EV6 was launched in UK in 2021, and even earlier in other parts of the world.

Originally Posted by Iyencar

Nope. This is a Consumer Reports finding. It is one of the most transparent organisations ever to exist on the consumer's side.

The Nissan Leaf has been around for around 11 years. The Tesla model 3 for 6 years. The EV 6 for little over 1 year. Reliability of a car cannot be ascertained over a period of little more than a year and compared with other cars that have been around for more than 5 years.

[Transmission]

Originally Posted by EV NXT

This is the height of misleading information. Kia has obviously paid big bucks for this scam report.

Its only 2 months since the car was launched (Oct 4th) and within 2 months its declared the most reliable EV?

@ Kia, when you pull tricks on customers either go the whole hog and do it properly or don't do anything. No one is going to believe that a car can be adjudged the most reliable within 2 months of launch!

Originally Posted by EV NXT

The Nissan Leaf has been around for around 11 years. The Tesla model 3 for 6 years. The EV 6 for little over 1 year. Reliability of a car cannot be ascertained over a period of little more than a year and compared with other cars that have been around for more than 5 years.

Seriously, you should look up who Consumer Reports is and what they do and their track record before jumping around with baseless accusations.

If you have evidence to back up your tall claims, please provide them.

[EV NXT]

Originally Posted by Transmission

Seriously, you should look up who Consumer Reports is and what they do and their track record before jumping around with baseless accusations.

If you have evidence to back up your tall claims, please provide them.

Anyone who has even a passing interest in automobiles knows about Consumer Reports.

The accuracy of any survey based organization is dependent on the quality of data and the premise of the survey. Your post indicates you do not understand the implications of either.

[Turbanator]

Originally Posted by Thilak29

Do we have enough sample space to arrive at such a conclusion?

Originally Posted by Transmission

Seriously, you should look up who Consumer Reports is and what they do and their track record before jumping around with baseless accusations.

This is what I could find from the forums; Deliveries started in Jan 22 for specific variants. So, in all fairness, how can we compare a less than Year old car with others that have been in the market for so many years?

https://www.kiaevforums.com/threads/...ge-4#post-8669

Originally Posted by EV NXT

The Nissan Leaf has been around for around 11 years. The Tesla model 3 for 6 years. The EV 6 for little over 1 year. Reliability of a car cannot be ascertained over a period of little more than a year and compared with other cars that have been around for more than 5 years.

Correct, not a fair comparison at all.

[Transmission]

Originally Posted by EV NXT

Anyone who has even a passing interest in automobiles knows about Consumer Reports.

If you make a claim - that Kia paid CR for favourable reviews you should - at the very least provide some evidence to that end. TeamBhp is a forum for serious discussions and not meme/hot takes so I suppose thats not an unfair expectation from the members here.

I do not know the exact survey questions that led to this report - but I sure wouldn't jump to far fetched conclusions like that based on their pedigree. CR's recommendations (and withdrawal of the same) for Tesla cars is long known - as you put it - to automobile enthusiasts. I wouldn't jump to claim that its a reflection of how much donations Tesla made to them. That'd be - put mildly - not a very intelligent thought process.

(When I wanted to buy a car I didn't even visit the Hyundai/Kia showrooms nor were they ever in consideration. And as for CR - the fact that their report is behind a paywall means that I dont know the whole story - and thats fine, because I am not vouching for this report being 100% accurate. I'm just pointing out how its silly to jump to conclusions that one can just buy a CR recommendation when there is no evidence to that end )

[EV NXT]

Originally Posted by Transmission

I am not vouching for this report being 100% accurate. I'm just pointing out how its silly to jump to conclusions that one can just buy a CR recommendation when there is no evidence to that end )

Just some of the many inaccuracies, controversies, suits against CR and damages paid by them because of erroneous reporting which goes to show they have a history in that area. While the catalyst for erroneous reporting may be many, the end result is the same - wrong information. And thats what has happened with the Kia EV6 report too.

Sharper Image Negative Review

In 2003, Sharper Image sued CR in California for product disparagement over negative reviews of its Ionic Breeze Quadra air purifier. CR moved for dismissal on October 31, 2003, and the case was dismissed in November 2004. The decision also awarded CR $525,000 in legal fees and costs.

Child Seat controversy

The February 2007 issue of Consumer Reports stated that only two of the child safety seats it tested for that issue passed the organization's side impact tests. The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, which subsequently retested the seats, found that all those seats passed the corresponding NHTSA tests at the speeds described in the magazine report. The CR article reported that the tests simulated the effects of collisions at 38.5*mph. However, the tests that were completed in fact simulated collisions at 70*mph. CR stated in a letter from its president Jim Guest to its subscribers that it would retest the seats. The article was removed from the CR website, and on January 18, 2007, the organization posted a note on its home page about the misleading tests. Subscribers were also sent a postcard apologizing for the error.

Pet Food error

In February 1998, the organization tested pet food and claimed that Iams dog food was nutritionally deficient. It later retracted the report claiming that there had been "a systemic error in the measurements of various minerals we tested – potassium, calcium and magnesium".

Bose libel suit:

In 1971, Bose Corporation sued Consumer Reports (CR) for libel after CR reported in a review that the sound from the system it reviewed "tended to wander about the room". The case eventually reached the United States Supreme Court, which affirmed in Bose Corp. v. Consumers Union of United States, Inc. that CR's statement was made without actual malice and therefore was not libelous.

Hybrid vehicles miscalculation

In 2006, Consumer Reports said six hybrid vehicles would probably not save owners money. The organization later discovered that it had miscalculated depreciation and released an update stating that four of the seven vehicles would save the buyers money if the vehicles were kept for five years (and received the federal tax credit for hybrid vehicles, which expired after each manufacturer sold 60,000 hybrid vehicles).

Isuzu Trooper Misreporting:

In December 1997, the Isuzu Trooper distributor in Puerto Rico sued CR, alleging that it had lost sales as a result of disparagement of the Trooper by the Consumers Union of the United States (CU). A trial court granted the motion for summary judgment by the CU, and the U.S. Court of Appeals for the First Circuit affirmed the favorable judgment.

Source: Various

[Transmission]

Originally Posted by EV NXT

Just some of the many inaccuracies, controversies, suits against CR and damages paid by them because of erroneous reporting which goes to show they have a history in that area. While the catalyst for erroneous reporting may be many, the end result is the same - wrong information. And thats what has happened with the Kia EV6 report too.



Source: Various

Error/incompetency (while being regrettable) is not the same as scam/fraud/bribing.

Originally Posted by EV NXT

... Kia has obviously paid big bucks for this scam report.

Emphasis mine.
Which one of those your quoted sources evidences any bribery ever being in the picture for CR?

(That's my last post in this rather pointless conversation - Have a good day!)

[EV NXT]

Originally Posted by Transmission

Error/incompetency (while being regrettable) is not the same as scam/fraud/bribing.

The end result is the same except in this it is far too silly to be dismissed as incompetence. And on top of that one requires proof?

Emphasis mine.
Which one of those your quoted sources evidences any bribery ever being in the picture for CR?

Bribery can be direct or indirect. Commercial partnerships represented by links to sites where their products may be purchased is far more suspicious than testing an item that has been freely submitted for their judgment. No one is going to openly admit and give proof of bribing.

This is what happens on automotive sites other than team bhp too. And unlike team bhp, CR has been caught out far too often for peddling wrong information. Still taking shelter under incompetence after all these years?