[ChristComesSoon]

The great electric car scam just got exposed by Ford | Redacted News

https://youtu.be/qBoud8azxT0?si=Hz3RzKQYtW0chpAz

[Jazzybala]

This sounds like propaganda to me, no citations are a big red flag.

[V.Narayan]

Originally Posted by ChristComesSoon

The great electric car scam just got exposed by Ford | Redacted News

https://Youtu.be/qBoud8azxT0?si=Hz3RzKQYtW0chpAz

This seems to be too specific to USA and that too at this narrow point in time. Also Redacted is a solidly anti-Democrats type of site and their glee is not surprising. And then USA is the home of trucks pretending to be cars and SUVs that weigh as much as a World War 2 armoured car. So no surprises that the faux machismo is lost while driving a quiet sophisticated EV. For the real story on EVs we should look to China the world's largest car market/car maker.

[ChristComesSoon]

Originally Posted by Jazzybala

This sounds like propaganda to me, no citations are a big red flag.

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

This seems to be too specific to USA and that too at this narrow point in time. Also Redacted is a solidly anti-Democrats type of site and their glee is not surprising. And then USA is the home of trucks pretending to be cars and SUVs that weigh as much as a World War 2 armoured car. So no surprises that the faux machismo is lost while driving a quiet sophisticated EV. For the real story on EVs we should look to China the world's largest car market/car maker.

I think the citations are right there in the video - they are not cooking this up.

Yes, in a way there is data that is being smudged from all sides - since there is a government mandate to subsidize EVs and there is all possibility that Automobile companies too have lobbying in the govt.

Never trust Chinese data at face value. It has "Govt" propaganda on everything it touches.

Redacted usually talks with data and they are willing to report where the data leads.

[Jazzybala]

Originally Posted by ChristComesSoon

I think the citations are right there in the video - they are not cooking this up.

Didn't see one datasource being mentioned in the whole video and there are no citations in the description as well.

[ChristComesSoon]

Originally Posted by Jazzybala

Didn't see one datasource being mentioned in the whole video and there are no citations in the description as well.

Strange. I see it though.

They are reporting based on what gets published and they talk about data points, one needs to independently check.

* They show the Ford newsroom website.
* They reference and show the consumer reports 2023 report.
* They reference a clip of CNBC clip of an interview
* They show "A letter to the President" from Source: 'EV Voice of the Customer'.
* They talk about the Ford lightning EV, marked down to $7000, and still no takers.
* They talk about no takers even after 20,000 $ discount through Govt. subsidies.
* They talk about Jeep EV strategy
* They talk about EPA rules from Govt. mandating 56% of vehicles to be EVs by 2032.
* They talk about 7.5 Billion $ spent for 8 EV charging stations.
* $40 to $80 for one electric charge at Costco.
* ...and more....


Most of these datapoints have screenshots. All of these are independently verifiable as well.

[locusjag]

So, if there's saltwater coming in contact with an EV's battery, it will then (too) go up in flames?

https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/...cane-114299652

https://www.facebook.com/reel/882683...40aB7S9Ucbxw6v

https://www.facebook.com/reel/116421...40aB7S9Ucbxw6v

Looks like a lot of houses have burned down during the recent hurricane in the US, thanks to EVs and hybrids that were parked in garages downstairs - check out the reel #2 above. Storm surge related sea water flooding inland is a thing in the US' coastal areas (especially the East coast).

[lemedico]

Whilst EVs look nice, different and have more comfortable vibration free cabins, I am yet to be convinced they do any environmentally pleasing stuff. I feel this post is slightly lateral to the topic but shouldn't we all be clear about paying more for a car who's ICE equivalent is always a good few lacs more affordable?

[07CR]

Originally Posted by lemedico

Whilst EVs look nice, different and have more comfortable vibration free cabins, I am yet to be convinced they do any environmentally pleasing stuff. I feel this post is slightly lateral to the topic but shouldn't we all be clear about paying more for a car who's ICE equivalent is always a good few lacs more affordable?

Good point, but even though its not 0 emission, its way more environment friendly than the ICE vehicles, considering the immediate pollutants being released by them. ICE vehicles would release pollutants while mining the fuel is being mined + at the tailpipe. EVs would emit pollutants only while being mined. Even when comparing the pollutants emitted while extracting fuel would be lesser for EV considering the fuel needed to run the batteries for X km is lesser than fuel needed for ICE vehicle to cover X kms.

That said, the EVs seem to have reached near price parity looking at the BE6E (Creta/Seltos rival in size and price) and XEV9E (Harrier/Hector rival) or the Windsor of MG. No longer one needs to pay a huge premium for being an early adopter.

[Elevate2024]

It looks like you are more inclined towards the option of using the EV as your primary vehicle.
The EVs are still evolving as the Mahindra options listed will not be available before March-25 and we also have Maruti launching its EVs in second half of 2025. It would be best to wait it out for another 6-8 months if you can, when Maruti products are also out in the market and there is some real world testing of the awesome looking Mahindra options, and there is always the possibility of further price drop of current EVs as was seen with Nexon during launch of Windsor.

[guptad42]

Originally Posted by lemedico

Whilst EVs look nice, different and have more comfortable vibration free cabins, I am yet to be convinced they do any environmentally pleasing stuff. I feel this post is slightly lateral to the topic but shouldn't we all be clear about paying more for a car who's ICE equivalent is always a good few lacs more affordable?

1. EVs are slightly better even with coal power. Even if the electricity comes from 100% coal fired power plant, the EV works out slightly better over the life of the car for total emissions. This is mainly because an ICE car's fuel tank to wheels efficiency is ~25%+. For most decent EVs, battery to wheels efficiency is >80%!

2. EVs are the only type of car that will get cleaner with age! Because the electricity grid you are charging from is adding more and more renewables and much less coal. By 2030, India's target is to be at 50% solar+wind+hydro power. Even if miss the target and hit 35-40%, it will make an enormous difference to power sector emissions in India, because our coal power plants are much dirtier than the global average. Indian coal power plants have not implemented Supreme Court directions to treat emissions.

3. EV emissions lifecycle analysis marketed to us has a fundamental flaw. The analysis assigns the full emissions profile of making batteries to the life of one car. This is false. After the battery's useful life is over, all the battery metals are still there in the same battery pack- they don't get "used up". Like steel and aluminium, battery metals are indefinitely recyclable - e.g. the recycled battery lithium is actually higher quality than the freshly mined and refined lithium! Unlike the petroleum that goes up in smoke every time we drive, and then we need fresh crude oil to be mined and refined for the next month's driving! Correcting for battery mineral recycling over just 4 car lives dramatically drops the lifecycle emissions of an EV. Very few people understand this today.

[SKC-auto]

Originally Posted by guptad42

[b]Very few people understand this today.

Very true, also some people wilfully stay ignorant, after all being "petrolhead" is cool.

Today 90% of lithium ion batteries are recycled for 95% of battery materials.

1st car 2024 100kwh battery pack created after mining.
2nd car 2034 95kwh battery created with recycled minerals from 1st car.
3rd car 2044 90kwh battery pack created with recycled minerals from 2nd car.
4th car 2054 85kwh battery pack created with recycled minerals from 3rd car.

As efficiency increases, all the 4 cars have similar mileage, the cars become more greener as the grid becomes greener.

I just gave 10years life in above example, it will have more life plus batteries can be used in grid storage.

[BlueGod]

I might be the best person to provide suggestion to you. My usage is 90% similar to yours. I had a Virtus 1.5 which was giving around 12 km per litre (combined highway + city). My travel frequency to Bangalore is similar to yours but the start will be from Coimbatore. I had flipped it for ZS EV Excite pro. The damage is 3.5 lakhs which I will recover in 2-3 years. The reason why I went for ZS is simple. Nexon EV 45 kw is a good car but felt like a big downgrade from Virtus. Curvv or BS 6E is relatively new and there might be some niggles. Even if I discount this the rear seat comfort was not good in Curvv if you check them back to back. From the first look BE 6E also might have this problem. My approach was to use Curvv as a bargaining point with MG and push for the price reduction. With the year end approaching you might get some juicy offers. Few missing points in this variant is lack of ventilated seats, electronic seat adjustment and electronic orvm closing. If you can live with these then go for it. People will keep waiting for newer models and meanwhile a tax increase might just push the prices way higher that the change won’t matter anymore. WRT to range anxiety my max running in any given day will be around 500 km. ZS can easily cover this just a single charging stop and some careful planning. You can still go for BE 06 or Curvv if rear seat comfort is not a concern.

Someone earlier commented about EVs not being clean, With a minimal 4 kw solar setup you can easily generate the electricity which you need for your use. The solar lasts for 25 years while your EV can last for 15 years with some range depreciation. Post that the battery can be used for secondary storage. It is very difficult to replace crude oil usage in heavy trucks or industrial purposes. EVs are removing this dependency up to some extent. If you don’t want to adapt it is fine but don’t discourage others.

[guptad42]

Originally Posted by SKC-auto

Very true, also some people wilfully stay ignorant, after all being "petrolhead" is cool.

Today 90% of lithium ion batteries are recycled for 95% of battery materials.

1st car 2024 100kwh battery pack created after mining.
2nd car 2034 95kwh battery created with recycled minerals from 1st car.
3rd car 2044 90kwh battery pack created with recycled minerals from 2nd car.
4th car 2054 85kwh battery pack created with recycled minerals from 3rd car.

As efficiency increases, all the 4 cars have similar mileage, the cars become more greener as the grid becomes greener.

I just gave 10years life in above example, it will have more life plus batteries can be used in grid storage.

Battery energy density has tripled in 14 years (2010 to now). If batteries continue to improve like this, it means for the same weight of battery materials, the 2044 battery capacity may be more than 300KWH!

Expecting an EV battery to last 15 years is now realistic. So, to put it another way, recycled materials from a 100KWH 2024 car battery can give birth to 3 new 100KWH car batteries by 2040 or so.

I suspect car makers will start selling new EVs with buyback clauses to get their hands back at that used EV battery.

[shankar.balan]

I am a relatively new user. Having bought a Kona last March.
My immediate observation is that I used to spend about 10K on Petrol driving my Thar Petrol AT for about 800kms. And now I spend about Rs 1500 or so driving the same distance in my Kona.
It is super silent and comfortable and offers me lots of jollies with its brisk acceleration and fantastic torque from the get go. I love my EV!
I still also own two other petrol cars and I love them too.
There is nothing to say that one cannot enjoy the pleasure and benefits of owning both ICE vehicles and EV’s. I’m a live example. And I AM a die hard car enthusiast and petrol head and diesel head. I will not discriminate.