[Jaggu]

Originally Posted by sagarpadaki

Curious to know how food and beverage are served before take off. Which airline is this?

Business class especially international travel this is normal. As in food and beverage to be served.

[rakesh_r]

Originally Posted by invidious

There was this guy sitting next to me before taking off on the Bkk-BOM sector a few years ago, with four glasses of whisky on the tray. Unless they ration the alcohol, this is a recipe for disaster.

That's the worst sector and a nightmare for the female crew. I used to frequently do BOM-BKK-BOM on official purpose and used to see people, especially Indians (especially ones that travel in a group) getting drunk to the core, talking loudly and creating a ruckus, used to feel pity on the crew. Sometimes have seen people passing lewd remarks on female crews.

[invidious]

Originally Posted by sagarpadaki

Curious to know how food and beverage are served before take off. Which airline is this?

Honestly I don't remember. But I think it is Jet Airways in 2017.

For those saying, yeah - I concur about the sector. Two of the worst sectors from/to BOM are BKK & DXB.

[V.Narayan]

Originally Posted by SuperGirl_Dad

I distinctly remember on an ATR 72 Indigo flight in 2019, many seats were empty on the back of the cabin and 6 people were asked by the Cabin crew to move to the back for balancing aircraft center of gravity. They said its instruction from the captain to make the passengers move. Is this a possible reason why captain has to be make this decision for seat changing? But ATR 72 is a turboprop small airplane compared to the B777. Would love to know more on this.

ATR72 is a small machine with a payload of between 7000 to 7400 kgs only. Assuming this aircraft was only two thirds full indicates a passenger payload of about 5000 kgs with baggage. So a single pax weighing an average of say 75 kgs is a significant fraction of 5000 kgs given that a 2% shift here or there is enough to warrant attention. What the Captain did in this case was a matter related to flight safety and not cabin service. In layman's words while flying you always want the centre of gravity and the centre of lift to be close to each other. In the ATR72 the centre of lift is at 1/4th the wing away from the airframe on both sides - it is also where the engines in this case are placed. The Captain in this case wanted to get the centre of gravity to the point where the wing passes through the airframe. Hope this helps.

[GeeTee TSI]

I am concerned how seriously our unempathetic legal system will treat this offence, with offender not of sound mind (or such verbiage thrown in by his lawyers) during the incident.

[sudeepg]

I feel very sorry for the victim. The perpetrator must be punished and put on a no-fly list forever. After all, if airlines can ban Kunal Kamra, this is a much more serious incident.

I am not too surprised this has happened with Air India. After all their owners have very poor customer service records, let alone handling a serious grievance like this. we have so many incidents of customers of this company running helter-skelter for purchasing products from them.

A long time ago, Tata launched a service called DoCoMo. Not sure how many may recall. Our company had purchased their devices in bulk and not one of them worked out of the box. Not only did they not work, but their customer service was also pathetic to the point that they did not address the issues for several weeks until the whole program was scrapped.

I have been a user of Tatasky in the past and my experience has been abysmal when a need to contact customer service had arisen. They are drowning under their own dysfunctional structures which don't allow staff at critical points to make decisions and address issues.

So, I hope this lady, who by the way appears to have expressed a lot of patience, gets justice and the perpetrator plus this airline is served an appropriate fine they will remember forever!

[aashishnb]

On a lighter note,

Better to pee in your pants and make a fool of yourself than pee on someone else and make a fool of yourself.

Altleast, you get to keep your job & stay out of jail. Can even blame it on some medical condition.

[PPS]

Originally Posted by no_fear

As per media reports, it seems that the captain is being blamed for not stepping up and allowing the distressed passenger to move her from business class to first class. Why is it the pilot's call? Isn't this something that the chief purser can decide? Surely a senior flight attendant can look up available seats and move the passenger. Is there a different protocol followed by AI?

Have been travelling by AI since more than 2 decades. From what I've observed its mostly the Captain's call! The Chief Purser has very little role to play as far as upgrades go. I have also personally seen family/relatives of pilots/crew accommodated in Business Class on an immediate basis!

[gopa99]

While folks commented here on flight safety and protocols defending a seat upgrade, I wonder what protocols apply for limiting or feeding someone's appetite to drink.
From what I have seen in 3 decades of flying, someone who is dressed well or the least dons a blazer can command more from the cabin crew!
Many folks might get unpredictable, violent and physical the moment they are in a high, wonder if that was a bigger safety risk than a seat upgrade.
The only hope many have of this episode is the regulators will start thinking in this direction and change protocols where they need to be changed! After all these protocols never dropped down from the skies, it was from collective thought, experience and decision making that helps better them.

[fhdowntheline]

Originally Posted by PPS

Have been travelling by AI since more than 2 decades. From what I've observed its mostly the Captain's call! The Chief Purser has very little role to play as far as upgrades go. I have also personally seen family/relatives of pilots/crew accommodated in Business Class on an immediate basis!

The pilot should have nothing to do with upgrading unless the upgrade involves an issue of safety to the plane or passengers. Why should the Chief Purser not take the call? This was such a small thing under the circumstances that no one would have bothered to question and even then, there was enough justification. What would be the issue? That the passenger would eat some extra Hors d'Ouevre or caviar? Or have some better brand of champagne?

[NiInJa]

When I was working for one of the big fours, most of the senior folks who would travel frequently to U.S or U.K would be excited for just one reason: Free alcohol on the plane!

Harsh truth, but some of us Indians just don't know when to stop when its free.

I guess the lesson to learn is very much clear: Don't offer more than two drinks on a flight. I can't imagine a drunk person fiddling with something on the aircraft or manhandling someone. It is as unpredictable a situation as it can get, so why give people an opportunity to create one?

While I feel a little bad that the man's identity has been revealed and is now going to be a meme template on social media, he should have spared a moment to think about today's world in general before taking those swigs and deciding to pass out on a plane.

And, a moment of silence for the way Air India handled the entire episode. This will be the first chapter in their staff training booklet

[docsr]

Seems to be "peeing in the air-on people season". I cannot even begin to imagine the trauma that the lady has gone through.
But there seems to be a previous incident - a pastor no less- peeing on a woman on an American Flight. Here's the link



The completely different nature of the response is telling! The lady filed a multimillion dollar lawsuit against the individual, his church and the airline. Are we Indians , as a people, given to take more abuse and not raise a stink?

Don't know how it actually ended (the report is form October 2020).

[akg7091]

In this incident, it's the PIC who has failed. The cabin crew have repeatedly said that the PIC refused to let the lady sit in first. Once the PIC has instructed the crew on any matter, the crew CANNOT do anything against his orders. The pilot needs to be derostered and this needs to be investigated further. The lady was obviously very distraught, considering her age and what had just happened to her, with no support coming forth from anyone.

I still remember how the AI crew went above and beyond for my wife a decade back. We were traveling non stop from NY to BOM and my wife vomited 3-4 times within 30 mins and went semi conscious. They made an announcement over the PA for any docs on board, gave immediate ORS etc and shifted her to an empty business class seat which they reclined to almost make a bed. They let me sit next to her when I told them I can't leave her alone ( ~6 hrs left for landing ). Upon landing there was an ambulance waiting on the runway itself, my wife and I were allowed by the customs and CISF to exit the building in the ambulance without doing customs / collecting luggage etc ( customs kept both our passports - an officer was there waiting with the ambulance ). The ambulance took us to a hospital next to the airport and the emergency staff there was ready. She was given fluids by IV and her situation improved in ~5 hrs post which I went to the airport again, showed the passport receipt at the entry gate and was taken straight to a senior customs and immigration officer. AI had collected our luggage and kept it in the customs office. The officer asked me if my wife is better now, took out both the passports ( my wife was not there with me - she was still in the hospital ), stamped both passports after asking me if I wanted to declare anything ( I joked with him I have nothing to declare and they anyways have all my luggage since 6 hours so they must have atleast screened it once lol )

The way the AI crew handled my situation that day might have been the difference between life and death. The entire machinery, AI and gov, worked together to save the life of a pax and Indian citizen. The system can and does work if there are good people with the intent to help. In the peegate though, the entire system failed. AI failed. DGCA failed. CISF failed. Fellow passengers failed. The crew failed miserably

[WhiteKnight]

Unfortunate incident. However I am not surprised that it was not de-escalated quickly. Often I find the airline staffs' training, in general, needs and upgrade. For example, imagine you flight is delayed. People start getting restless as time pass by. Have you noticed the typical response by airline staff manning the gate? "Sir, please calm down, everything is fine, there is just a slight delay". They often forget that in the entire history of escalated situation, no-one has ever calmed down just because someone told them so!

The staff need to learn to assess the situation and communicate the real state. Bad news is better to be told earlier than later. Recently we were told "everything is fine, there is just a slight delay" on domestic route BLR-HYD, and some passenger showed the ground staff that the flight has not even taken off from GOA. Imagine what happened next!

Air India is well known for lack of energy, right from their boarding process. Hope TATA can do something. Only time I flew with them international was Mumbai-Newark. They made me and my friends move up to the seat next to emergency exit, because senior citizens were seated there. I still wonder why they did not handle this during the allotment time. We were happy nevertheless, as we got unlimited leg space and freedom to stand up as we please. The icing on the cake was later. They served food immediately after take off and the staff disappeared momentarily. The steward who made us exchange the seat came to me in his pyjamas and said he is going to sleep. He requested me to find him and wake him up if the plain crash-lands!! I said "Yes, only if I am alive".

Originally Posted by Cyborg

Each and every retired employee irrespective of rank has been looked after medically by the company. They have been provided medical assistance for decades from normal monthly medication to all sorts of medical tests, dental work and even hospitalisation to operations. ct from many chemist shops which had a tie up with AI across Mumbai.

In my opinion AI deserves a 21 gun salute for the above. In fact to the credit of the Tata’s I believe this program is being currently re-structured and is going to continue in a new form. This is a work in progress.

Appreciate the empathy. However, one rule to remember is that you need to be excellent at your trade, if you wish to have the seat of respect. All other stuff you do is merely ornamental.

[anjan_c2007]

The age old, God gifted (read PSU gifted) secure feeling, laid back, hidebound and imbecile mindsets of a majority of its personnel still rules Air India. They still believe that the airline personnel are kings, not its customers. And once the world's best airline "Singapore Airlines", it's hard to believe is an Air India partner.

There is an American pop group "Arrested Development" (estd 1988) whose name fits such morons and cretins who ease publicly in such an ambiance. Arrested Development has won Grammys too in the 1990's and contrary to their name, the group members (one is no more) have much developed mindsets.

Till this secure feeling, laid back, hidebound and imbecile mindsets of its personnel in Air India reigns supreme, I would suggest all passengers whether in Business or Economy Class travelling by Air India to procure recyclable plastic, water proof sheets to fully cover themselves up when they are seated and are flying. These plastic sheets will act as a "Kavach" or protection shield from all such morons and cretins, who ease themselves publicly in such an ambiance.