[GTO]

Wow, learn something new everyday. Quite a lot of information in this TOI article for us aviation noobs.

An air toll: Airlines pay the civil aviation administration of the country they are flying over a certain fee based on the type of aircraft, the distance covered while overflying a country and the aircraft's all up weight (AUW) or gross weight, which is the weight of an aircraft before it takes off. In Pakistan's case, for a Boeing 737, the charges are $580 through its airspace — which will increase in case an Airbus 380 or Boeing 747 is flying over.

How expensive is India? The DGCA sets the overflight and landing charges in India, with domestic flights required pay less than international flights. The charges are calculated by multiplying the distance in nautical miles and the weight with a fixed charge component for airspace fees of Rs 5,330 if the flight lands in India. For those flights which are overflying, the charges are calculated on the basis of the route or the airspace fees, the distance and the weight, with an additional amount of Rs 5,080.

[SmartCat]

Busiest airline routes
(click on image for larger pic)



- Hardly any traffic over Latin American and African countries
- Traffic over India is quite dense primarily because of flights to Singapore, ASEAN countries and Australia

[V.Narayan]

Lovely to see more topics on aviation. The airways are roadways in more sense than most imagine. And they cost money to maintain. When flying, from the cockpit, in good weather you can see the aircraft ahead of you 5 nautical miles away ~9kms. Jet airliners flying above 29,000 feet maintain a vertical separation of 2000 feet and horizontal of 5 n.m. When you spot an aircraft coming from the opposite side a few KM's to your side the two of you pass by like a bullet. From the time you usually spot him visually to the time he whizzes by is barely two or three seconds. Sometimes, less often, you spot a Charlie trying to overtake you separated horizontally by a few km and 2000 feet above or below. And it takes forever for the overtaking to be done. And no you don't start accelerating to prevent him from overtaking you.

[AlphaKilo]

Very interesting aspect of tolls in air.
My stupid questions:
- when landing, the airline pays to DGCA/Airport but how is the payment made/billed for using the air route? For example, some airline which do not have an office or operate from a certain country but regularly over flies that particular country's airspace, how is the payment made? since the flight plan filing happens at the boarding/departure airport, how does the countries through whose airspace an airline flies receive the money?

- For countries like Afghanistan or Iraq where US Airforce has more or less complete control over the airspace, does over flying their airspace mean paying to US?

- How is the airspace usage over North korea regulated?

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

When flying, from the cockpit, in good weather you can see the aircraft ahead of you 5 nautical miles away ~9kms.

Just adding my bit, the fighter pilots are trained and taught to see even more. At this distance, they should be in a position to identify the Aircraft type!! (to identify Friend or Foe).

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

... And it takes forever for the overtaking to be done. And no you don't start accelerating to prevent him from overtaking you.

Does it really take long to overtake or just that we feel that the overtaking is taking so much time due to relative air speeds?

[saurabh2711]

Another information on same grounds for the Flight levels or altitude at which flights will use the available air space.

Eastbound flights maintain their elevation in odd thousands (5000, 7000, etc)
Westbound keep it to even thousands(4000, 6000, etc ). Source Wikipedia and NGC.

Please Refer to the below link for more details:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flight_level

[Jeroen]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

. Jet airliners flying above 29,000 feet maintain a vertical separation of 2000 feet and horizontal of 5 n.m. W.

To add, if they are flying in RVSM (Reduced Vertical Separation Minimum) airpace, they will be maintaining only 1000 feet vertical separation!

Not exactly sure what airspace is RVSM these days, but it is definitely the USA, Gulf of Mexico, large parts of the Atlantic Ocean. So let's say quite a few of the very dense airline routes!

Jeroen

[Mukund]

A related detailed video on the most valuable airspace in the world.

https://youtu.be/jdNDYBt9e_U

P.S: This youtube channel has many similar videos related to logistics of aviation.

[V.Narayan]

Originally Posted by AlphaKilo

does over flying their airspace mean paying to US?

Goes to the country.

Just adding my bit, the fighter pilots are trained and taught to see even more. At this distance, they should be in a position to identify the Aircraft type!! (to identify Friend or Foe).

Yes. Very very tough considering that warplanes are typically 3X to 5x smaller than a typical airliner I am referring to.

Does it really take long to overtake or just that we feel that the overtaking is taking so much time due to relative air speeds?

It could take a couple of minutes or more. You are doing say 450 knots (~835 kmph) and the chap overtaking you, ie another airliner is clocking say 480 knots (890 kmph). The difference is usually not more than a few tens of knots at best.

[shipnil]

Originally Posted by SmartCat

Busiest airline routes

I thought New Delhi, Mumbai are few of the busiest airports. But I hardly see any busy airline route touching any of these two cities.

How do countries keep track of airlines flying over it? Does every country's ATC is involved, however small the airspace be, when an aircraft is handed over from one ATC to another?

[Sutripta]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

From the time you usually spot him visually to the time he whizzes by is barely two or three seconds.

CCU - BLR early morning flight one would normally see another to the right and lower. Would certainly be visible for more than two or three seconds.

Regards
Sutripta

[AnInternetUser]

Originally Posted by AlphaKilo

Very interesting aspect of tolls in air.
When landing, the airline pays to DGCA/Airport but how is the payment made/billed for using the air route? For example, some airline which do not have an office or operate from a certain country but regularly over flies that particular country's airspace, how is the payment made? since the flight plan filing happens at the boarding/departure airport, how does the countries through whose airspace an airline flies receive the money?

I think I might be able to answer this question. I am no industry expert by any means, but I did intern in the Treasury Department of an airline which recently went down (no prizes for guessing which one )

Overflying charges are typically paid directly to the country by wire transfer/similar methods from what I saw. Depending on the arrangement, you would accrue overflying charges of a certain period and then pay it all at the end of that period.

There are several rules laid out related to overlying by the country/region and presumably IATA since these costs do affect how the airline does its accounting and cost control. From what I experienced as an intern, the finance and accounting part of aviation is quite unique and complex with even people working directly on these things having incomplete knowledge about it.

[ant_vas]

P.S: This Youtube channel has many similar videos related to logistics of aviation.

I am subscribed to this channel and they have quite a few informative videos about Airlines and the aviation industry in general.


There are quite a few YouTube channels like Captain Joe who pick one specific topic about airplanes and its operations and help understand it.

[Sutripta]

Pakistan has reopened it's airspace for India originating flights from today.

Regards
Sutripta

[theflyingguy]

Originally Posted by Sutripta

Pakistan has reopened it's airspace for India originating flights from today.

Regards
Sutripta

This was inevitable. I was surprised that it took so long. Pakistan earns handsome money from airspace usage and the closure was costing them millions. So financially they were not making any wise decision by closing airspace for so long.

And then with US sanctioning Iranian Airspace, Pakistan was almost forced to open its airspace. The closure of Iranian and Pakistani airspace had hiked the prices on European and US routes by around 18% due to excess fuel, additional crew payment for longer hours of flight, additional food and beverages etc. So political pressure on Pakistan would have been immense to open it's airspace which resulted in sudden withdrawal of hard stance and opening its airspace.

[Turbanator]

Originally Posted by Sutripta

Pakistan has reopened it's airspace for India originating flights from today.

Yes, they did. AI flights were being stopped in Europe for refuelling, now back Directly.