[Gannu_1]

Some more snaps courtesy Defence Minister's Twitter.

The Rafales escorted by two Sukhoi Su-30MKIs after giving it an aerial welcome when they entered the Indian airspace:



Chief of the Air Staff (second from left) with two of the pilots. The person in the center, a Group Captain was the commanding officer of this operation:

[Sutripta]

Originally Posted by Jeroen

I am generalising here: the world often mocks the French on all sorts of topics,

I think particular to the AngloAmerican world.

They build the largest/most powerful steam engines at the time.

I thought the Americans built the powerful steam engines. A function of the distances to be covered quickly.

They are one of the most experienced nations when it comes to nuclear/fusion technology.

You mean the ITER facility or something else?

Sutripta

[skanchan95]

Originally Posted by Gansan

And are the first batch pilots for Rafale selected from Mirage 2000 squadrons because of the compatibility?

Not necessarily, it is never that simple.

A pilot, during his flying career, gets posted to different squadrons and gets to fly different aircraft types. Atleast one of the pilots who ferried the Rafales from France was a MiG-27 pilot before he was posted out to France for training on the Rafales. The Rafale CO in 2008, as a Sqdn Ldr, was awarded the Shaurya Chakra for calmly landing his MiG-21 Bison after an engine malfunction.

Many would know that the first Mirage 2000 sqdn of the IAF was No.7 "Battle Axes". Before being re-raised on the Mirage 2000, the Battle Axes were a MiG-21M squadron. The squadron was for a short while number plated and its assets and some personnel were transferred to a brand new squadron - No. 51.

The crew who were to form the core of the "Digital Delta" Battle Axes were from different squadron types and some of them went to France to ferry the Mirage 2000s. The First Mirage CO - Wg Cdr Bhavnani was a MiG-21M pilot, the Flight commanders and other pilots were from MiG-23MF and MiG-21 sqdns and atleast one pilot from the MiG-25 Sqdn(No. 102).

So the aircraft background hardly matters when it comes to getting posted to fly a new aircraft type. May be a couple of years down the line, the Rafale pilots will get posted to other squadrons equipped with a different fighter.

[Jeroen]

Originally Posted by Sutripta

I think particular to the AngloAmerican world.

One could say the level of contempt for the French might have a certain regional aspect to it

Originally Posted by Sutripta

I thought the Americans built the powerful steam engines. A function of the distances to be covered quickly.

American train engines (locomotives) are notoriously slow and inefficient. A bit like their trucks. They appear impressive and huge, but it is all a bit crude.

Originally Posted by Sutripta

You mean the ITER facility or something else?

ITER although an international initiative is very much pushed and lead by the French. The French are one of the few nations that relies heavily on nuclear power and has been investing into it for decades. They are also one of the few nations that have both enrichment as well as reprocessing capabilities. Some other countries make use of these French services too.

There are probably more scientist and engineers involved in nuclear programs in France than in any other nation. In absolute and relative terms. Of course, no idea what they are doing, as they all speak French.

Jeroen

[PGA]

Received today through WhatsApp an interesting tit bit about an earlier ferry from France. Request SKanchan and Narayan Sir to validate.

The log-book of Gp Capt PVS Ram (retd) indicates they flew 12 stops including Karachi.

L-R in overalls:
Mukherjee, Suri, Moolgavkar, PVS Ram

[Foxbat]

Originally Posted by PGA

The log-book of Gp Capt PVS Ram (retd) indicates they flew 12 stops including Karachi.

Coincidentally they flew over Pakistan again 12 years later but this time not to land, just drop bombs.

[skanchan95]

Originally Posted by PGA

Received today through WhatsApp an interesting tit bit about an earlier ferry from France. Request SKanchan and Narayan Sir to validate.

The log-book of Gp Capt PVS Ram (retd) indicates they flew 12 stops including Karachi.

L-R in overalls:
Mukherjee, Suri, Moolgavkar, PVS Ram

Just imagine how fatigued the pilots must have been after such a long and time consuming ferry!!! Those days and before Pakistan joined SEATO and CENTO, they were not as hostile as they were from the early 1960s onwards. IAF planes ferry could land at Pakistani airports. Similarly, PAF aircraft could overfly India and possibly land at Indian airports on their ferry flight to East Pakistan.

The pilot marked as Mukherjee, isn't he Suranjan Das, the legendary test pilot? He certainly had a big connection with the Ouragans(named Toofani in the IAF). Apart from the airvraft6 that were ferried by air, a large number of Ouragans(in dismantled form) were ferried from France to India on a French ship(a WW2 aircraft carrier if I remember correctly) to Bombay. There is a picture of it in one of the books I have.

These Ouragans were unloaded and taken to an allotted Santa Cruz airfield, which was the home of the Aircraft Erection Unit - the first such venture by IAF. Then Sqdn Ldr Suranjan Das commanded this unit and proceeded to test fly and clear each aircraft after assembly.

[V.Narayan]

Originally Posted by PGA

Received today through WhatsApp an interesting tit bit about an earlier ferry from France. Request SKanchan and Narayan Sir to validate.

The log-book of Gp Capt PVS Ram (retd) indicates they flew 12 stops including Karachi.

L-R in overalls:
Mukherjee, Suri, Moolgavkar, PVS Ram

12 stages sounds about right. Allowing for head winds and reserves the Ouragan could fly a practical ferry of about 450nm at best. The persons in the photo are not the Subroto Mukherjee and the Suri is not Suranjan Das. Moolgavkar is the one who later became CAS in the late 1970s.

[balenoed_]

Can experts share the information on how the the airspace clearances are taken care from each country's ATC/administration that these aircraft's fly over during such trips like the one where Rafale was ferried..

For commercial aircraft's, there would be already a protocol in place, but how are these military/fighter aircraft's cross over each country. Will there be some diplomatic tie ups in place beforehand or the pilots just seek the approval as they fly across.

[locusjag]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

The Concorde, in my opinion will for the foreseeable future remain the first and last successful commercial supersonic airliner.

Originally Posted by locusjag

I've been following a startup called Boom that seeks to re-introduce supersonic passenger flights to our world. They had pre-sold 30 jets to Japan Airlines and to Virgin, at least as of March 2019. This had bagged them $200 million.

https://techcrunch.com/2019/05/22/bo...its-game-plan/

Other than partnering with supersonic flight startup Boom, Virgin are working on their own on a Mach 3 passenger flight concept apparently:

https://news.sky.com/story/virgin-ga...hours-12042007

The article also states that Lockheed Martin also have a supersonic passenger flight project going on apart from Boom and Virgin.

[V.Narayan]

HAL Dhruv Light Combat helicopter

This week 28 years ago on 20-08-1992 the Dhruv prototype flew for the first time. Today ~300 are in service plus another ~70 of its derivative the Rudra. While its navalized version did not take off {pun!} the Dhruv thus far has been the most successful aircraft designed and built in India.

As a 4.5 tonne chopper it was originally designed around the Rolls Royce - Honeywell CTS800 which turns around 1500 shp. Pokhran-II put an end to that. So the Turbomecca TM-333 rated at a lower ~1100 shp. This limited the Dhruv's abilities at extreme altitudes only found in this part of the world. The Dhruv Mk III with the Turbomecca HAL Shakti at ~1400 shp restores its intended performance.

My direct and extended experience with the civilian Dhruv rates it very well in flight characteristics, safety, nape of the earth flying, navigation and a wide flight envelope and ability to operate on a sustained basis in arduous weather.

I really wish we order 200 more Rudras and Dhruvs for the Army Aviation Corps. In the world of Indian aviation occasions to applaud come rarely. May the Dhruv and its derivatives serve long.

Photos of the Dhruv. Last 2 of the Rudra including my Rudra scale model.

All photos from Wikipedia.

[PGA]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

HAL Dhruv Light Combat helicopter

May the Dhruv and its derivatives serve long.

Sir you haven't included photo of Dhruv in IAF livery,

To me it epitomises success against major systemic adversity. Disinterest of IAF in the project was well known, accidents and incidents in India and abroad resulting from tail rotor vibrations almost killed the project in early/mid 2000s. And then the Army's global mega tender for replacement of Chetak/Cheetah crashed out and subsequently too none or maybe only one responded, it was then Army placed all its eggs in the HAL basket. I still remember hearing to some conviction filled arguments from HAL Rotary Wing Design Center guys taking up the challenge of sorting out the vibration issue, and they did it.

I have also heard people dealing with ALH WSI speaking very high of its capabilities.

May the wind remain above the disc of Dhruv all the times.

[Sutripta]

Can't find a proper thread for this.
https://www.wired.com/story/dogfight...hal-potential/

Too many qualifiers starting with bias of geeks dazzled with tech to simulation is not real life etc. but I found it interesting.

Sutripta

[ads11]

Originally Posted by Sutripta

Can't find a proper thread for this.
https://www.wired.com/story/dogfight...hal-potential/

Too many qualifiers starting with bias of geeks dazzled with tech to simulation is not real life etc. but I found it interesting.

Sutripta

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...ot-in-dogfight

Much better take on the issue from a pilot (so less of a tech news reporter bias if that helps)

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...-fighter-pilot
If anyone wants a primer I suggest the above is also a good place to start

[V.Narayan]

IAF's order for 2 more Phalcon AEW systems approved

https://www.livemint.com/news/india/...532284956.html
https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/indi...report-2287131

After dithering for 6 years the cabinet has cleared a $ 1 billion deal to acquire two more Israeli Phalcon AEW systems for the IAF. As readers of this thread know this is based on the IL-76 patform. The delivery will take ~2 years. It will add significantly to our current strength of 3 systems.

The IAF is also fast tracking the integration of the Brahmos to two squadrons of Su-30MKI. About time too. At a prototype level this had been tested but funds could not be found for full squadron testing & integration.