[skanchan95]

Originally Posted by Jeroen

I am not sure how forces handle the performance issues. Do they install new software when removing/adding the CFT? Maybe it is different for different fighters. It seems to work really well for the F16. Not so great on the F18.

Jeroen.

From what I read, the CFT project for the Super Hornet Block III was doomed right from the start and which was scrapped eventually. The stress of CFTs on the airframe during catapult launch and arrested Landing opened up maintenance issues that proved to be a headache during the Super Hornet Block 3 flight testing.

CFTs change the aerodynamics of the jet. They create a "bump" on the top of the aircraft which changes the way the air flows over the fuselage which, in turn, changes lift. The jets will fly differently especially at different speeds. The boundaries where the jet will go out of control would change, and how the jet would recover back flying may also change.

While I do not know if it requires software re-installation or a switch when CFTs are mounted or removed, it is reasonable to assume that some sort of software modification is done pre-flight for CFT equipped fighters.

[V.Narayan]

Originally Posted by fhdowntheline

@Jeroen this may be a bit OT, but I am not sure how much " hand flying" is done by civil pilots in course of their transition into modern jetliners.

A hand flown jetliner would normally translate to a more bumpy ride for the passengers than when the aircraft is on auto pilot. Military pilots do, do a lot of hand flying as that is the nature of their job. But military sorties, other than transport ones* are usually short - 20 minutes to 2 hours.

*and B-52 style of the USAF

[Gansan]

Any information about the SU 30 MKi crash at Nashik on 4th June? It has been totally eclipsed in the media by the election result fervor.

[Jeroen]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

A hand flown jetliner would normally translate to a more bumpy ride for the passengers than when the aircraft is on auto pilot.

Thanks, just to add. It is almost impossible to hand fly a commercial plane close to its ceiling. The higher you go, the more tricky its get as you get in the so called coffin corner. An area where even small control movements (or speed fluctuations) can cause the plane to stall. Not sure how this is handled by jet fighters. They certainly have coffin corners too. But perhaps due to design it is less of an issue? I know it is a subsonic phenomenon. And many fighters are capable of supersonic flight of course.

These days with ever decreasing vertical and horizontal separation between commercial planes, there is lots of airspace where autopilot is mandatory. A plot handflying does not have the constant precision that is required to maintain safe precision.

If your autopilot is out of order, you are not allowed to fly those routes!

Jeroen

[FlankerFury]

First flight of Tejas MkII confirmed for 2026.
Rollout is expected post August 2025, followed by IOC in 2029 with deliveries slated to commence from 2032.


3D render of Tejas MkII I picked up from a Google search

https://idrw.org/tejas-mkii-first-fl...rmed-for-2026/

[itwasntme]

Spotted yesterday at KIAL/VOBL:





Just now over BLR after taking off from Sulur AFB.





Deeply unusual booming & resonating engine sound. Nothing like I’ve heard before.

[ads11]

These are there for Tarang Shakti. See

Originally Posted by dragracer567

India's own Red Flag - the Tarang Shakti exercise

Interesting about the booming sound despite it being a turboprop. Had a C130 fly overhead recently and that was a very buzzy sound but not dissimilar to when I've heard things like ATRs.

[itwasntme]

Originally Posted by ads11

Interesting about the booming sound despite it being a turboprop.

Agree, and that too at the ~29k feet it was flying at.

By the way, I’m assuming the 332 tanker is probably still at KIAL next to the Menzies Bobba cargo terminal, unless it flew out with the ADS-B off or in encrypted military mode?

[FlankerFury]

Defence ministry to sign deal for 230 Sukhoi jet engines


https://economictimes.indiatimes.com...4.cms?from=mdr


The post said it will be produced by HAL. Are these engines built completely here or assembled from kits?

[V.Narayan]

Originally Posted by FlankerFury

Defence ministry to sign deal for 230 Sukhoi jet engines


https://economictimes.indiatimes.com...4.cms?from=mdr


The post said it will be produced by HAL. Are these engines built completely here or assembled from kits?

Assembled from kits.

Where engines and avionics go no selling nation be it Russia, France, Israel, UK or USA ever transfers technology in any meaningful way. The closest we came to getting to the manufacture from raw materials on engines was with the MiG-21's R-25 and R-11 programmes. And that too was not 100%. If this is something different I will be pleasantly surprised.

[SmartCat]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

The closest we came to getting to the manufacture from raw materials on engines was with the MiG-21's R-25 and R-11 programmes. And that too was not 100%. If this is something different I will be pleasantly surprised.

Article does say it will be "manufactured from raw material stage", with a "high degree of localization".
https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/.../112541992.cms

Rs. 21,000 cr for 230 engines equals Rs. 91 cr per engine equals $11 million per engine. So a pair of Su-30MKI engines costs $22 million? I think HAL is behaving like a private monopoly and charging excessively. It's operating profit margins have risen from 5% in 2013 to 32% levels in 2024:



This is unheard of in the manufacturing sector. When I look at the balance sheet, depreciation costs are surprisingly low. This implies that HAL is sub-contracting to other private players. So HAL is just an assembler/main contractor with 30% plus margins! They don't spend much on R&D either.

[dragracer567]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

If this is something different I will be pleasantly surprised.

Originally Posted by SmartCat

Article does say it will be "manufactured from raw material stage", with a "high degree of localization".
https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/.../112541992.cms

Out of curiosity, is there a difference between this deal and the deal to assemble GE F414s in India? I do understand how both of these are different from the other deal for co-developing jet engines with Safran for the AMCA Mk2.

[Jeroen]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

Assembled from kits.
.

Over the years I have had the pleasure of visiting several jet engine manufacturing plants in the USA and Europe.

Always hugely impressed by these jet engine factories.

In your opinion/thoughts what are the most crucial elements in jet engine design and subsequent manufacturing? I imagine metallurgy has a huge rule to play in (Research) Design and manufacturing?

But there must be other aspects too?

What aspects of design and manufacturing know hand need to be transferred or built up from scratch to be “self sufficient” so to speak as a nation?

Thanks
Jeroen

[SmartCat]

Originally Posted by Jeroen

I imagine metallurgy has a huge rule to play in (Research) Design and manufacturing?What aspects of design and manufacturing know hand need to be transferred or built up from scratch to be “self sufficient” so to speak as a nation?

Read sometime back that China is still not self-sufficient in jet engine technology because they haven't mastered manufacture of jet engine turbine blades yet. If China has not cracked it yet, obviously India will be far behind.

However, there is a Govt owned company called MIDHANI, that pops up in news occassionally about their purported breakthrough in manufacture of aerospace grade Titanium alloys, that is used to make jet engine components.

Indian Stateowned Midhani has made Titanium based super alloys for Amca Engine.
https://idrw.org/midhani-develops-cu...r-jet-program/

Midhani shares rise on reports of talks with P&W to supply engine parts
https://www.moneycontrol.com/news/bu...-12750739.html

[fhdowntheline]

On a side note- I recently went on a holiday to Goa a couple of weeks ago. And I was treated to a few beauties :

1) the Boeing Poseidon P8 taking off at Dabolim while we were at the gate, ready to board. That one looks mildly menacing, far cry from the suave and stylish commercial equivalent airframe.

2) the Mig-29K taking off with a thunderous roar, causing our A321 to mildly vibrate (or so I felt ) while holding short of the runway.
3) a couple Su-30 MKIs landing one after another, with drag chutes deployed, while we were walking back to the Pune terminal after disembarking from the airplane.

Not to mention the various retired aircraft at the Naval Aviation museum at Goa.