[Fuldagap]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

https://www.msn.com/en-in/news/in-de...a9e8292a&ei=37

Earlier this week, Prime Minister Narendra Modi and Prime Minister Pravind Jugnauth of Mauritius jointly inaugurated an airstrip and a jetty that India has built on Agaléga, a set of two islands in the western Indian Ocean. The existing airstrip on North Agaléga Island was suitable for the Indian Navy’s Dornier aircraft operations, but the upgraded airstrip will allow the Navy to also operate the larger P8I maritime reconnaissance aircraft. Basing aircraft on the island will require the construction of additional infrastructure, which comes with a full-fledged naval base. Operating from Agaléga, the Indian Navy’s long-range aircraft will be able to keep an eye on the western and southern Indian Ocean, and on the eastern and southern coast of Africa, significantly improving India’s maritime domain awareness in the region.

Mauritius and India go decades back as far as the domain of security is concerned. Historically, mostly an Indian citizen/officer has been the NSA of Mauritius.
Mauritius and Indian security relations are too deep. There is not much on the net but enough for the masses.
This arrangement seems another jewel in the crown.

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Anyone seen any update on the status of the elevators for the Vikrant?

On another note, seen discussions on twitter about the PLANs FC-31 after wire models of it were spotted on its existing PLAN STOBAR carriers. While it's likely the mock up is to help the PLAN with deck handling trials and such like, it'll be interesting to see if the PLAN fields them on the older carriers, all previous assumptions were that these jets would form the backbone of the PLAN air arm once Fujian and other CATOBAR carriers get commissioned. The FC-31 would sure be an upgrade of their Flanker based J-15s.

[travancore]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

Documentary on Shorts Sealand, Indian Naval Aviation's first aircraft

https://www.facebook.com/defenceavia...7802088773618/

An early clip on INS Garuda showing the Sealand.

The video seems to be unavaible to post. Try searching for Short Sealand Indian Navy on Google videos

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Off topic but had some footage come up recently of the PLANs Fujian out at sea on trials.

Not sure if embedded Instagram videos work but here's one link

And a youtube video from a Chinese broadcaster:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nuAzhmuzJqA

I read an interesting comment as to the Fujian's EMALS and how it differs from the system the USN fields on the Ford class. I'll copy the text below, obviously no citations available so take it with a grain of salt but it does make sense to use something available to them (the Chinese that is):

Back in 2017, the admiral in charge of the project (Ma Weiming) and his bureau’s published report gave us some of the system’s details: it takes medium-voltage (1.5kV DC) input, not 13.8kV AC like Ford’s, and that power then needs to be converted to 300Hz AC for use in the linear motor. We’ve also seen since construction that Fujian’s catapults are a lot longer - scaling off satellite photos place them at ~130m, whereas Ford’s are 91m - which suggests it has much lower power draw since it needs more time to deliver similar if not slightly lower acceleration.

... the power architecture details suggest Fujian’s system is actually based on maglev and linear induction motor technology China purchased from Germany and Japan in the early 2000s. 1500V DC is the power supply for a number of Chinese metro lines, and the older ones run Kawasaki-designed and locally-built rolling stock using then-new linear induction motors; it is also the operating voltage for the Shanghai Maglev Train, which was outright purchased from Siemens.

If true I won't lie, I find that resourceful engineering taking a system the Chinese are familiar with and implementing it on a carrier.

For those wanting still photos, there's more on this twitter thread.

The overhead shot indicates that the island is quite petite considering it seems the bulk of its volume is from the intake out-take stack. Must say its a clean looking ship now it's out at sea. Impressive work from the PLAN.

[Fuldagap]

Has anyone heard about what happened to the MQ-9B deal? Seems to have not been finalised yet. Though all publicity fruits have long ripened.

[dragracer567]

Base price for Indian Navy's Rafales has been frozen

According to The Print, India and France have agreed upon the base price of the Rafales. It seems the Navy has requested some India-specific changes including:

1. Software changes for air to sea mode
2. Changes to electromagnetic interference (EMI) and electromagnetic compatibility (EMC)
3. Certain software upgrades needed to enable the aircraft to land on an Indian carrier.

The total deal including these changes is expected to cost about €4 billion or ₹ 40,000 crore. This works out to about €153 million per aircraft - which seems fair given the infrastructure, changes like the Elbit helmet mounted display, training costs, low numbers, and the fact that the Indian Navy would be inducting these for the first time. This is about the same cost as what the Air Force paid but the Navy will be getting the more advanced F4 variant unlike the Air Force's F3R. Interesting to note that the Rafale will fly from both carriers - Vikramaditya & Vikrant, unsure about the whole elevator fiasco though.

There will be some commonality in servicing between the Navy and Air Force (thankfully) though it's beyond me that the Navy would spend on 4 two-seater trainers (out of the 26) that can't take off from carriers. Would've been more efficient to spend on the Single Seater Ms and use the Air Force's jets for training, unless the Air Force was unwilling to share given the limited numbers they operate.

Good thing that the Navy jumped the gun, though it was a necessity given they've to fill two carriers (not a good look to sail around empty carriers like the Brits). Anyway, seems like the MRFA is either in cold storage or fully abandoned with the focus being on indigenous Tejas Mk2 & AMCA - probably a good thing if they are executed on time. Even for the Navy, it's likely more Rafale's won't be ordered with focus on TEDBF. No pressure ADA!

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Like you say, better to avoid sailing empty carriers like the Brits (at least the USMC was able to use them to their own benefit - non starter for India).

But really baffling why 4 twin seaters are being bought - wasn't one of the purposes of the CDS to avoid such crossed purposes as the IAF and IN wasting taxpayer money by replicating the same utility. Just share the same set of trainer aircraft!
I'm assuming these land based trainers will only be operating from INS Hansa and it's mock-up ski jump?
Also why can't the twin seater Rafale operate off a carrier? Is it too heavy for STOBAR even without a combat loadout, just fuel? Or does Dassault not make a Rafale M in twin seat config?

I did a quick google on the MRFA and got this: https://www.newindianexpress.com/nat...-jets-in-india
Brilliant, a new clean sheet tender asking for full ToT. That'll do it. Why don't they ask for the Kohinoor back if they're going to persist in asking for things that just won't happen. It's just the same old cycle.

Has there even been any progress on the TEDBF? Given we're in the part of the cycle where the defence mandarins are reviving old favourites, why not announce a renewed push for the Naval Tejas? Let that simmer for a few years before remembering you pulled the plug on it in the first place and congratulate yourself for a job well done. It's just so disheartening.

Speaking of fiascos, I'm guessing that the new build Vikrant class will hopefully amend the issue with it's pint sized elevators.

[dragracer567]

Indian Navy bids fare to its UH-3H Seaking fleet

The Indian Navy has bid farewell to its UH-3H Seaking fleet after 17 years of service which according to the article will be replaced by the Sea King 42C. These were apparently bought along with the INS Jalashwa landing dock from the US - unsure if the helicopters are second-hand as well.

I'm always a bit confused about India's Sea King fleet. So, if I'm not mistaken there's the Westland Seaking fleet bought in the 70s (?) i.e the British version of the Sikorsky Sea King with ASW capabilities and the American one bought in 2007 which is being de-inducted now. So, we are replacing the American Sea Kings bought later with the British Sea Kings bought 3 decades earlier? Something doesn't make sense. Perhaps someone more knowledgable could correct and educate me on this.

Originally Posted by ads11

I'm assuming these land based trainers will only be operating from INS Hansa and it's mock-up ski jump?
Also why can't the twin seater Rafale operate off a carrier? Is it too heavy for STOBAR even without a combat loadout, just fuel? Or does Dassault not make a Rafale M in twin seat config?

Dassault just doesn't make a twin-seat version of the Rafale M. The ones bought by the Navy is basically just the Air Force's version with some changes due to being a newer variant. I assume it is because the French themselves only operate 40-50 Rafale Ms, so the economies of scale probably don't justify a bespoke naval version trainer version unlike the Super Hornet of which the US Navy operates around 550 (or about the same as the entire fighter jet fleet of the IAF). The Russians still made a trainer version of the Mig-29K though, so there's that!

Brilliant, a new clean sheet tender asking for full ToT. That'll do it. Why don't they ask for the Kohinoor back if they're going to persist in asking for things that just won't happen. It's just the same old cycle.

ToT in itself isn't crazy, given the number of units, 114 is more than what the French Air Force currently operates. Moreover given the hefty orders such as 80 for the UAE and 42 for Indonesia, having a new production line in India would probably help their cause in the international market, especially as it seems 4.5 gen fighters are here to stay for at least the next 2-3 decades. The issue is how fast they'll execute it, it's not implausible for this to drag on for another 2 decades by which time, more capable indigenous options will almost sure be available.

Has there even been any progress on the TEDBF? Given we're in the part of the cycle where the defence mandarins are reviving old favourites, why not announce a renewed push for the Naval Tejas? Let that simmer for a few years before remembering you pulled the plug on it in the first place and congratulate yourself for a job well done. It's just so disheartening.

I'm guessing the Naval Tejas is never happening. If it were, the Rafales wouldn't have been needed in the first place. On the TEDBF, I'm still wondering why we are building a bespoke Naval fighter when the international trend is to have a common platform for the land & naval forces like the F35s and Rafales.

[V.Narayan]

Originally Posted by dragracer567

Indian Navy bids fare to its UH-3H Seaking fleet

The Indian Navy has bid farewell to its UH-3H Seaking fleet after 17 years of service which according to the article will be replaced by the Sea King 42C. These were apparently bought along with the INS Jalashwa landing dock from the US - unsure if the helicopters are second-hand as well.

I'm always a bit confused about India's Sea King fleet. So, if I'm not mistaken there's the Westland Seaking fleet bought in the 70s (?) i.e the British version of the Sikorsky Sea King with ASW capabilities and the American one bought in 2007 which is being de-inducted now. So, we are replacing the American Sea Kings bought later with the British Sea Kings bought 3 decades earlier? Something doesn't make sense. Perhaps someone more knowledgeable could correct and educate me on this.

My knowledge is somewhat jaded and accurate data is hard to come by. But from what I recall {and I might be off the mark somewhat} the Westland Seakings in various marks were procured by the IN in phases from circa 1971 to mid-1990s. The UH-3H that came with INS Jalashwa were an organic component of that ship in USN service. Can't say for sure but they are probably of 1980 vintage or thereabouts so basically older than the surviving Westland Seakings in IN service currently. Hope this helps.

[skanchan95]

Originally Posted by dragracer567

Indian Navy bids fare to its UH-3H Seaking fleet


I'm always a bit confused about India's Sea King fleet. So, if I'm not mistaken there's the Westland Seaking fleet bought in the 70s (?) i.e the British version of the Sikorsky Sea King with ASW capabilities and the American one bought in 2007 which is being de-inducted now. So, we are replacing the American Sea Kings bought later with the British Sea Kings bought 3 decades earlier?

There were/are four major variants of the Brtiish built Westland Sea King in IN service - Mk.42, 42A, 42B and the assault Mk.42C.

In the late 1960s, the impending induction of French Daphne class submarines in the Pakistan Navy drove home the need for a dedicated anti-submarine helicopter. The torpedo carrying Chetak MATCH helicopters had limited capabilities as an ASW platform.

The IN sent a team to the UK in 1969 to evaluate the Westland Sea King variant fitted for the ASW role with a dunking SONAR, doppler navigation systems, search radar and range for other specialist ASW systems. The Sea King also carried sonobuoys and torpedoes or depth charges. The successful evaluation resulted int the first order for six Westland Sea King Mk.42 in 1970. The first Sea King Mk.42s arrived in Early 1971 to become a part of INAS 330 "Harpoons". The Sea Kings were based in Bombay and Diu to carry out round the clock patrols in the Arabian Sea.


Mk.42/42A

A second batch of Sea King Mk.42s were ordered and a second Sea King Squadron- INAS 336 "Flaming Arrows" was raised. In 1977, an order for three Westland Sea King Mk.42As - these were fitted withe a Canadian developed Recovery Assist Secure & Traverse(RAST) gear for deck haul down capability, permitting operation of these helicopters from small frigates at sea.

In the mid-1980s, an order for 12 Westland Sea King Mk.42Bs were placed where it beat the Super Puma in competition. The Mk.42B had updated ASW equipment powered by more powerful engines. More importantly, it was capable for carrying the long range BAe Sea Eagle anti-ship missile over the Mk.42/42A. The Mk.42Bs were commissioned in INAS 336 and it was the equivalent of Pakistan Navy's Sikorsky built Sea Kings that were capable of carrying AM.39 Exocet anti-ship missiles. Later a second Mk.42B squadron - INAS 339 Falcons was raised.

MK.42B carrying two Sea Eagle AShMs


Mk.42B as the launch & Platform for the indigenously developed Anti-ship missile

The Indian Navy also ordered the Westland Sea King Mk.42C "Commando" helicopters. The Mk.42C was the utility transport version with a nose mounted radar and were bought to support operations of the Indian Navy's elite Marine Commandos.


Mk.42C utility Commando variant(IN555) leading a Mk.42B (IN528) - notice the protrusion on the nose of the Mk.42C which contains nose mounted radar. The other Sea King variants did not have it and it was distinguishing feature of the Mk.42C

The Sikorsky UH-3Hs were acquired as part of a package deal with the INS Jalashwa (ex-USS Trenton) in the mid-2000s. These were ex-US Navy examples and the fact that they are going to be replaced with Mk.42Cs probably means that these UH-3Hs were very old - older than the Mk.42Bs and Mk.42Cs of the IN. The US Navy had completely stopped operating Sea Kings in the mid-2000s after having gradually replaced them withe Sikorsky Sea Hawk variants in different roles.


IN UH-3H


US Navy UH-3H