[Ace F355]

So, a couple of us local Delhi NCR BHPians have been indulging into weekend off-roading jaunts from past couple of months. The original idea to start doing this was

• Tremendous Fun : To enjoy an otherwise lazy morning with like-minded enthusiasts, explore and enjoy awesome untouched places (believe me there are a lot of them in this concrete Jungle called Delhi NCR).
• Understanding 4WD/AWD vehicles and their capabilities under various scenarios, without taking too much risk on your own.
• Understanding own driving capabilities/shortcoming and improve.
• Understanding proper use of equipment, 4WD driving and recovery techniques.

Since the group is grown consistently over the period of time, we have decided to put this thread up where other BHPians with 4x4's interested in joining us can also interact and get to know the timing/places of upcoming meets. This thread is intended to serve as a single point of contact for all 4x4 enthusiasts based in Delhi NCR to join currently attending BHPians on impromptu weekend off-roading fun events being organised at different locations in NCR.

So far the members attending the meets are:

• .anshuman – XUV AWD
• roy_libran – New Gen Scorpio 4WD
• rhandle – New Gen Ford Endeavour 3.2 AT / Force Gurkha / Maruti Gypsy
• mustysekhon – Maruti Gypsy
• Ace F355 – Toyota Fortuner
• nkapoor777 – Companion
• Rachit.K.Dogra - Companion
• Safari_Beast – Companion
• Phamilyman – Companion

Here is a brief report on past meet we had organized on past Saturday, Sept 24 2016.

We organised ourselves at our starting point at Gurgaon Faridabad road at 7 AM and started for our local 4WD playground in a convoy. Members included yours truly, .anshuman, roy_libran, rhandle, mustysekhon, nkapoor777 (arrived in his Fiat Linea and accompanied .anshuman) and Ankit (companion with rhandle). We tried various obstacles in our 4x4 area which included sandy driving tracks, steep sandy/rocky inclines and steep declines with deep ruts in the track. On other occasions we have also included other obstacles, depending upon weather (e.g. Slush pits in Monsoon, Water Crossings, rocky trails while exploring around Aravali jungles etc.).

This time, the new gen Endeavour was the newest entry in our meet and we all were eager to put it through off-road paces to have an idea of its off-roading capabilities. Kudos to rhandle who brought his < 1 month old Endy for this meet. We had loads of fun and spent close to 4 hours on the track, comparing the performance of various vehicles in above mentioned obstacles. Plenty of good fun indeed which is the whole point behind this sort of event at the end of the day.

A few pictures and videos from Saturday's meet are attached hereby for viewing pleasure, should give you guys a basic idea of our meeting.

If anyone else wants to join us for upcoming events, please reply on this thread and we will make sure to keep you guys posted for upcoming events.

Till then, adios!































Some Videos-

Obstacle 1:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WvSXipY_NzE

Obstacle 2:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BFkDNZ6a0HE

Obstacle 3:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5pDEiNIDyg

Obstacle 4:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EZhVr9-XjpI

Obstacle 5:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z47sEdxm69A

Endeavour only compilation:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_iEtIzTgHw

[sourabhzen]

I will definitely join next time if I am in town. Thanks for sharing!

[.anshuman]

Thanks for the initiative to create this much required thread Rohit! Offroad meets are fun, we start early in the morning usually on Saturday/Sunday and get back after Breakfast by around 10-11am, in winters we start at noon and get back by evening.

Saturday’s meet was huge fun because we had a variety of SUV’s and that also allowed us to have quick comparisons on the same trails.

Some notes on Videos posted in the first post by Rohit:

Video 1: Endeavour went down in high range, Rahul was trying out the hill descent without low range, the reason the descent is not as well controlled as either Fortuner or Scorpio. XUV has no low range, has to rely on either brakes or hill descent control. HDC does not work great in such rutty obstacles.

Video 2: Rutty incline. Everything is obvious, it’s a cross axle situation at multiple points and challenging for open differentials. This was easy for the Endeavour as it has the rear differential lock and TMS which uses active traction control. This particular Fortuner has the advantage of upgraded Ironman suspension, bounce is well controlled, articulation is increased and as result the tyres spend less time in air. Scorpio is let down by limited articulation, open differentials, bad weight distribution, bouncy suspension (as a result tyres spend a lot of time in air)…

Video 3: Is a badly dug up section with deep ruts. So was only attempted in higher GC vehicles Gypsy (it’s lifted) and Fortuner.

Video 4: XUV with the Race dynamics box makes a lot of power, 400nm, loves these sandy sections. Easy walk for Endeavour with the rear diff lock. Not so much for the Scorpio.

Video 5: Anupjit had dug this obstacle intentionally with his Gypsy in 2wd before we attempted, so it was a no go for Mahindra’s.

Other observations-

• What a co-incidence, all the cars had A/T tyres, Rohit (Ace) had shifted to Continental Cross Contact A/T last week only. Both the Mahindra cars were on Pirelli Scorpion ATR. Endeavour was on stock MRF Wanderer A/T, unfortunately not many choices in 18 inch for upgrade. Gypsy was on Yokohama Geolander A/T.
• I expected the Scorpio 4wd to be much more capable, it’s a big disappointment for roy_libran, he used to drive a Gurkha before this. I am disappointed to see this half-hearted attempt by Mahindra, it good neither on road nor off road.
• We plan to explore the capabilities of the Endeavour further once the honeymoon period is over. Post warranty Rahul has some interesting upgrades planned on the lines of his old Fortuner. Even in the stock form this car is worth every penny, excellent on road and excellent off road, just the perfect SUV.
• In Rohit’s Fortuner with the shift from M/T to A/T the performance in sand has improved by a big margin, the tyres do not dig the trails unnecessarily. Even the difference on road is huge, it no longer drives like a truck but like a SUV now. Up here in the North where we do not come across Mud frequently, M/T tyres make no sense for SUV’s, they are too big a compromise on road.
• XUV although the least capable off road here (or about as much as Scorpio), is a big surprise for who see it perform for the first time. It’s a monocoque crossover, with no low range, not designed as a off roader. But the engine packs a punch, more so after the tuning box(400+ NM), gathers momentum in no time. Is abuse friendly, this car has seen what not, still no damages to mention here, the plastic sump guard is the only weak link, though the sump is not at risk.

[Ace F355]

Originally Posted by sourabhzen

I will definitely join next time if I am in town. Thanks for sharing!

Thanks Saurabh, we will put on next meet dates here only, you can confirm your availability and we will take it up from there.

Originally Posted by .anshuman

In Rohit’s Fortuner with the shift from M/T to A/T the performance in sand has improved by a big margin, the tyres do not dig the trails unnecessarily. Even the difference on road is huge, it no longer drives like a truck but like a SUV now. Up here in the North where we do not come across Mud frequently, M/T tyres make no sense for SUV’s, they are too big a compromise on road.

Thanks for your expert observations, .anshuman.

Agree on MT tire usage, next to impossible to find slush/mud in our local areas, however these BigHorns MT are amazingly tough in other usage. I am keeping them for long distance trips into mountains etc (if we manage 1-2 trips in mountains with these, it will be full paisa-vasool for them ).

Agree with your observations on XUV too! Although I have to say you have been managing to do more obstacles with your soft-roader than most posers willing to try out with their more capable SUVs.

[Shivanshu]

Wow great to start this Ace, thank you so much. I would definitely like to join you guys, though I don't own a 4WD but I would like to learn from you all experts. Kindly let me know whenever you are having this meet next. thank you in advance,

[Rachit.K.Dogra]

Originally Posted by Ace F355

Thanks Saurabh, we will put on next meet dates here only, you can confirm your availability and we will take it up from there.


Thanks for your expert observations, .anshuman.

Awesome thread sir. This is serious jealousy inducing stuff. Even a very strong sedan guy like me is having second thoughts now.

Originally Posted by Shivanshu

Wow great to start this Ace, thank you so much. I would definitely like to join you guys, though I don't own a 4WD but I would like to learn from you all experts. Kindly let me know whenever you are having this meet next. thank you in advance,

Let me know brother, I know the coordinates. We can take your impulse and I can take my Karizma.

CHEERS

Rachit

[v&v]

Wow, This was a much needed thread.
Keep me in loop will join for the next outing. Have been to these area with Safari group.

[Ace F355]

Originally Posted by Shivanshu

Wow great to start this Ace, thank you so much. I would definitely like to join you guys, though I don't own a 4WD but I would like to learn from you all experts. Kindly let me know whenever you are having this meet next. thank you in advance,

Sure Shivanshu, we will keep you in loop for next time.

Originally Posted by v&v

Wow, This was a much needed thread.
Keep me in loop will join for the next outing. Have been to these area with Safari group.

Thank you Vinod sir. Will do. I hope your X1 is going strong, there are a couple of soft-roader trails which even X1 can enjoy!

[roy_libran]

Originally Posted by .anshuman

[*]I expected the Scorpio 4wd to be much more capable, it’s a big disappointment for roy_libran, he used to drive a Gurkha before this. I am disappointed to see this half-hearted attempt by Mahindra, it good neither on road nor off road.
[*]XUV although the least capable off road here (or about as much as Scorpio), is a big surprise for who see it perform for the first time. It’s a monocoque crossover, with no low range, not designed as a off roader. But the engine packs a punch, more so after the tuning box(400+ NM), gathers momentum in no time. Is abuse friendly, this car has seen what not, still no damages to mention here, the plastic sump guard is the only weak link, though the sump is not at risk.[/list]

See - "I told you so"

I knew I was making a compromise when picking up the new Scorpio 4WD, but had no inkling it was so bad! It does decently, when it comes to trail driving, jungle trails etc., but then one should really pick an XUV over the Scorpio, for such use-cases, given that On Road the XUV is so much better and safer.
I am just waiting for my lease to run out (in about 1.5 years).

[Dry Ice]

Originally Posted by roy_libran

See - "I told you so"

I knew I was making a compromise when picking up the new Scorpio 4WD, but had no inkling it was so bad! It does decently, when it comes to trail driving, jungle trails etc., but then one should really pick an XUV over the Scorpio, for such use-cases, given that On Road the XUV is so much better and safer.
I am just waiting for my lease to run out (in about 1.5 years).

Wow, this is news to me! I didn't realize it would be such a big disappointment. The kind of places 1100D's Marengo (http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/4x4-ve...kms-up-15.html) has been to, I was of the impression it is a capable enough occasional offroader.

Or is it disappointing in comparison to your earlier ride - The Gurkha?

[sourabhzen]

Originally Posted by roy_libran

....given that On Road the XUV is so much better and safer.
I am just waiting for my lease to run out (in about 1.5 years).

Is that the reason for not removing Gurkha from your vehicle list?

Originally Posted by Dry Ice

Or is it disappointing in comparison to your earlier ride - The Gurkha?

I guess if it is bad as compared to XUV then it is worse than Gurkha for sure, strictly speaking in terms of off road performance though.

[roy_libran]

Originally Posted by Dry Ice

Wow, this is news to me! I didn't realize it would be such a big disappointment. The kind of places 1100D's Marengo (http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/4x4-ve...kms-up-15.html) has been to, I was of the impression it is a capable enough occasional offroader.
Or is it disappointing in comparison to your earlier ride - The Gurkha?

As I said, it is ok for trail driving with mild to mediocre obstacles. I don't tend to compare the performance of the Scorpio with the Gurkha at all; but more with the likes of Safari Storme, XUV, stock Thar etc, and this is where it thoroughly disappoints.

Originally Posted by sourabhzen

Is that the reason for not removing Gurkha from your vehicle list?

An oversight! Will be corrected.

Originally Posted by sourabhzen

I guess if it is bad as compared to XUV then it is worse than Gurkha for sure, strictly speaking in terms of off road performance though.

Hmmmm, quite a sweeping statement. Are you sure of what you say there, because I personally think otherwise.



Adding on:
My preferences towards Off Roading have changed over the years, which means that I don't Off road any more, with that as an objective, rather, off road, when I need to, to reach a place, for some other activity. For this latter Use Case, the Scorpio suffices. It has been very rarely that I have been unable to go beyond a point, that I needed to. It is more to do with the confidence that the vehicle provides in tackling a terrain, without a vehicle to back you up; and the Scorpio needs a LOT OF BACKING UP.

[sourabhzen]

Originally Posted by roy_libran

Are you sure of what you say there, because I personally think otherwise..

Absolutely not. Just made the statement based on the videos and assumption that Gurkha is a better off roader. I stand corrected.

[Behemoth]

Hey Guys,
Great to see all you guys together again and at Offroading again! I still remember that time when we had gotten together for a Gurgaon Meet and went for a short offroading trip in Roy's Gurkha - It was great fun! Now would love to try out in Ace's new Tank! It really looks like a monster and I am sure it also performs like one. This is quite a change from your Svelte Civic to this monster!
I would have loved to join with my little Yeti (but that is almost sold now -handing it over to the new owner on Oct 2nd!) and now the classic head vs heart battle is going on for the new car.
Heart say Isuzu Dmax and head says Innova Crysta. If I do end up buying the Dmax Vcross, hope to join you on your Offroading meets! Though the Vcross is handicapped due to its huge length!
If I end up buying the Crysta, will have to join you in one of your capable rides!
Let's meet up soon again - let me know when you plan your next meet!
Ping me through TBHP (I am not on the whatsapp group, as there was too much sensitive stuff and my phone is always in my kids hands!)

[.anshuman]

Originally Posted by Dry Ice

Wow, this is news to me! I didn't realize it would be such a big disappointment. The kind of places 1100D's Marengo (http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/4x4-ve...kms-up-15.html) has been to, I was of the impression it is a capable enough occasional offroader.

This New Gen Scorpio and Morengo are a generation apart, and many things have changed, some for good, some for bad. Also Morengo has MLD, that solves the biggest problem that arises due to lack of articulation and open diffs. The Eaton MLD is not compatible with new Scorpio, so no upgrade option now.

Then Suspension in New Scorpio has been changed front and rear, no more torsion bar in front and rear has different axle and lesser travel and articulation(I believe, yet to compare both gens back to back) that has improved the on road dynamics but Off road performance has gone down.